Been a while since I built a PC ... any advice?

[Stretch]

So with the impending release of DCS: Warthog and the IRS giving me a nice refund check, I figure it's time to throw out my 4-year-old box and build or buy a new gaming PC. It's been about 10 years since I've built a PC and I have really no idea what's in and what's hot. I'm OK with investing a lot of money on this box (but not a ridiculous amount) and build something to last me more than a few years.

 

Ideally this would be a very fast box but the g/f (who is already iffy on the price) would really much appreciate a quiet box so she can sleep. (My current video card is noisy as all hell.) Here's what I've come up with so far:

 

Chipset: i7. I'm thinking 960, as the 970/980 are six cores and everyone says don't waste your money on the two extra cores. The 970/980 are called "Extreme Edition" -- are they actually any faster than the 960, other than just having two more cores?

 

Mobo: X58 -- no idea about the relative benefits between EVGA, Asus, etc.

 

Memory: 6GB, as I think most games would be hard-pressed to use more than 6, right?

 

Cooling: Not sure if liquid cooling is any quieter or worth the price. Thinking of just picking any highly-rated cooling fan on Amazon unless there's some awesome brand I should know about.

 

Power Supply: 1000 or 1200W (can't determine if I'd need 1200 for the SLI), ideally there's a quiet brand?

 

Video: Basically, I'm deciding between 1x or 2x Radeon HD 5970. 2x SLI is probably overkill for today's games but what it comes down to is, is it better to get 2x SLI now or just replace the video card when faster ones come out later?

 

HD: Can't decide between 256GB SSD or some high-performance magnetic hard drive. I have an SSD on my work laptop and it's fast as HOLY CRIKEY so I figure that's gotta be pretty awesome for games. But it's so expensive. Maybe just swap out for an SSD when they come down in price (and reinstall everything again...)

 

Sound: Already have a SoundBlaster Fatal1ty and there isn't really much better AFAIK.

 

NIC: Do cards like the Killer Xeno Pro (so-called "gaming NICS") actually make a difference? I guess I don't really see how a gaming-specific NIC can magically make your ping better.

 

Anything else I should be aware of?

[Gadroc]

Chipset: i7. I'm thinking 960, as the 970/980 are six cores and everyone says don't waste your money on the two extra cores. The 970/980 are called "Extreme Edition" -- are they actually any faster than the 960, other than just having two more cores?

In my opinion anything over a 930 is overpriced. You can get a 930 which runs at 2.8ghz at microcenter.com for $199 or the 960 which runs at 3.2ghz for $569. The value curve is way off and from all info I've seen it should be easy to get the 930 to overclock to 3.2ghz.

 

Recommendation: i7 930

 

Mobo: X58 -- no idea about the relative benefits between EVGA, Asus, etc.

The main piece here is understanding how many PCI Express lanes you want. You basically have three classes of X58 boards out there.

 

1) Really expensive ones which augment the X58 chipset to get enough PCI Express lanes to run 3 16x PCI Express cards simultaneously. Look for boards using the NF200 chipset and expect to pay $300+ for these boards. Can be worth it if you are planning on running serious tripple SLI/Crossfire.

 

2) Good basic X58 boards. These boards run 2 PCI-Express 16 lanes, or if you plug in additional video cards they start dropping to 8 lanes each. Expect to pay @ $200 for these boards.

 

3) Boards which have the same X58 and PCI Express capabilities above but have other upgrades like dual network cards, etc. These are a waste of money in my opinion with features you'll never use on a gaming rig. Some are worth it for overclocking capabilities, but be sure to do research online if you are buying specifically for overclocking.

 

Everyone has their brand preferences. I particularly like Giga-byte boards. I've had good luck with everyone I've had. I used to love ASUS but had a string of bad boards, although they are still highly regarded. EVGA's offerings are supposed to be great, but I have yet to try them.

 

Recommendation: Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R

 

Memory: 6GB, as I think most games would be hard-pressed to use more than 6, right?

Yes 6GB should be fine. Get 1600 or better memory to give you room to overclock. You'll pay between $150-$250 for 6 GB of ram. Don't get suckered into super clocked memory unless you are seriously going to overclock you're CPU. Stick with a well respected brand here. I use Corsair and OCZ as cheap good ram.

 

Cooling: Not sure if liquid cooling is any quieter or worth the price. Thinking of just picking any highly-rated cooling fan on Amazon unless there's some awesome brand I should know about.

