Heli Shed
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Posts posted by Heli Shed
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Tyger,
we were able to make Quax's mission load and not crash for clients by deleting all the service providers (AWACs, Tankers, etc).
Actually, I suspect the problem could be with tankers or things that are broadcasting TACAN.
So, in summary:
If you're having a mission that clients cannot join after mission start, first delete the tankers/AWACs/JTACs/etc. If that allows clients to join your mission after mission start, then go back to the mission version before you deleted the units. Try fiddling with tanker radio frequency, callsigns, and TACAN channel and channel types. See if that fixes the problem.
Thanks, but im still convinced this is a pre-load error. The appcrash lends me to believe that.
I will however, delete the tanker (just saving it as a difernt mission version number) and JTAC, which incidentally, is on both Phase 1 and 2 of Op Dynamo.
but.............................................the whole thing is SERIOUSLY broken if this is indeed the case.
just my tuppence, for those that want it.
Thanks Speed.
'T'
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IME - immortal works fine and certainly does in Op Dtnamo for full server.
Turning it 'off' as an AI Task however, does not.
'T'
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In my opinion, trying to find a workaround for a bug (or possibly and likely dozens of different bugs) w/o access to the source code and w/o being knowledgeable about this big heap of source code that DCSW probably is, is a futile endeavor. The chance of you actually finding a solution is as big as finding a needle in a haystack because of the thousands of different possibilities you have to cover.
As much as I know about software development, you can realistically only sit and wait for ED to fix the problem. Or try to be hired by them :smilewink:
Or..........................................................
Rely on experience with the internal scripting of DCS Modules, the sim's behaviour when it is 'normal', intimate knowledge of Mission Design, hell - the whole product and of course former knowledge of internal business as a tester, all topped off with the drive and desire for the good and benefit of the community as a whole, to find a workaround that lets people enjoy the sim as a passsionate hobby rather than a chore.
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Guys you are all chasing errors now.
the error is preloading and pre caching of graphics. stop trying to tear your missions apart looking for it, its all specualtion that leads to frustration a hammer and.................................
you get the point.
We wait for ED, right now, it's broke.
If neccessary add 'update 1.2.2.7286' at the end of the command line to revert.
I will be making everyone revert on Sunday to attend the workshop if it is not fixed by then.
Regards
'T'
'T'
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lalt and c
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I created a mission without FC3 planes and it seems to work. After that I added 2x F-15C and boom - crash! Could it be this is the problem and FC3 creates the crashes?
Interesting possibility. I think at this point I'm going to wait for direction from the Dev's. If they would like us to continue this error hunting (not exactly my fav passtime, but guns, babes, breasts, beer and plenty of cake are), I'd like them to chime up here and request as such and give some guidance or steerage (should such a word exisit, which i fear it does not!).
It would also gives us all a much needed confidence boost.
Regards
'T'
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Hi Tyger -
First - Thank you and your team for the many hours to investigate this.
I make many of the missions offered up at Eno's Firehouse. In your first post you wrote:
"Mission Designers should ensure that there servers are NOT forcing 'scenes' on clients; low medium or high. To be safe, LYNX has also had Civ Traffic removed from the Mission options too."
I have a question, or 2 -
As a mission designer I should not force Scenes and Civ Traffic - the checkboxes on the left of the Missions Options page should not be checked in the missions, right?
Or, did you mean that the Server Options -> Graphics should be set to Scenes = Low and Civ Traffic = Off?
It was your use of the word 'server's' that raised these questions.
Really do appreciate all your work!!
Wrecking Crew
Hi,
It's a good question.
The testing we have extensively done regarding the pre-load Appcrash error is negated by about 50%(edit update - 75%) (not completely) by the following actions:
In the mission options setting of the mission in the Mission Editor, ensure that the left box for scenes and civ traffic is 'not ticked' - addition: This setup is VERY ambiguous. Why have two lots of boxes? The boxes should be ticked if you WANT that option, but which side? left or right? Fact is, the left side means 'force this mission to NOT have the following) whilst the right side means 'Force this mission to HAVE it. So, Scenes and civ traffic should NOT be ticked, because to do so means that you would then have to select an option 'low med high' - hence my 'ambiguous' tag. However, if you do tick the left side, but dont select a scene level and exit out, when you come back in you will see that the ME will change the logic anyway, and untick the left side.
The 'pre-load' setting maxed out - trees and clutter too along with all settings to 'high' will enable that client (remembering that 'all' of our servers arn't - they're clients not ded server apps) server machine to 'deliver' all of them. Even if you have the 3D=false setting in your graphics.cfg and have limited the fps, the fact is that all of this will be preloaded and is available for output.
The main problem is when clients connect to the server and there settings mismatch the servers. So, maxing out the server 'should' negate the appcrash.
