sdflyer

By the way with all Spit that flight model discussion, I want to emphasize that DCS is excellent sims and I really enjoy it (despite curve frustration) :) I have a friend who was instructor in F-5E, can't wait to let him try DCS . After all where else we can fly those exotic airplanes if not in the sim :)

Ok so I changed my curves to be more linear: pitch, roll, and yaw respectfully 0 100 80 0 0 100 72 0 0 100 100 0 I noticed on Yo yo take off video he is using right aileron on take off roll I thought it was done in order to compensate for the right crosswind. However, it seems like there is no other way to maintain directional control without right aileron to offset torque and especially gyroscopic precession (when lift a tale). While it is helps to take off, from what I understand it must be sufficiently enough to compensate with just right rudder! Among other there is common "junior" pilot problem that after Vr (lift off) inadequate right rudder produces left wing drop which most folks instinctively compensate with right aileron. However, all it takes to prevent left wind drop is sufficient right rudder. All sources about Spitfire I have do mention right rudder in the take off, but never mention anything about using right aileron (unless it's right cross wind of course). Now in early Spit modesl I believe empennage was too small, and so rudder authority was lacking. Because of that Spit only take off and land into the wind (dirt field allowed it). Later that problem was cured, and I think mark IX should not have it at all. Also I don't know what is a deal with oversensitive ground looping. I wish Yo yo would show a bit more video on deceleration and full stop !

oddly enough if I change my curves to default (if mean linear) when pull my stick completely aft my left aileron goes up as well. In other words my TM Warthog is so sensitive that even 0.1mm left or right on the pitch producing slight roll. With that setup Spit was absolutely un-flyable. Right now I'm using dead zone | X | Y| curve pitch: 11 100 41 27 roll: 20 100 55 25 yaw: 14 100 100 15

Can you please give numbers for pitch, roll, and yaw (dead zone, saturation and so on)? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What are joystick curves on that video ? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

When he settles though on the roll out it goes slightly above Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Flight model thoughts So VSI 500fpm translates to around 200fpm actual touch down ? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Make sense. Thanks Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was referring to VSI reading at touch down point. Try it on the hard surface (Nevada map) at the same rate of descent at touch down point . Of course you free to make your own judgement, and express your own opinion, but I please don't accuse me of making thing up. Im long time flight simmer dating back to early 90th. I even contributed to flight sim developing when Oleg Maddox was working on IL-2 (getting him documentation on many us aircraft ). Finally I'm aviation enthusiast, commercially rated pilot, and flight instructor. Not that it makes me a special but definitely not delusional critic of something I have absolutely no idea about. P.s. I don't teach taildraggers, but I have flown decathlon, citabria and snj-4 (t-6) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

~500 fpm touch down on hard sufcaes. No bouncing :music_whistling: (try it on Nevada map in DCS)

Ok, so it's for regular fighter pilot cadets to fly? Correct? Not for ATP certificated pilots with minimum 1500 hours? So make let's it so in DCS. It doesn't mean to simplify the Spit model but rather tweak it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For what it worth Spit wasn't designed to accommodate exclusive club of experienced pilots. As keep saying to my students - flying is the easiest part of learning, making right decision is hardest :) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For what it worth Spit wasn't designed to accommodate exclusive club of experienced pilots. As keep saying to my students - flying is the easiest part of learning, making right decision is hardest :) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Got yourself early x-mass present Spitfire video from here https://www.dukevideo.com/prd8379ED/Supermarine-Spitfire-A-Pilots-View-Download Seems like a pleasure airplane to fly unlike DCS version where I a lot of things feels a bit exaggerated. For starters I like full right aileron take off as crosswind control with light dance on the rudder and without much struggle for directional control unlike DCS. Neutral longitudinal static stability indeed requires little control on landing. But for some reason I have a hard time achieving it with my HOTAS. Although controls deflection now seems similar to real one (once again thanks again for the tip on Warthong curves) Dropping flaps on the video doesn't produce such huge negative pitch moment like in DCS. The landing seems not that complicated, struts obsorbs soft field just fine without too much bounce. Now there is a one weird thing is VSI featured in game and in the video. That mark on the video when Spit touch down would indicate 1000 ft per minute in DCS version. It can't be soft landing by any means. So is there the scale difference or some kind of instrument error due to pitch attitude on three point landing where 1000 fpm would translate to something like 250 fpm. I can't figure it out By the way roll rate on the video looks exactly like in DCS. Nice. So the bottom line. Spit may need few tweak perhaps? May be my video comparison it's not much scientific but served me well for the last 15 years of my flying career LOL