Big fan = quieter as the fan can turn slower. You can find several reviews of various CPU cooler at overclocking sites to get a good feel for good.

 

Recommendation: Scythe Mugen2 (Good and cheap, but may need help getting it installed as it takes a third hand to hold.)

 

Power Supply: 1000 or 1200W (can't determine if I'd need 1200 for the SLI), ideally there's a quiet brand?

If you are using ATI video cards that is way overkill. To SLI two 5870s you only need 750W to 850W. I've had great luck with Corsair power supplies recently. I have an TX750 which works great. HX series are supposed to be better. Corsair has a nice power supply selector on their front page. Once you single in on your other components run through it. If you switch to NVidia cards you will need a bigger power supply.

 

Recommendation: Corsair HX or TX 850.

 

Video: Basically, I'm deciding between 1x or 2x Radeon HD 5970. 2x SLI is probably overkill for today's games but what it comes down to is, is it better to get 2x SLI now or just replace the video card when faster ones come out later?

Be aware that the 5970 is an SLI on a single card. A single 5870 is faster than a single chip on the 5970 if SLI is disabled or the game doesn't benefit from SLI. Again as always go look at the benchmarks that compare games / simulations you want to run. My most recent machine is my first with ATI and I'm pretty happy. I originally got a 480gtx but took it back when it idled at 82c and was at 103c after an hour of FSX and sounded like a jet engine. The 5870 is nearly as fast for FSX but is quiet and half the temperature.

 

One word of caution is that the ATI drivers under Windows 7 have problems with VSYNC in FC2 and Black Shark. You can not force VSYNC which means you get some tearing. It can be reduced by setting max_fps to 30 in the game config files, but it's still there. Now I don't notice it at all unless I'm panning the view with TrackIR. I'm hoping DCS A10 fixes this with the new DirectX 10/11 support or newer drivers fix it, but be aware before purchasing.

 

Recommendation: (Your favorite brand here) ATI 5870 card

 

HD: Can't decide between 256GB SSD or some high-performance magnetic hard drive. I have an SSD on my work laptop and it's fast as HOLY CRIKEY so I figure that's gotta be pretty awesome for games. But it's so expensive. Maybe just swap out for an SSD when they come down in price (and reinstall everything again...)

This is personal preference, but I have a hard time with the cost benefit on a gaming rig. This is mainly due to the disk space requirements. Most games take up 10GB+ now. On a reasonably priced SSD you'll run out of space quick. A smaller boot SSD might be nice if you do a lot of other things besides gaming on the PC as well.

 

Sound: Already have a SoundBlaster Fatal1ty and there isn't really much better AFAIK.

Pay attention if you're existing Fatal1ty is the PCI version then you may not be able to use it. PCI slots are fast becoming a thing of the past, especially on boards now packed with PCI-Express 16 slots for SLI/Crossfire. On-board audio is no where near as bad as it used to be. I've stopped putting my X-Fi cards in my rigs for the most part.

 

NIC: Do cards like the Killer Xeno Pro (so-called "gaming NICS") actually make a difference? I guess I don't really see how a gaming-specific NIC can magically make your ping better.

Complete waste of money.

 

Misc Comments

Video cards (because they now vent directly out of case) and cases make the biggest impact on sound. Do some research on quiet PC cases and most are just marketed with a lot of fans (more fans = more noise unless done very well) for the gaming looks market. They don't seem to sell the ones I use, so I don't have a current recommendation.

 

Here is my current rig I use in my simulation pit:

Processor: i7 930

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R (rev 2)

CPU Cooler: Scythe Mugen2

Memory: 6GB OCZ Gold XTC Kit (8-8-8-24 at 1600)

Hard Drives: Cheap 250GB boot drive, Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB

Audio: On Board with secondary USB one for team speak

Video: Gigabyte 5870 2GB Eyefinity 6 Edition.

Case: Antec P182

Edited August 25, 2010 by Gadroc

[hassata]

Steller Gadroc. Bookmarked.

 

Edit: With the 5870, could I plug two 7" monitors into the DVI slots and 1 1024x768 projector into the HDMI slot using an HDMI to DVI convertor? Would performance take a hit (just using the 1024 for 3d view). I currently have a 4 series SLI on one card setup, so have access to 4 DVI slots.

 

Thanks

Edited August 24, 2010 by hassata

[Stretch]

Likewise Gadroc, outstanding info. My first question -- how long have ATI's vsync issues been around? In other words, three months from now will this be a thing of the past?

