Real-world usage of modes other than TWS

[Gorn557]

Hello everyone:

 

I've been working diligently to learn my RIO skills over the last few months. I have a question that I want to phrase very carefully: are there any resources anywhere talking about situations in which real-world RIOs used modes other than TWS auto for specific amounts of time?

To be clear, I'm not asking why, in theory, one might use other modes- I understand there are certain situations where in principle one might use pulse search, RWS, etc. and how they differ. I also am not asking how in-game limitations of Jester might induce one to use other modes- I'm asking specifically about real-world usage. 

It seems to me that, given that TWS' range is the same as RWS, but that you can't hook targets or use AIM-54 from RWS, and since its range is much better than pulse search, that there are few real-world situations where you would as a RIO want to take on the extra workload of the non-TWS modes (assuming you're not in STT of course). The only situation I can think of is if you have a specific target that you know is being notched at that moment, but this situation would seem to be the exception rather than the norm. 

Anyone have any knowledge on this? Again I'll emphasize I'm thinking about real-world situations, not quirks which may be specific to DCS or Jester. 

[Ivandrov]

I understand you want real life examples, but I feel from your third paragraph there's a few things you aren't clear on about the shortcomings of TWS. These as far as I know translate to real life as well.

 

Other radar modes have a significant benefit of an expanded search zone. TWS is limited to either 2 bar 40 or 4 bar 20. Whereas my typical standard search pattern is 4 bar 40 in RWS and can go larger then that.

 

There's a significant difference between your ability to detect targets at closer ranges with the expanded search zone and it those cases the other modes are actually the lower workload since you don't have to do as much steering of the coverage area to find targets due to spotlighting.

 

I find TWS workload is higher then RWS when there are multiple targets that you don't want to shoot at in your radar sweep. You have to go through and set Do Not Attack, or mark as friendlies so that the WCS understands that it should not be firing on those targets, or you have to select your next target manually after each shot.

 

TWS has unreliable accuracy of the track file against manuevering targets. I've had it many times where the track file and radar return seperate which trashed my missile in TWS.

 

Also, if you have Datalink, your datalink symbols for aircraft are hookable in RWS.

 

There's more subtle stuff too. Like formations of planes showing up on the TID as less then the actual number or even sometimes only one track on the TID, despite seeing the seperate bricks on the DDD. (They probably don't show up as seperate bricks in the real jet in this case, but I don't know for sure) Making them impossible to separately target using the TID in TWS.

 

I pretty much switch between using all of them in my flights.

PD search to extend my radar range if I am looking for stuff past what RWS or TWS can handle.

RWS is my normal search mode. Followed by STT shots for single targets

TWS I usually specifically reserve for multi-shots, due to the shortcomings I mentioned before, especially the issue with tracks separating from radar contacts. However, sometimes lack of datalink means I need to be in TWS to hook targets.

Pulse, I use whenever I recognize that the aircraft I am looking for is within one of my filter regions and isn't detectable in pulse doppler modes because of that, especially over land where I can't turn off MLC. Or If I want to break out radar contacts on the DDD in range rather then closure without having to keep the IFF button pressed.

Edited July 15, 2024 by Ivandrov

[Gorn557]

14 hours ago, Ivandrov said:

I understand you want real life examples, but I feel from your third paragraph there's a few things you aren't clear on about the shortcomings of TWS. These as far as I know translate to real life as well.

 

Other radar modes have a significant benefit of an expanded search zone. TWS is limited to either 2 bar 40 or 4 bar 20. Whereas my typical standard search pattern is 4 bar 40 in RWS and can go larger then that.

 

There's a significant difference between your ability to detect targets at closer ranges with the expanded search zone and it those cases the other modes are actually the lower workload since you don't have to do as much steering of the coverage area to find targets due to spotlighting.

 

I find TWS workload is higher then RWS when there are multiple targets that you don't want to shoot at in your radar sweep. You have to go through and set Do Not Attack, or mark as friendlies so that the WCS understands that it should not be firing on those targets, or you have to select your next target manually after each shot.

 

TWS has unreliable accuracy of the track file against manuevering targets. I've had it many times where the track file and radar return seperate which trashed my missile in TWS.

 

Also, if you have Datalink, your datalink symbols for aircraft are hookable in RWS.

 

There's more subtle stuff too. Like formations of planes showing up on the TID as less then the actual number or even sometimes only one track on the TID, despite seeing the seperate bricks on the DDD. (They probably don't show up as seperate bricks in the real jet in this case, but I don't know for sure) Making them impossible to separately target using the TID in TWS.

 

I pretty much switch between using all of them in my flights.

PD search to extend my radar range if I am looking for stuff past what RWS or TWS can handle.

RWS is my normal search mode. Followed by STT shots for single targets

TWS I usually specifically reserve for multi-shots, due to the shortcomings I mentioned before, especially the issue with tracks separating from radar contacts. However, sometimes lack of datalink means I need to be in TWS to hook targets.

Pulse, I use whenever I recognize that the aircraft I am looking for is within one of my filter regions and isn't detectable in pulse doppler modes because of that, especially over land where I can't turn off MLC. Or If I want to break out radar contacts on the DDD in range rather then closure without having to keep the IFF button pressed.

 

This is actually extraordinarily useful, thank you! Most content I see is on how the system functions rather than real-world tactical tips like this. Any other advice or good sources for this kind of information?

[3000 Black Jets of Allah]

On 7/16/2024 at 5:51 AM, Gorn557 said:

This is actually extraordinarily useful, thank you! Most content I see is on how the system functions rather than real-world tactical tips like this. Any other advice or good sources for this kind of information?

To add some visual details to the comment by Ivandrov because it covers it all perfectly, here's a diagram from FlyandWire showing the relative scan volumes of the radar at 25nm, with the green being the TWS modes, and the gray zone being 8B 130°. As you can see, the amount of space that TWS covers in both sizes is absolutely tiny compared to a maxed out 8 bar 130° RWS scan.

null

Edited July 20, 2024 by 3000 Black Jets of Allah
changed image to working one

[The_Tau]

I only use TWS when i know exactly where bandit is. At ranges 20nm and less, where i have no idea where bandit is I always use RWS with higher scan volume, and at 10nm i turn cold, avoiding merge.