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Real Su-30mkı inverted stall!


theropod
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friends,

i wanted to share that video because in a few seconds something is happening and which is familiar to us:)

at 0:53 seconds pilot attemts to perform backflip maneouvre but when completing maneouvre at 1:00 minute ,aircraft seems out of control in a few seconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSFJTKBnHbI

 

if you find that kind of flanker video ,please share it:)


Edited by theropod
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Might not have been a mistake, may have just been him showing how easily recoverable it can be in a stall with vectored thrust.

 

The upside-down shuttlecock tendency of the 27 wouldn't be so drastic if it had vectored thrust as well.

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Oh yes it would be. Look at the pitch/yaw rate. What speed is this aircraft flying at?

 

Right - try it at 400 or 500kts now, what do you think will happen to either a Su-27 or Su-30, thrust vectoring or no thrust vectoring?

 

Perhaps you're talking about a change in how the flight control system works, and not what I think you're talking about?

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D

I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda

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Well they weren't being very clear.

 

There's the tendency to invert in the first place, which is about CoG and aerodynamics and likely not all that different across the Su-27 family of aircraft.

 

Then there's the tendency to stay inverted through a distressingly large chunk of altitude while recovering. That may be significantly different with thrust vectoring.

 

 

In general though I think it's less a matter of the Su-27 loving to go nose down than of DCS customers loving to do things that the aircraft manual says should never be done due to the risk of unrecoverable loss of pilot control. Probably because we all watch too many airshow videos but don't bother to remember that those are the very best available pilots, doing many things that pilots in most units are absolutely not allowed to do under any circumstances.


Edited by esb77

Callsign "Auger". It could mean to predict the future or a tool for boring large holes.

 

I combine the two by predictably boring large holes in the ground with my plane.

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Might not have been a mistake, may have just been him showing how easily recoverable it can be in a stall with vectored thrust.

 

The upside-down shuttlecock tendency of the 27 wouldn't be so drastic if it had vectored thrust as well.

 

Who knows ,may be or may not be!

 

but for me, it looks like having problem in a few seconds.

speed, right angle, weather conditions...etc

if you compare with other airshows,usually, this maneouvre doesnt ends like this.

 

here is an example with same aircraft and same maneouvre at maks 2005

after 0:51 :


Edited by theropod
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At 0:30 in that vid he is in a serious departure. Like I said, he probably did it intentionally just because he's a damn good pilot and knows the jet so well and is able to right it with ease, same with the first video. Maybe, maybe not, but I'd wager yes.

 

A bit off topic: I still don't see what the big deal is about the Cobra maneuver. I see how impressive it is in terms of physics, but employment-wise it just seems like a gee-whiz ability more than anything else. The fact that you lose so much energy doing and it takes so long to recover that lost energy just doesn't make any sense to me as to why anyone would use it for anything but an airshow.

 

"But what about the doppler notch?"

 

What about a four-ship wall of Eagles bearing down on you with missiles already in the air? MAYBE you broke a lock or two, MAYBE, but now you've gotta get yourself right and go through the sorting and targeting phase all over again because your SA has just evaporated, so you just shot yourself in the foot.


Edited by Trailer
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At 0:30 in that vid he is in a serious departure. Like I said, he probably did it intentionally just because he's a damn good pilot and knows the jet so well and is able to right it with ease, same with the first video. Maybe, maybe not, but I'd wager yes.

 

A bit off topic: I still don't see what the big deal is about the Cobra maneuver. I see how impressive it is in terms of physics, but employment-wise it just seems like a gee-whiz ability more than anything else. The fact that you lose so much energy doing and it takes so long to recover that lost energy just doesn't make any sense to me as to why anyone would use it for anything but an airshow.

 

"But what about the doppler notch?"

 

What about a four-ship wall of Eagles bearing down on you with missiles already in the air? MAYBE you broke a lock or two, MAYBE, but now you've gotta get yourself right and go through the sorting and targeting phase all over again because your SA has just evaporated, so you just shot yourself in the foot.

 

 

Apologies for taking this a bit further off topic, but... This. I can just about see the use of a Kobra during a close air combat situation for a last-ditch emergency attempt to force an overshoot or to get your nose on target for a snap missile or cannon shot. Outside of that sort of emergency I think that manoeuvres like the Kobra don't have much application outside of pleasing crowds at air shows.

 

I'm sure that the Su-30MKI / Su-35 / Su-37 or whatever the true designation should be, is a demon in a dogfight with that amount of absolute nose authority, but outside of that narrowly defined scenario I don't see the super-manoeuvrability being that useful. In BVR situations radar, systems integration and pilot workload will probably all have a far greater impact on who goes home and who gets to ride a parachute.

 

On topic... That's an amazing display. It looks as though the pilot did take things a bit too far at the 1:00 - 1:10 mark, but as Trailer commented it's probably due to the fact that the pilot is an absolute master of that machine and knows exactly how far to push it in every situation.

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Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.

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I'm still trying to figure out how to get out of the upside-down shuttlecock of death; sometimes I manage it but most of the time I burn through 2k meters of altitude in about 30 seconds and do a faceplant in the dirt.

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The cobra, in and of itself, is not a useful combat maneuver.

 

However, the ability to fly that slow, at that AoA, and still control the aircraft and recover to normal flight means that in a turning fight, the Flanker can afford to lose more energy than other aircraft.

 

This means that if a Flanker pilot has just needs a few more degrees of pull to line up a guns shot, he has them. It means that if the fight devolves to the point where turning radius becomes a significant factor, the Flanker has the option to force his nose through a turn to get his R-73 on target.

 

This not the sort of combat advantage that you build your fighting tactics around: You want the other guy dead long before the engagement closes to that point. But when it does get to that point, having the ability to point your nose anywhere in the sky on command, regardless of your current path of travel, means that the other guy has one more set of problems to worry about.

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^^^^

 

You don't have that sort of ability. You can point the nose along the plane of motion, but make no mistake - you are not in control if you raise that AoA that high. You may regain control shall we say, 'safely', but the moment you hit 'S' and pull the stick back, you've given it up. It's not a magical 'point the nose where you want' device. That title belongs to the rudders ;)

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D

I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda

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