Thorough testing so far shows that it's almost exactly on 50% (edit update: 75%) chance that it won't crash in accordance and in relation to the amount of times it 'will' crash. - 50/50...............cant get more ambiguous than that - not definitive is it!
It's something though, and we have seen a difference for the better.
More importantly - it's steared the Dev's to look and address.
Regards
'T'
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You know the analogy with the 9 women?
;-) damn................busted!
:smilewink:
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Sorry that one snuck back on you Tyger... I understand the frustration. Tough running a server when all you can see is people dropping like flies to a connection problem instead of to engagements with the enemy.
Question about the preload issue though- it sounds like the devs actually decreased the preload size... makes me wonder if the server increases the preload size in one of the .lua if that would allow smoother operations for clients? Also, the added line: game_timeout=0 seems to have helped us with some of our issues.
where did you add the game timeout line Eno?
Sounds like the Dev's are onto something, but yes, in my opinion, this should be a priority. sort of......."everyone stop what they're doing!".
Nothing worse than having a fan and customer base being let down by a bug and a big one at that. Lets hope it's fast.
'T'
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http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=98319
check that thread.
probably the same. If it is, you'll just have to wait mate.
Regards
'T'
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bha...boring...
I hope ED will fix ASAP this, and others (someone G940?!), bug, meanwhile ED have to enlist you on their betatester team.
Thanks.....been there done that..................a lot of testing and little flying. Testers do a great job and are very committed. They make the game what it is, and all for free.
A variation on this bug fix though is to ensure that the server is configured to preload everything to the max in the options screen and that all settings are placed to high, to ensure that it has those loaded in memory for clients as they connect with their own personal desired settings.
So far, over the past 30 mins or so, this has indeed offered that little more stability.
ultimately, it's gotta be looked at and fixed by ED, but im positive were on the right path. It's a pre-load error.
Regards
'T'
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good god.
it's back!
0:00000000
E6F6A5CD 002CEDD0 0000:00000000 ??1Reader@Mail@@UEAA@XZ()+23D
E49D94A4 002CEE40 0000:00000000
E49D9551 002CEE90 0000:00000000
E49D38CE 002CEEC0 0000:00000000
E49FD273 002CEEF0 0000:00000000
E4A12CF3 002CEF20 0000:00000000
E4DE5295 002CEF50 0000:00000000 ?CameraIndependedPreload@SceneManager_Implement@@UEAAXXZ()+75
3FCD99EF 002CEF80 0000:00000000
E49D1365 002CEFB0 0000:00000000
E49FE7F7 002CF050 0000:00000000
E6F6A5CD 002CF090 0000:00000000 ??1Reader@Mail@@UEAA@XZ()+23D
and now....................................................
i do really give in.
Anyone else care to do a 36 hrs straight bug hunt on this?
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Dear Tyger I can not comply your findings, I have changed any of my missions and the server itself to unforce scene selection and the CDT on connecting an unpaused server still persists.
Will retry it without any SLMOD function. But dear, I don't accept to redesign any of my missions right only while ED has messed a new BUG in a new Vanillia.
Sorry who ever wants to play non linear mission like mine need to stay on the last version. Or maybe I'm going to use my resources and time to stick to an other product. I am not in the ability to understand why ED has tester which doesn't get this to work.
Regards
Your problem has nothing to do with this thread as i have clealy elluded too. You have errors. They are SLMod orientated. You have a complex mission with dynamic weather, more AI than you can shake a stick at, all dumped ontop of mission design system that we 'all' know is undergoing huge change in each patch, and 'YOU' think that it's ED's problem to get a tester to make 'YOUR' mission to work?
Take some time out to strip your own mission, layer by layer, and Identify those areas that may need a little tweak or rewrite.
To get back on track, and for everyone else, The fix works. Dont even think about hesitating on it.
'T'
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my english is bad.
What settings should I do in the Mapoption?
Your settings would make no difference right now.
Your error is not the same as this thread has the fix for. Your error is a SL Mod error and a 7570 mismatch.
Sorry mate.
'T'
PS: Go onto your server now and see the crash log or the do script errors to isolate.
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This is Quax mission!
dont matter what it is Scorpster. Fact is, it's not the same cause for the Appcrash as the one this thread refers to.
Regards
'T'
To add - the server crashes with your mission with a 'do_Script failure'. I would suggest waiting until 'speed' returns and then re-address. In the meantime, run a mission that is less complex.
'T'
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Lets turn everything off..... there.. all bugs are are gone. Im missing the 'cause and effect' story through. The question is: Is the mission scenery presetbug in this thread the cause or the effect? Ill go for option number two.
?
its the cause mate, but clealry something ED will address in the future.