Do you refer to the static or dynamic stability (in terms of longitudinal stability) ? Thanks Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm sorry I really don't understand what you mean by trim. In terms of piston aircraft, when airplane gets below L/D max and enters so called "reverse area of command ". In order to sustain level flight pilot will be required to compensate insufficient thrust by increasing angle of attack - meaning he will pull on controls further to increase pitch attitude. Since pressure on control will be less (due to reduction of airflow) they will feel weaker/softer and their range of motion will be wider (depending on max range of control deflection) In case of landing - pilot producing similar effect by voluntarily reducing thrust and increasing angle of attack Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

OK here some interesting video I found 1.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6OUPensUiE You can partially see stick movement (nice) and clearly ASI (airspeed) and VSI (vertical speed) Airspeed of trash hold is about 80 mph, same as I use in DCS. VS at touch down however (considering lag of calibrate leak) looks like around 400-500 fpm. Same touch in DCS Spit would produced more pronouns bounce 2.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tPVBBp3e1A&t=545s This one at the end shows landing attitude. Few points confirmed as they seen in DCS. - Cowling does obscure great deal at landing pitch attitude. We can see how pilot move head around to gauge ground proximity. - VSI shows ~100 fps a very soft touch down on paved runway. Again same behavior as in DCS (Nevada map hard surface runway)

Good luck with your learning! Let me know if you need some help. After all I have license to teach :smartass: BTW I've met Rod couple times. He lives not to far from men in Orange County ( Southern California). He is teaching in his C152 out of KSNA. Very nice guy, knowledgeable and funny.

Flight model thoughts Thanks. I found those curves. Sounds sexy LOL. It much better now. I can land just fine finally . However, I can't figure out why at the end of landing roll I ground loop. It just doesn't make sense to me. Do Spit has tail gear lock? Could it be it? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

P-51 is much better. Reminds me a lot of T-6 I flown. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, but there must adequate accommodation to simulate the shorter stick. Why? Because main stream sticks are all shorter. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I flown airplane that "sit on the stick", so I understand your point. However, when at 80mph with 1mm pull on my stick get airplane in zoom climb 1000fpm. That is not right . Reduced airflow must effect control efficiency, the pitch range suppose to be wider and response weaker. I do not see this in the game but I do see this in the video If there anything I can do to tweak my stick ? I don't know, I tried suggested tweaks but they didn't make significant difference. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As I expected real airplane controls are not that sensitive I wonder how can I tweak TM Warthong to do that?

Hello, I'm flight sim addict who just purchased Spit and installed DCS I've been given serious testing of Spitfire behavior (in simulator mode) and I found a lot of strange things. Disclaimer I never flown Spit in real life, and I imagine it would require some fines skills. I do have couple real life pilot certificates and ratings including license to teach. For starters: I'm using Tm Warthog and CH rudder pedals. I carefully checked forum for different joystick settings and curve suggestion. I also check assignment to avoid any conflict in stick/rudder/throttle configuration. Here are two major problem I have 1. Extremely exaggerated elevator authority 2. Extremely exaggerated ailerons authority Trial number 1: take off. Here I can relate to some aircraft I flown, dance on the rudders and compensate for torque and gyroscopic precession. To make long story short I can take off in reasonable terms Trial number 1: level turns. I can clearly see adverse yaw during banking (by looking at the cowling) But here where my expectations end. 1mm pull on my stick quickly pushes Spit toward critical AoA and I get buffeting ! Really? OK I guess I can take careful approach and use gentle touch heli pilot. :music_whistling: Trial number 2: slow flight. In clean configuration it seems Spit requires a solid pitch attitude at speed around 120 mph. As I mentioned before I have never flown Spit in real life so I'm not going to comment on that. In dirty configuration (full flaps) I was able to maintain Spit straight and level (kind of) around 70-80 mph. Nice! But as far as I know when airflow decreases elevator authority decreases as well. Not a chance in DCS! Another 1mm pull on the stick produces stall. That is wrong in my opinion. I can leave with excessive rudder control but not elevator. Trial number 3: stall spins. I can stall, I can spin, and I can recover (reasonably enough) Trial numer 4: landing. Here come in play problem with slow flight. I tried both wheely and three pointers landing neither of which brought good results. Again excessive elevator authority make it very difficult to flare and not to balloon. Even after successfully weird landing I'm not able to keep directional control (no wind condition). I don't know if Spit has tail wheel lock I couldn't find anything in setup and not familiar if it had it in real life. Perhaps that causes the problem? :joystick: Anyway I don't know may be there is way to setup my controls to get good sense of the Spit, but so I have absolutely no problem to fly DCS P-51 and resembles T-6 that I flown in real life.

I appreciate your input. I was flight sim enthusiast way before I become real world pilot. So topic about how learn to fly in the sim, and how to transfer this knowledge to the real world is a great interest to me. Since teach people to fly in real life I just share my 2c Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk