Ergonomic woes

[Pirimeister]

Hi all.

 

I’m posting this because I’m having a –literally- painful problem with my joystick stand and my chair and I really could use some help before I make some irreversible mistake.

Here’s my situation:

 

I have bought Wheel Stand Pro for Thrustmaster HOTAS WARTHOG Delux V2 and I’m pretty satisfied with it. The structure is rock solid, so much so that I can clearly see how bad a pilot I am.

It’s like a gravitational wave detector, only this one, after dropping all the extra interference, detects bad piloting skills. J I have it configured with the joystick in the middle position and here is one part of the problem.

 

You see, I also bought a gaming chair, to fit the JetSeat KW-908 Air, something that my previous chair couldn’t do, due to a low back rest. But the seat of this chair is immense and, due to the joystick stand coming against it, I have to stretch my arm some 7, 8 cm beyond the optimum position to hold the stick, as you can see from the pictures below . And that extra distance is giving me some nasty pain in the right upper arm and shoulder, even during short playing sessions. With the extension, it’s even a bit too high, which accentuates the distance problem.

 

 

https://www.dropbox.com/home/Public?preview=20170511_204526.jpg

 

https://www.dropbox.com/home/Public?preview=20170511_204714.jpg

 

Now, having lost all hope of finding a curved stand that is compatible with the Warthog and its base*, I’m thinking of buying the VPC joystick stand because, due to my specific circumstances, it’s a royal pain to store the joystick, if I just want to use the PC. If I leave it standing, I’m left too far away from the keyboard.

And because it has that 11cm extension, if I want to fold the stand to get it out of my way, I first have to drag the whole structure (which is pretty heavy) towards me from underneath the desk, then fold the stand, then slightly unfasten the small base plate where the joystick base sits, rotate it 90º so that when the stand is in the horizontal storage position, the joystick remains vertical and there’s no stress in the springs, AND THEN push the whole thing back under the desk (uff!), since I have nowhere else to store the whole structure. The VPC joystick stand, on the other hand, has a base that seems to allow to place it vertically on the ground, when not in use.

 

So the plan is to mount the VPC joystick stand with the Warthog in a center position, with an eye towards buying the Moonsoon base later on and using it with the whole 3 extensions set. Even with the single extension I have, the difference it makes when flying helos is almost night and day. And the same goes to WW2 aircraft. So arm pain or not, I’m sticking with a center mounted, extended Warthog. I can’t really fly with the stick on the right side (I’m already “not good” with it in a center position…), especially helos and I couldn’t go back to a un-extended Warthog.

 

I’ve come to conclusion that the best thing to do is to have the chair cut and re-upholstered , to shorten it and get me closer to the joystick. My indecision is if I should go for a single cut, from left to right, which will be cheaper to do and potentially solve me one problem - the right distance to the stick- but also create a new one by preventing me to push the extended stick back (due to the base, if mounted on the VPC stand being lower and the extended stand needing room to move), or if I should make a U-shaped cut, so I could fit the joystick but still have enough space for it to travel back and laterally. I would have to pay to get it done, and the only guy in my town that does it charges €18/h + materials, hence the pricing considerations.

 

So, to sum it up: What’s the best way to adjust a chair to an extended joystick, leaving enough space for the normal movement of that stick while remaining at a proper non-pain-inducing distance. I would really, really appreciate any input.

 

* that would be the Holy Grail for this quest of mine! Does such thing even exist? And if it does, is it at an affordable price?

 

Thanks in advance for taking the time to read this and for any suggestions you might have.

 

Cheers!

Paulo

Edited May 29, 2017 by Pirimeister

[JG14_Smil]

I know exactly what you mean about that arm pain from a center mount joystick what is too high. I had to re-design my center console twice to get it right. I would like a cut out seat, but I am able to fly with out any troubles. I should note I don't dogfight anymore and never need a maximum deflection of the joystick.

 

You can try speeding up the joystick input with the Saturation X parameter to see if it can help keep the stick away from the seat.

 

You have black X's for pictures.

 

Here is a picture of my old Ka-50 center mount and seat. My L-39 setup (same joystick) leans forward a bit more and is a bit taller.

 

 

Good luck with your build. Do not continue to fly with pain.

[Necroscope]

U-shaped cut or hole.

Looking at my chair - I make Huge hole in chair in approximately near the middle of my thigh (correct word?).

Tip: Unplug Handle from the base, add extender you going to use and then just sit and find correct position putting handle right on the chair. Main idea here - your forearm should be parallel to the ground, whole hand should rest freely and naturally(swinging at shoulder and resting on handle platform). Also you should have enough space to move handle at approx. 30 degrees angle to any side.

[Pirimeister]

Thank you for your reply.

 

Regarding the black x's for pictures, I'm fighting a losing battle trying to understand how to have them display properly. So far, I only managed to post them as links...

 

I have to admit that I'm not as much gung-ho regarding enduring the pain this causes me, just to keep using this set-up. I had to stop flying for a full week, just to have the pain go away. I guess I just don'y want to admite that I might have spent €100 euros on a chair that I can't really use. and I run the risk of feeling stupid after cutting the chair and having the extended stick still bump into it... grrrr.

 

 

 

I know exactly what you mean about that arm pain from a center mount joystick what is too high. I had to re-design my center console twice to get it right. I would like a cut out seat, but I am able to fly with out any troubles. I should note I don't dogfight anymore and never need a maximum deflection of the joystick.

 

You can try speeding up the joystick input with the Saturation X parameter to see if it can help keep the stick away from the seat.

 

You have black X's for pictures.

 

Here is a picture of my old Ka-50 center mount and seat. My L-39 setup (same joystick) leans forward a bit more and is a bit taller.

 

 

Good luck with your build. Do not continue to fly with pain.

[Pirimeister]

Thanks Necroscope! Those tips are really apreciated, believe me!

 

If it's not too much to ask, allowing 30º of movement inside that U-shaped hole meams more or less how much in cm? Just to get an aproximate idea.

 

 

U-shaped cut or hole.

Looking at my chair - I make Huge hole in chair in approximately near the middle of my thigh (correct word?).

Tip: Unplug Handle from the base, add extender you going to use and then just sit and find correct position putting handle right on the chair. Main idea here - your forearm should be parallel to the ground, whole hand should rest freely and naturally(swinging at shoulder and resting on handle platform). Also you should have enough space to move handle at approx. 30 degrees angle to any side.

[Necroscope]

Thanks Necroscope! Those tips are really apreciated, believe me!

 

If it's not too much to ask, allowing 30º of movement inside that U-shaped hole meams more or less how much in cm? Just to get an aproximate idea.

 

In my case - Hotas with 15cm extender bolted right under(almost inside cushion) the chair, I have 12cm hole.

Upper surface of chair is in 7cm from shiny plate on WH base.

I'm very bad in math, so that time I`ve take a loot of books, made some sort of chair with U-hole, put WH inside and then moving, adding and removing the books here and there find out exact locations of the joystick, hole size and required WH base height. Thankfully I was alone at home that time. :)

Edited May 29, 2017 by Necroscope

[Pirimeister]

:) That's seems like applied math to me! :)

Now I have a reference point to start going, thank you.

 

 

 

 

In my case - Hotas with 15cm extender bolted right under(almost inside cushion) the chair, I have 12cm hole.

Upper surface of chair is in 7cm from shiny plate on WH base.

I'm very bad in math, so that time I`ve take a loot of books, made some sort of chair with U-hole, put WH inside and then moving, adding and removing the books here and there find out exact locations of the joystick, hole size and required WH base height. Thankfully I was alone at home that time. :)