Lets just get online again. thats a start isn't it?
Scorpi - your error is not the same appcrash. your crash log has these noticeable lines:
E69C5150 0027F5F0 0000:00000000 ?process_@ActionDispatcher@@AEAAXUActionEntry@@W4ActionOrigin@@I@Z()+60
E69C5386 0027F630 0000:00000000 ?dispatch@ActionDispatcher@@QEAAXAEBUActionEntry@@W4ActionOrigin@@I@Z()+16
E69C5666 0027F690 0000:00000000 ?feedToDispatcher_@ActionSource@@AEAAXAEBV?$vector@VNewInputAction@@V?$allocator@VNewInputAction@@@ed@@@ed@@@Z()+D6
E69C6335 0027F6F0 0000:00000000 ?processInput_@ActionSource@@AEAAXXZ()+75
Perhaps you will be better off rolling back afterall. im too tired to bughunt that one. good luck.
As for everyone else. happy days.
'T'
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=STP= Spare Time Pilots V
Please connect times.
scorpi i have just grabbed your mission and your 'enforce' or 'not' settings were not set.
checking now, but 100% confident on this.
'T'
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Crash persists :cry:
on which server? yours?
connect to the 74th.
You may keep getting this crash all the time you connect to a server that has not had it's mission re-edited.
I'm assuming that you have re-edited the mission and are aware that you will need to 're-point' the mission to its new settings in the saved version?
'T'
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@Tyger
Forcing scenes ? Me don't understand ;)
Nice work btw. :)
When the mission is designed, the designer can have an option to 'force' clients to 'high' 'medium' or 'low' scenes.
Why would a mission designer want to do this?
Well.....on LYNX and over at the 74th, we specialise in moving mud about the place - Air to ground engagements. As such when missions are designed, units are 'carefully' placed to utilise cover from fire and cover from view. Forcing the clients to use 'High' scenes means that you get to see the mission as the designer had intended it to be.
If the scenes were not forced, you could connect with your own settings on low, not see any trees at all and see the targets from the other side of the planet with little work being done to aquire them. That's sensible for sure, but not really 'realistic' on the caucasus region map. NEVADA this aint...........yet. ;-)
For VFS's that specialise in A2A engagements, they care not what the ground looks like (to be frank about it), and so more often than not, do not 'force' scenes.
a long way of explaining it all, and i hope that has filled some gaps.
Bottom line? 'YOU' have to do nothing. Those that have designed missions and run servers, need to take the steps mentioned to ensure 'their' clients don't appcrash.
The appcrash is being instigated clientside by the server.
Regards
'T'
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Dear Mods - any chance of making this a sticky or moving to community news etc? players are reverting to 7286 and there is no requirement too. This fix works 100%.
Regards
'T'
edited: Thank you Mods.
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Fellow Air Bruthas -STP-.
Please take a look at this post. It will solve your problem.
http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=1616591#post1616591
Regards
'T'
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Air Warriors all,
If you have been following this thread:
http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=98220
or this one:
http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=96879
or this one:
http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=98263
or any of the countelss sporadic and decentralised posts about the 'Appcrash' bug, you'll know by now that it has really hampered MP connection and enjoyment.
After all day testing today over at the 74th (hell you've all seen my posts and probably bored of em too!) and all evening right into 0448 hrs this morning, we're confident we have found the solution.
It is so simple, it beggers belief.
Take a hammer and.................................
No, i jest.
Mission Designers should ensure that there servers are NOT forcing 'scenes' on clients; low medium or high. To be safe, LYNX has also had Civ Traffic removed from the Mission options too and refuelling, AWACS and any JTAC's.
The result? steady as a rock. It seems the pre-caching was perhaps conflicting with each client.
Thanks to all those at the 74th and members of the community who helped me on this and of course to Mustang or gave me a little poke in the right direction.
awesome aint he! we should all have one of him!
Good luck.
'T'
PS: The 'clue' is perhaps this line in the crash log?????:
E413D273 0031EE00 0000:00000000
E4152CF3 0031EE30 0000:00000000
EA415295 0031EE60 0000:00000000 ?CameraIndependedPreload@SceneManager_Implement@@U EAAXXZ()+75
3FB299EF 0031EE90 0000:00000000
E4111365 0031EEC0 0000:00000000
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7570 AppCrash - a FIX!!!!!
in Multiplayer Issues
Posted
???? whats this got to do with it Scorpi?
I think the problem you have and everyone else has is completely different. You are using a third party mod ontop of a complex mission that is complex in itself - you will be chasing the error for months.
I'm talking a bout a bog standard mission, with ground targets, nothing fancy - slots.
Vanilla. more vanilla than bloody vanilla! ;-)
people get app crash - go figure.