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tmdgm

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    evasive maneuvering for F-15

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    tmdgm,

     

    "Notching" is short for using the "Look-Down Clutter Notch". This is caused by how a pulse-doppler radar works to get a look-down shoot-down capability - it has a "notch" in the software that it uses to filter out the ground - if you then move your aircraft such that you are lower than the enemy (or lower than the enemy missile, if it is an active) and move perpendicular to them, you'll have the same relative motion to/from the enemy as the ground under you, and his radar will filter you out as being part of the ground. With good training you can launch your missile, crank, and when the enemy counter-launches you can very quickly pop "into the notch" for just a few seconds and then turn back on the offensive. Active missiles -might- reaqcuire you, but then you just dip back into the notch real quick again or disengage to set up a new and advantageous position.

     

     

    so basically notching is just fly perpendicular to missile, dive below it (or plane if semi active)? If so, I think I'm already doing that. I do the barrel roll after when the missile is close. just doesn't seem like notching alone would do it.

    evasive maneuvering for F-15

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Corner speed is ~450 knots.

     

    This was FC1 btw, right?

     

    Oh, and yeah, barrel-rolling missiles is not the way to go. Notch them if possible and you'll be good and not have to rely on a hairy timed maneuver.

     

    Yup, FC1.

     

    I always thought barrel rolling when missile is close was the preferred method. What is "notching"?

     

    This is what I do as soon a I get a missile launch. Beam the missile and start diving. If the missile is far enough away, I start doing vertical S maneuvers, like a roller coaster. Then, when the missile is within 1.5 nm, I pull back on the stick and rudder over. This is where I get inconsistent response from the eagle. Sometimes she pulls back ok and feels responsive. Other times, it's like a 747 with speeds in the 450 range.

    evasive maneuvering for F-15

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    How high exactly are you when the performance is sluggish? The higher up you are the harder it will be to perform maneuvers due to the air being thinner, which means less air flowing around the wing to give you lift for rolls and climbs.

     

    I'm usually anywhere from sea lvl to 20k. Do I have the corner speed correct? Is there a maximum do not pull up into a loop altitude?

    evasive maneuvering for F-15

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Playing FC 1 and have always like the eagle. Haven't played in a while and coming back. However one thing I still struggle with is the evasive maneuvering in the F-15. When I f-pole an incoming missile, i try to pull back and barrel roll and the plane can sometimes be so unresponsive. It's like pulling back on an airline transport 747. Sluggish. I usually try to be at 400-450. I can see when I'm 350 or less or >500, but it can be very slow to respond. It seems inconsistent as well, sometimes at 450, it pulls back ok, other times ferget it. Seems worse at higher altitudes.

     

    is there something i'm missing? Maybe pulling back on the stick too hard? maybe need to be closer to 500?

    Dumb question Mig 29s quick start?

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Can you fly the Mig 29S in quick missions, i.e. when you launch the game, it's on the main menu? I'm mostly an eagle driver, but I could've sworn you could fly the Mig29S in quick start. I have a campaign and it works there. I haven't played lock on in a while. All other planes are there, but there is a clock in the final 8th square on the intro screen.

    what's the strategy for flying F-15 on line?

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Thanks for all the info. I guess I should be more specific. I was too frustrated. Note I'm asking about F-15.

     

    1) Radar - I notice the enemy jets turn them on or off alot. Should I be doing the same? Seems to give away position as maxum points out. How often to blink, when, any tactics?

    2) ECM - on or off? Seems like the russian jets don't fire till <10 anyway so it just seems to give away position.

    3) Which missile? As maxum points out, I though aim120 was best, but only recently have I started using the sparrow more because of the detection system on the russian birds, seems easier to avoid the amraam. But then again, I wasn't having much better luck with the sparrow.

    4) What altitude? the russian jets seem to dodge in and out of the mountains. At least that's what I'm thinking cuz I lose them on radar all the time. I think I know how to use the radar, put the cursor where his range is and adjust the bars on the left to bracket his altitude. Then poof, he's gone. Being in an F-15, do I want to do the same or go as high as I can? Sometimes if I go too high, they sneak under my radar and never even see it coming.

    5) Range to run? Is there a certain range I want to just high tail and get out of there? Since the russian birds/missiles are way better in short/med range.

    Last dogfight episode this Sat, season 2 on sale.

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Are they going to make a new season or are they done completely?

     

     

    Nope, they're done completely. They really screwed the viewers over for the second season. About 8 shows into season 2, they decided to cancel the show, however they already paid for the all but 3 final episodes, so they showed the paid for episodes only at 11 pm at night and never advertised them so nobody knew when they were on, unless you went to the dogfights website. The showings were scattered and far between.

