Proper AI use of RBS-15F?

[Lupson]

TLDR; Anyone able to get AI wingmen to fire RBS-15F from proper standoff distance, i.e. > 50 km?

 

Long version:

I'm trying to coordinate a number of AI-controlled AJS-37 4-ships striking a naval group of 10+ ships using the RBS-15F.

 

Basically - my issue is that I can't get neither wingmen nor other groups to fire their RBS-15F (AI) until either very close or not at all. When flyging myself, I can detect the enemy ships using radar, set BX points and successfully fire from about 70 km or so.

 

Anyone got any advice on how to set this up in the Mission Editor or if it's possible given the limitations on AI in DCS? I've fiddled around with the "Perform Task - Attack Group" and "Start Enroute Task" advanced waypoint options to no avail. When the AI engages it's usually once they have Line-of-Sight to the enemy ships.

 

I'm suspecting the AI perhaps needs to detect the enemies before being able to engage, and that the AI cannot use the AJS-37 radar for that. On the other hand, the docs for the "Attack Group" command explictly states that activation of such a command auto-detects the targeted unit.

 

Ideas, anyone?

[Lupson]

As additional info: I added 2 F/A-18s with Harpoons to the mission and they attacked the surface group at proper standoff distance, probably 80-100 km or so.

[Lupson]

Despite spending a lot of time on this problem over the weekend, I was unable to get AI flights to consistently fire RBS-15F at enemy ships, especially at any useful standoff distance. AI wingmen was even worse, refusing to fire at ships on direct "Flight -> Engage -> Engage Ships" even though close and with perfect visibility conditions.

 

My follow-up question in that case - is it possible in DCS to debug / log what AI planes are up to and why a wingman would refuse to "engage ships" for example? Perhaps a question better suited for the modders or mission editor sub-forums, though this particular problem seems to be AJS-37 related given that F/A-18s with Harpoons happily fires at maximum distance.

 

I'm considering whether it's possible to write a lua script that executes when an AJS-37 flight passes a waypoint (e.g. Advanced waypoint options, Set Command, execute http://wiki.hoggit.us/view/DCS_command_script , where the lua script basically would tell the unit to "if armed with RBS-15F, fire them at bearing NN (would need to be hard-coded or derived from next waypoint, known enemy group or similar) in mode 800005 (bearing attack).

 

Anyone knows if the above is possible using lua-scripts in the mission editor? Even better would be if Heatblur added a wingmen command "Engage current bearing using weapon ..." though that wouldn't fix AI controlled flights.

 

Anyone got some advice for me here? Would love to be able to make a coordinated anti-shipping strike involving many flights.

[Lupson]

After spending a ridiculous amount of time trying to figure this out using various settings in the mission editor, writing lua scripts dumping game state to dcs.log etc. I've come to the conclusion that the RBS-15 (AI) is bugged since AI flights engage correctly when armed with the normal RBS-15 (non-AI).

 

I'll file a more comprehensive report in the appropriate sub-forum.

[Swebeast]

*Making tea and sandwich, alone at home, sitting down by the computer* Ahh...now I have time to really, in depth, get the hang on how to make a mission with a group four-ship Viggen loaded with Rb15F. Hmm..lets Google how to do it. First search result...this....crap :/ If you find out Lupson, I'm all ears!

Cheers!

Swebeast

[Cobra847]

This has been reported to ED and we are hopeful for a fix :(

[fjacobsen]

Any news on this ?

[Leadnap]

Question - did you input the bx waypoints in ME or during flight?

 

For the AI groups if you input the bx points in the ME - that would "allow" them to fire at specified range. The AI might simply be waiting to identify the target prior to launch (because IRL you would want to make sure the mass of black dots on your radar was the actual target).

 

Also look at the other settings related to the groups mission - is their strike an Anti-Ship attack? the "master mode" of their mission might have the AI ignoring things like radar contacts until a different command requires them to pay attention, then its catchup time. Likewise what are the variables for the RB04/15 in the ME because the AI will probably do better with those input. Did you input an advanced waypoint command for the attack?

[fjacobsen]

Question - did you input the bx waypoints in ME or during flight?

 

For the AI groups if you input the bx points in the ME - that would "allow" them to fire at specified range. The AI might simply be waiting to identify the target prior to launch (because IRL you would want to make sure the mass of black dots on your radar was the actual target).

 

Also look at the other settings related to the groups mission - is their strike an Anti-Ship attack? the "master mode" of their mission might have the AI ignoring things like radar contacts until a different command requires them to pay attention, then its catchup time. Likewise what are the variables for the RB04/15 in the ME because the AI will probably do better with those input. Did you input an advanced waypoint command for the attack?

 

 

 

 

 

I have set all Bx waypoints in the ME, sa well as set an advanced waypoint for ship attack pointing to the ship group as well as set to use ASM (Anti ship missile).

 

 

The AI wingman has the AI version of the RB15F.

 

 

If anyone has managed to make a mission where the AI Wingman uses the RB15F, could You then post the mission file here ?

[Leadnap]

I have set all Bx waypoints in the ME, sa well as set an advanced waypoint for ship attack pointing to the ship group as well as set to use ASM (Anti ship missile).

 

 

The AI wingman has the AI version of the RB15F.

 

 

If anyone has managed to make a mission where the AI Wingman uses the RB15F, could You then post the mission file here ?

 

Huh. Well I will make a mission this weekend to test.

[fjacobsen]

So...

No one other than me having issues with this ?

[Leadnap]

I did some testing, couldn't get them to release either (actually two of the pilots decided to crash into the sea instead of launching). Will do more testing here...

[fjacobsen]

I just wonder...

In the latest changelog this is on the list:

 

+ Updated RB-15 for AI definition. AI will now use the missiles properly.

 

It would be nice to either have a mission where it works, or a description on how to setup a mission in the mission editor.

 

 

FinnJ

[fjacobsen]

Finally got it to work...

 

 

I made a mission with a 2 ship formation of AJS37 (Player & AI Wingman).

Player is equipped with 2 x "normal" RB15F, while the AI is equipped with 2 x AI RB15F.

 

 

Flightplan consist of 6 waypoints, where WPT3 is the attack waypoint (After mission start set Waypoint B3 to M3).

At mission start also set the RB15F is configured to 800002.

 

 

Target point M3 is some 70-80 km from the group of ships (Cargo and tankers). For this waypoint set additional waypoint options to Anti ship, attack group (the ship group) and weapon to "ASM".

 

 

When some 20 km from M3 order Your AI wingman to go trail.

At 5 km from M3 order Your wingman to "Engage..., Mission and rejoin" DO NOT USE "Engage...., Ships" !!

 

Setup Your own attack and fire the RB15F's.

 

 

Your wingman should now move in at launch too.