helisim8

Nice work on your joystick! Thanks for the clarification. Have you ever used the flat disc rotary dampers? I am wondering if those are a commercial version of the kind of dampers you make yourself. Wondering if there would be less stiction with those than the hydraulic damper.

Tell your wife, "Thank you." Thanks for the link to the R22 Maintenance Manual. Lots of good information there! Hmmm, I think I need to find some time for a re-do on this. I'll see what I can do.

Thanks for the sketch. Now you have me wondering if my geometry is all wrong. Part of the problem is my foot rests below the pivot point so the round bar is lower on the stalk to reach the ball of my foot, but if I move the bar up, it also increases the overall pedal travel. Did you happen to measure the actual pedal travel in the R44? I have to do that the next time I fly the R22. Otherwise, I think I will try moving the damper attachment point to get the full range of damper travel as you mentioned, try to maintain the mechanical advantage, and maybe add a floor board to raise my foot rest. Thanks for your ideas.

Thank you for your reply. I have heard of Nyogel 767a being used for sliding contact surfaces. Are you saying it works well on hydraulic shaft stiction too? My problem is the o-ring seals around the hydraulic shaft wiping away the silicone grease. I am looking for something that stays on the shaft longer or maybe gets impregnated into the o-ring seals if you think Nyogel 767a will help.

Yes, I have flanged ball bearings on either side of the square aluminum tubing "stalks" that the foot bars are connected to for the pivots. I may try connecting the damper further up the stalks to use more of the travel, even at the expense of the mechanical advantage. Perhaps that may make the stiction less noticeable. I have so little time in the real helicopters, I almost don't remember what the cyclic feels like, only that there is more resistance than my Logitech 3D Pro without centering spring. My .8 hr in the R44 was an intro flight where the instructor never really took his hands or feet off the controls, so I felt a lot of resistance, even if it had hydraulics. The R22 doesn't feel clunky at all. It was smooth, with a fair amount of resistance like in a car steering wheel, and a small zone around where the stick was where there was less resistance. Not slop, though. I need some more time in the R22 to get a better feel to compare with the sim controls. I know right now that I'm not even close on the cyclic and collective that I have. Not even sure I'm close with the pedals, but at least I have some resistance now. Interesting information about the Hall sensors, I have to say that I'm probably more comfortable dealing with mechanical stuff than electronic stuff. So I'll have to think and learn more about the Hall sensors versus gearing pots. I'm coming to the sim world from RC helicopters, and I can see that this is an entirely separate hobby on its own. I got started because I thought the simulator would be a good way to build muscle memory to fly a full size helicopter, and way less expensive.

Would be nice to see the rest of the mechanism with sensors. What keeps the bearing from rotating in yaw? Or is it used as 3-axis?

There are ball bearings or spherical rod ends at all the pivot points. The unit was very free before adding the damper. Which was actually the reason for adding the damper as the pedals would not hold there place and flop freely. Do the RC car shocks you used for the cyclic have the same "stiction" effect? I need to find a solution for adding resistance to the cyclic as well. I am trying to simulate the feel of Robinson R22 controls which are not hydraulically assisted as in the R44 you fly. I have only .8hr in a R44 and 1.1hr in a R22, so need some more flight time for calibration soon. I feel like the resistance of the steering damper is good, and also nice that it is adjustable, but the "stiction" would be unacceptable on the cyclic. Maybe I have to try the rotary dampers that others have mentioned. I'm eventually probably going to have to build another cyclic and collective with dampers for resistance and either better pots or try the Hall effect sensors.

Hi FragBum, Thank you for your response. I’m only using about half of the travel. I could change the attachment point to get full travel, but would lose mechanical advantage. Do you still have to add the petroleum jelly on your collective steering damper, or does it not need lubricant after the seals wear in? Thanks.

I have been using a modified Logitech 3D Pro joystick that I separated the throttle and yaw pots to make DIY heli collective, anti-torque pedals and extended cyclic. I have about 100 hours with them on the sim, but just recently added the motorcycle steering damper to the pedals. The resistance force seems fine, but there is a lot of "stiction," or resistance to small reversing movements. I have applied some Danco silicone grease for o-rings, and it works great for about 20-30 minutes before the o-rings wipe it off the shaft and I need to re-apply the silicone grease. Have you done something to permanently solve this issue, or do the o-rings just "wear in" with time? I only have about three hours use so far since adding the steering damper. Thanks.

Lots of great ideas and information here! Very nice work!