     

    I wish I could tell you it wasn't because of the new twit they have for a vice president at the history channel, but....

    Optimum maneuvering speeds for missile evasion?

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Wow, thanks for all the info.

     

    Hi tmdgm

     

    If you end up in a situation where it is definitely too close for bleeding the missile energy, then something went wrong before, but, you are not dead yet.

     

    Not sure I understand this comment. If this is a 1v1, I would think this would be true, but all my missions end up merged at some point or another because you can't get all of them in bvr.

     

    Also, not sure I'm really looking to out turn the missile. I was more thinking, when I'm beam of the missile and low, right before it hits I pull back and barrel roll into it, but sometimes depending on speed (and altitude which I didn't know was modelled) the plane is sluggish and doesn't respond well and boom. This is even when I'm ~450-500 kts. Maybe as you said, the air density is killing me if I'm too high. Have to experiment again.

     

    Best speed to turn evasive is arround mach 0.9 ish. Any higher you wont turn, and slower youll bleed all speed to a crawl due to high angle of attack. There are many methods to evade, but the most essential thing is to stay away from the no escape zone, I.e. if the missile is still burning by the time it passes the clossest to you = bad. Either you get realy lucky or your hit. Outmanuevering missiles in these circunstances is pure hot-dogging. :D

     

    If you feel that the enemy is about to fire well inside the no escape zone, dump chaff and flares in regular short intervals before he launches (this is nº1 rule for me in merges), hit the deck and if possible return a shot, or get the hell out of a dodge if he passes outside your sights. PReventive countemeasure dumping makes most missiles blind at launch.

     

     

    0.9 mach, I'll try to remember that as well as the below 10.000 ft:

    =======

    15 : 400 KCAS<

    29/27 : 800 kph<

     

    Didn't know above 10 was bad for maneuvering.

     

    One thing, sounds like you don't get in this "no escape zone". So you never merge? Don't your wingmen get blasted and by the time you are bvr, it's 1v4 or something like that?

     

    Good advice on the countermeasures when that close. Thanks for the info.

    New Dogfights episode this week

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    What amazed me is the desert storm episode. Countless times I've cursed the aim 9 in lomac and cursed the designers on how useless it is. But they fired 3 or 4 aim 9's in that episode and they all went right for the countermeasures. I don't think there was a single aim 9 hit in the episode (although I'm sure there were in other contacts during the war). I felt like I was playing lomac again. Maybe the aim9 performance isn't as far off as I thought.

    Selecting multiple targets in TWS mode close together

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Zooming (in FC) doesn't really help but yes, you should really be in the lowest range setting possible to try and get some definition between the a/c in the flight. Bugging four fighters in a flight is pretty much impossible. It seems like it used to be easier.

     

    I made a TWS tutorial track but it only plays on version 1.11. It is available at Lockonfiles.com. http://www.lockonfiles.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=408#dl

     

    Ok, so zooming does mean just changing range? Whew.

    Selecting multiple targets in TWS mode close together

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    I'm assuming you know how to zoom in on the radar display- you gotta be quick. Hopefully you also have a joystick profile that is sensibly laid out so that you can easily use these controls- and not have to perform awkward hand movements to do simple things.

     

    Um, by zooming, you mean changing the range of the radar display from 10, 20 40 80 160 etc? If not, I'm gonna feel pretty dumb:doh:

    New Dogfights episode this week

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    For those who are interested, seems there are new episodes for the dogfights series on history channel. A new episode every night this week. Unfortunately, the time stinks at 11 pm EST. Who knows, the way history channel has ditched this series, anything can change, but as of right now, a new episode is scheduled for Monday night with one every night.

     

    http://www.history.com/minisite.do?content_type=Minisite_Episodes&content_type_id=52079&display_order=2&mini_id=51833

     

    If you're not interested in the series, please keep your comments to yourself so this doesn't turn into a political debate.

    Selecting multiple targets in TWS mode close together

    in Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 1 & 2

    Posted

    Is there an easier way to select multiple targets in TWS mode? I almost don't use tws because I select a target as primary, and then try to select the other members of the flight and I always end up switching to STT mode cuz I selected the primary again.

     

    Also, what's more frustrating is even in STT mode, when there are alot of jamming signals combined with a non jammed signal, I try to lock on the non jammed signal since he is usually closer and the highest threat, but if it's in the same 'plane' as a HOJ signal on the radar display, the radar locks the HOJ instead of the non jammed plane. I always have to turn my nose or something to get the non jammed plane off of the same 'plane' as the HOJ signal.

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