We want KH-41 definitly modelled in BS?

[Ardillita]

The KH-41 air to sea missile is definitly very "ugly" modelled, it is time we have a decent lock and launch system (ground radar).

[GGTharos]

I think it's time to get rid of it ... since it was never operationally employed.

[Pilotasso]

The only way to get prettier AG big missile implementation, is to model multirole aircraft wich isnt donne yet. Consider the KH-41 as an ED LOPE loadout because it works just like that and we know that the missile isnt operational with the Su-33.

 

But what about the yakhont? I have never ever even tried to see if its ingame.

[GGTharos]

Well then, HRZ ... get to it!

[S77th-konkussion]

Does the Moliyna (check spelling) carry it?

[Ardillita]

The point is not if it has been used or not. The missile is developed, as far as everybody knows is "operational", and if it present in the sim, it is time to be modelled in the proper minimun way.

[GGTharos]

It was never operational on the Su-33, and I don't think it was ever gone past the proposal stage. The only Kh-41 I recall seeing a photo of was a mock-up.

 

What you really want is a MiG-29K with Kh-31's, I'd say :D

[Ardillita]

Yes, it can carry it, but a modefied version called 3M80 or SS-N-22 Sunburn, with reduced range.

[Ardillita]

It was never operational on the Su-33, and I don't think it was ever gone past the proposal stage. The only Kh-41 I recall seeing a photo of was a mock-up.

 

What you really want is a MiG-29K with Kh-31's, I'd say :D

 

Yes, that would be cool, but the point is the actual model... it almost a joke the way you have to set up the mission to get the launch, so that is why I say it must be fixed.

[Ardillita]

Actually, the missile is being carried by 956 ("Sovremenij") class destroyers, Admiral Chiabanenko (Udaloy II) class destroyers, R-5 ("Tarantul") class corvettes

[Alfa]

Does the Moliyna (check spelling) carry it?

 

Yes it does, so the 3M80E "Moskit" missile itself should not be removed :) .

 

However, it could just be removed from the Su-33(10 second job) and renamed from "Kh-41" to "P-270" which is the proper designation for the operational SSM variant.

 

- JJ.

[GGTharos]

Right! But not by Su-33's :) I don't think the Kh-41 and the missile carried by the ships are -exactly- the same. :)

[Pilotasso]

BTW the options of the poll are biased and Im left without one to vote. :S

[Ardillita]

It was never operational on the Su-33, and I don't think it was ever gone past the proposal stage. The only Kh-41 I recall seeing a photo of was a mock-up.

 

What you really want is a MiG-29K with Kh-31's, I'd say :D

 

You really are somehow funny... as far as I have seen in the hole forum, for you the hole russia must be a mock up... jajajajaja

 

You are somehow wrong in some of your asumpions... if all the russian arms are mock ups as most of times you say, then the hole cold war was a joke, why was america running into a war race if all that arms were mockups?

 

Think about it man...

 

And this missile was not a mockup: http://warfare.ru/?linkid=1687&catid=263&image=471

http://warfare.ru/?linkid=1687&catid=263&image=472

[S77th-konkussion]

As far as the Su33 is concerned it was a mock up. (Jajajajaja....)

[Solidburn]

I kinda miss the the old Flanker loadouts. Kh-31's, Kh-29's, Kh-35's, Kh-59's and the like. That gave more of the Multi-role capabilities that the 33 is supposed to be anyway....isn't it?

[Alfa]

Right! But not by Su-33's :) I don't think the Kh-41 and the missile carried by the ships are -exactly- the same. :)

 

There is only one 3M80E Moskit in service GG - and that's the SSM variant :) . Raduga did work on an airlaunched variant which, like you suggest, would have been quite different...for obvious reasons, but development of this ceased with the break-up of the Soviet Union.

 

The P-800 Yakhont(really a small version of the Granit) is almost the exact same dimensions and weight of the P-270 Moskit, but is much newer tech and has been made in an airlaunched variant(roughly half the weight of the SSM variant) - so if a monster ASM would be desired, the airlaunched Yakhont would be a more likely choice :) .

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[S77th-konkussion]

I think the SU33's role wasn't so multi, rather it was fleet defence. But I hear ya- and I use it for whatever I can. Great fun to bomb and rocket with. Anti ship ops are a hoot as long as you have enough 33's to actually score a hit..

[Alfa]

And this missile was not a mockup: http://warfare.ru/?linkid=1687&catid=263&image=471

http://warfare.ru/?linkid=1687&catid=263&image=472

 

Yes is was Ardillita :)

 

- JJ.

