GGTharos Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 The OP was talking about doing this in MIL power. And you can, if you strip the payload with a 38000lbs eagle. You can go even higher if you go as far as removing the pylons and it's a cold day. But stick missiles on it and you're not going anywhere near 50000' in MIL power. There's also the matter of stores being extra draggy in-game, so that itself is a problem. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
fltsimbuff Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 I decided to play with this a bit. I was able to attain stable-ish flight at 65,000 feet with 50% internal fuel and no external stores. Of course this was at about mach 1.5 with afterburner. At about 20% fuel I was able to start a climb that arced up to 74,000 feet before I stalled. Again, full burner all the way. I am looking forward to the view (curvature of the Earth and better atmospheric effects) of DCS 2.0 at 60,000+ feet :)
kolga Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 The OP was talking about doing this in MIL power. And you can, if you strip the payload with a 38000lbs eagle. You can go even higher if you go as far as removing the pylons and it's a cold day. But stick missiles on it and you're not going anywhere near 50000' in MIL power. There's also the matter of stores being extra draggy in-game, so that itself is a problem. Can you remove pylons in DCS? "Long life It is a waste not to notice that it is not noticed that it is milk in the title." Amazon.co.jp review for milk translated from Japanese "Amidst the blue skies, A link from past to future. The sheltering wings of the protector..." - ACE COMBAT 4 "Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight"-Psalm 144:1 KJV i5-4430 at 3.00GHz, 8GB RAM, GTX 1060 FE, Windows 7 x64
streakeagle Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 How about comparing in-game performance with flight manual charts rather than "brochure" numbers. There is much to be learned from studying these charts. Note the weight, engine trim, and air temperature limits. I think you will find that brochure numbers are rounded off quite a bit, such as 23,830 lb engines being called 25,000 lb engines. If these charts are accurate, you need a cold day (10 deg C cooler than the "standard day") to even think about crossing 60,000 feet with a clean aircraft at 35,000 lbs! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 When you have no stores onboard, the drag is modeled as if there were no pylons either. Can you remove pylons in DCS? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
GGTharos Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 The 220's are what's modeled in game, and they actually do better. But the point is made: Put anything on that bird and you're not going anywhere near 50000' at MIL power! How about comparing in-game performance with flight manual charts rather than "brochure" numbers. There is much to be learned from studying these charts. Note the weight, engine trim, and air temperature limits. I think you will find that brochure numbers are rounded off quite a bit, such as 23,830 lb engines being called 25,000 lb engines. If these charts are accurate, you need a cold day (10 deg C cooler than the "standard day") to even think about crossing 60,000 feet with a clean aircraft at 35,000 lbs! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Flying Spanner Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 (edited) I've been to 60,000 feet but was in the jump seat on Concorde :-) @ 680.58 meters/second. When decelerating through Mach 1, engine number 3 tried to select reverse resulting in a precautionary engine shutdown, great fun. Edited June 19, 2015 by Flying Spanner
ShuRugal Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 How about comparing in-game performance with flight manual charts rather than "brochure" numbers. There is much to be learned from studying these charts. Note the weight, engine trim, and air temperature limits. I think you will find that brochure numbers are rounded off quite a bit, such as 23,830 lb engines being called 25,000 lb engines. If these charts are accurate, you need a cold day (10 deg C cooler than the "standard day") to even think about crossing 60,000 feet with a clean aircraft at 35,000 lbs! That's rather useful information. Looks like the F-15C can cruise at 50k', but only on a cold day in clean configuration.
blkspade Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 The OP was talking about doing this in MIL power. And you can, if you strip the payload with a 38000lbs eagle. You can go even higher if you go as far as removing the pylons and it's a cold day. But stick missiles on it and you're not going anywhere near 50000' in MIL power. There's also the matter of stores being extra draggy in-game, so that itself is a problem. Speaking of the stores being extra draggy. I wonder if that same value affects the missile's off of the rail? http://104thphoenix.com/
Svend_Dellepude Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 Speaking of the stores being extra draggy. I wonder if that same value affects the missile's off of the rail? AFAIK it does. There were some posts about that in the missiles mod thread. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Win10 64, Asus Maximus VIII Formula, i5 6600K, Geforce 980 GTX Ti, 32 GB Ram, Samsung EVO SSD.
kolga Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 When you have no stores onboard, the drag is modeled as if there were no pylons either. Oh, ok. Thanks! "Long life It is a waste not to notice that it is not noticed that it is milk in the title." Amazon.co.jp review for milk translated from Japanese "Amidst the blue skies, A link from past to future. The sheltering wings of the protector..." - ACE COMBAT 4 "Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight"-Psalm 144:1 KJV i5-4430 at 3.00GHz, 8GB RAM, GTX 1060 FE, Windows 7 x64
GGTharos Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 Nope, drag of missiles in-flight uses a completely different set of values. Speaking of the stores being extra draggy. I wonder if that same value affects the missile's off of the rail? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
GGTharos Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 An F-15C with -100's at 35000lbs. An F-15C with -220's (the engines modeled in-game) has similar performance at 38000lbs, IIRC. You can probably guess at what it can do at 35000lbs. That's rather useful information. Looks like the F-15C can cruise at 50k', but only on a cold day in clean configuration. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
SinusoidDelta Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 Below are charts for the PW220, clean, with and without pylons. Clean Airplane (No Pylons / No Launchers) Clean Airplane (3 Pylons / 4 Launchers)
streakeagle Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 Notice that even with the -220s, the F-15C isn't crossing 60,000 feet unless it is a cold day. Clearly the numbers quoted in so many of my old books are absolute best case values that have been rounded up ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted June 19, 2015 Posted June 19, 2015 Those lines still allow for a 500fpm climb IIRC but generally speaking yup ... Raptors on the other hand ... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
SinusoidDelta Posted July 2, 2015 Posted July 2, 2015 Not to derail the thread but the F-15E with the 229's does quite well.
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