 

Like you I've got a GeForce card right now, and like you it sounds like a 747 after 3 minutes of any reasonably modern game. First and foremost I want a fast card, but if it's no quieter than my 8800 GT I'll be disappointed.

 

Is the stock fan on the 5870 quiet, or do you recommend a third-party fan? (Is it even replaceable?)

[Stretch]

Add'l thought: What can you guys recommend in the way of fan controllers? Along with being a quiet rig the g/f would appreciate if it doesn't have any lighted casemods (again, so she can sleep). Given that, are there any decent fan controllers/temperature displays that don't light your box up like a Christmas tree? Or do you recommend monitoring temps in software?

[hassata]

In terms of the V-syn issue, I run d3doverrider (part of the rivatuner package, but I believe you can download a stand alone version). Works like a charm for forcing V-sync and triple buffer. In addition to less shimmering and better IQ on my rig, I actually gained some fps at the low range.

[Gadroc]

Likewise Gadroc, outstanding info. My first question -- how long have ATI's vsync issues been around? In other words, three months from now will this be a thing of the past?

In terms of the V-syn issue, I run d3doverrider (part of the rivatuner package, but I believe you can download a stand alone version). Works like a charm for forcing V-sync and triple buffer. In addition to less shimmering and better IQ on my rig, I actually gained some fps at the low range.

 

The problem has been there for a while, from my reading on the boards. D3DOverrider does not fix the VSYNC for me in windowed mode (required for multi-monitor support). I have it at a tolerable level, but don't want to recommend with out pointing it out.

 

Like you I've got a GeForce card right now, and like you it sounds like a 747 after 3 minutes of any reasonably modern game. First and foremost I want a fast card, but if it's no quieter than my 8800 GT I'll be disappointed.

 

Is the stock fan on the 5870 quiet, or do you recommend a third-party fan? (Is it even replaceable?)

 

The 480gtx made my old 8800GT and 275gtx sound positively silent. Now the 5870 is not silent but its not loud enough for me to notice over normal case fans. The 480 was truly ridiculous in my opinion in heat and noise.

 

 

Add'l thought: What can you guys recommend in the way of fan controllers? Along with being a quiet rig the g/f would appreciate if it doesn't have any lighted casemods (again, so she can sleep). Given that, are there any decent fan controllers/temperature displays that don't light your box up like a Christmas tree? Or do you recommend monitoring temps in software?

 

Get a good case. I did find the current incarnation of my current case which is the Antec P183. It's not a cheap case but very well made and comes with two 120mm fans with built in speed controllers (high, med and low). With all the fans set on low it very quiet.

 

 

SWith the 5870, could I plug two 7" monitors into the DVI slots and 1 1024x768 projector into the HDMI slot using an HDMI to DVI convertor? Would performance take a hit (just using the 1024 for 3d view). I currently have a 4 series SLI on one card setup, so have access to 4 DVI slots.

 

A regular 5xxx card can run three monitors, but the third monitor has to be using an active adapter (either VGA or dual link DVI adapter). Active VGA adapters run about $25 and active DVI adapters run $100-$150.

[Stretch]

The order is placed. I mostly went with your suggestions Gadroc as they were very good and backed up by the Internet at large. I opted for a Noctua CPU fan and a (unlit) Cooler Master case because people by and large said they were very quiet.

 

I decided against aftermarket GPU fans, fan controllers, and mobo fans because I decided not to spend money to solve a problem that I didn't know I was going to have. I'm going to build, probe, and buy additional fans if necessary.

 

Hope I didn't forget anything in the order! :D If I did I'm sure I will find out and as long as nothing catches fire it'll just be a simple learning experience.

[Silent Warrior]

. . . but the g/f would really much appreciate a quiet box so she can sleep. (My current video card is noisy as all hell.)

Um, do you have different time-tables or something (someone working night-shift)? Did you put the computer in your bedroom? I have difficulty seeing why there'd be a problem if both of you sleep at the same time...

Besides the recommendations already given, I can spread the gospel of fan-less cooling solutions for graphics cards (though, to my knowledge, they're only up to 57xx-derivatives). In extreme cases, you COULD, I guess, invest in a boat-load of extension-cables for keyboard, monitor, mouse, whatever else, and put the case somewhere far, far away.

[Stretch]

do you have different time-tables or something?

 

Yep.

 

Did you put the computer in your bedroom?

 

Yep.

 

:)