[Ardillita]

Well (taken from the above website):

 

"The air-launched version, officially called ASM-MMS and apparently also Kh-4, is intended specially for Su-27K (Su-33) carrier-based fighter aircraft. It was for the first time shown to the CIS leaders in February 1992 in Machulishche and then to the public in August 1992 at the Moscow Air Show in Zhukovskiy."

 

So, the missile is operational and YES it was prepared and developed to be used in the SU-.33, mock up or not, if it is a mock up, it is just because of practical issues, not because the missile is not operational.

[Alfa]

I think the SU33's role wasn't so multi, rather it was fleet defence.

 

Yes and I personally think it would be completely stupid to hang such a monster on the Su-33 - and there is something to indicate that the Russian navy thought so too :) .

 

But I hear ya- and I use it for whatever I can. Great fun to bomb and rocket with. Anti ship ops are a hoot as long as you have enough 33's to actually score a hit..

 

Yeah and I believe that was the reason for leaving it in for Lock-on - but it would still be a better solution to have an aircraft type that was designed for this purpose - carrying more practical types of ASMs such as Kh-35 or Kh-31A.......along the lines of what GG suggested earlier in this thread ;) .

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[Alfa]

Well (taken from the above website):

 

"The air-launched version, officially called ASM-MMS and apparently also Kh-4, is intended specially for Su-27K (Su-33) carrier-based fighter aircraft. It was for the first time shown to the CIS leaders in February 1992 in Machulishche and then to the public in August 1992 at the Moscow Air Show in Zhukovskiy."

 

So, the missile is operational and YES it was prepared and developed to be used in the SU-.33, mock up or not, if it is a mock up, it is just because of practical issues, not because the missile is not operational.

 

You are wrong Ardillita - the "ASM-MSS" or "Kh-41" airlaunched variant was proposed for the Su-33 and the Raduga design bureau started developing it, but the development was suspended - it didn't materialise into an operational weapon.

 

- JJ.

[Ardillita]

Forget about the SU-33. There are other russian aircrafts that can carry if Im not wrong, the su25/t may be???... so, we still have a bad model.

And again, the missile is wroking. If not, why is being exported to chine and other destinys??? US navy itself wanted to buy them to use them as practise targets (since they are bery very dangerous): ((from Flight International, 7-13 October, p. 8))

 

There has been opposition to the deal from the Russian ministry of defence, which previously vetoed attempts by the US Navy to buy the 3M80 for use as a target. About 300 of the 3M80 missiles are believed to be in storage, with the Russian military unable to pay for them. Raduga has called for export of the 3M80 to raise funding for development of improved versions of the weapon for future acquisition by Russian forces. "

[Alfa]

Forget about the SU-33. There are other russian aircrafts that can carry if Im not wrong, the su25/t may be???... so, we still have a bad model.

And again, the missile is wroking. If not, why is being exported to chine and other destinys??? US navy itself wanted to buy them to use them as practise targets (since they are bery very dangerous): ((from Flight International, 7-13 October, p. 8))

 

There has been opposition to the deal from the Russian ministry of defence, which previously vetoed attempts by the US Navy to buy the 3M80 for use as a target. About 300 of the 3M80 missiles are believed to be in storage, with the Russian military unable to pay for them. Raduga has called for export of the 3M80 to raise funding for development of improved versions of the weapon for future acquisition by Russian forces. "

 

Ardillita - please read my previous replies.

 

The 3M80E Moskit missile is operational in its SSM(Surface-to-Surface Missile) form under the name "P-270" - installed on Pr. 956A("Sovremenny class) destroyers, a single Pr. 1155.1 (Udaloy-II class) destroyer, Pr. 1242.1 (Tarantul III class) and Pr. 1239 (Bora class) missile boats.

 

ASMs and SSMs are different beasts - you cannot just hang an SSM on an aircraft - and in the case of the Moskit only an SSM variant is operational.

 

If not, why is being exported to chine and other destinys??? US navy itself wanted to buy them to use them as practise targets (since they are bery very dangerous): ((from Flight International, 7-13 October, p. 8))

 

Because China bought two Pr. 956E destroyers and more recently took delivery of an upgraded Pr. 956EM - all deploying that missile. The US Navy wanted to buy the Moskit missile to test the AEGIS system's ability to intercept supersonic SSMs.

 

- JJ.

[Ardillita]

That is not the information I found:

 

taken from www.thetruthseeker.co.uk:

The Sunburn (designation of the kh-41 air to ground version) missile has never seen use in combat but has been extensively field-tested by the Russians.

 

And here it says it is working (in the su27 and 30 chineese versions): http://usacac.army.mil/cac/milreview/spanish/SepOct04/lum.pdf