(No error) Wheres the inclinometer (the ball)

[BlueJacketGuy]

I can't seem to find the ball in the cockpit, and it's quite difficult to fly a prop without one. Am I going blind?

[504smudge]

Hope this helps

[bongodriver]

No ball in a Spitfire, instead it has the turn and slip indicator, it's the top needle that indicates slip.

[Precog]

You dont need a ball anyway. Level the wings and look out the cockpit - if there is yaw your not flying coordinated.

[504smudge]

You dont need a ball anyway. Level the wings and look out the cockpit - if there is yaw your not flying coordinated.

 

Thats a great principle at low level, but as soon as you pass 20k ft it's very hard to see the horizon, especially when in a gradual climb. Also in bad weather, knowing how to fly IFR is quite important in prop planes.

[BlueJacketGuy]

You dont need a ball anyway. Level the wings and look out the cockpit - if there is yaw your not flying coordinated.

 

That's not quite correct. Yawing and coordination are not bound to one another. For example, during a coordinated turn, there's yaw, but also coordination. I can hold a heading while uncoordinated as well, it's just that my plane isn't pointing directly into the wind.

 

A similar topic would be, you can stall while uncoordinated, and not spin, so long as there isn't any yawing. It's the yawing that causes differing alpha on each wing, and not the coordination, so without an active yaw moment, you won't necessarily spin (assuming prop torque/p-factor doesn't take over). However, during a coordinated stall, even if you're yawing/changing heading, by being coordinated, you have equal airflow over each wing.

 

Thanks for the quick answers guys. I can't say I like this slip/skid indicator though. It's not like the airplanes at home in FREEDOM LAND.

[bongodriver]

it does exactly the same job as the ball, even works in the same sense, just a different indicator is all.

[Precog]

That's not quite correct. Yawing and coordination are not bound to one another. ..I can hold a heading while uncoordinated as well, it's just that my plane isn't pointing directly into the wind.

 

In wings level flight they are. As for wind, don't confuse yaw with drift. Wind is irrelevant. If the wings are level and the nose isn't yawing (turning) you are co-ordinated regardless of the wind. simple as that.

[BlueJacketGuy]

In wings level flight they are. As for wind, don't confuse yaw with drift. Wind is irrelevant. If the wings are level and the nose isn't yawing (turning) you are co-ordinated regardless of the wind. simple as that.

 

This is 100% incorrect. It fails to take into account aerodynamic effects from the engine, or asymmetrical airframe drag. Even then, I can be wings level and uncoordinated in a glider as well.

[Schwarzfeld]

Whomever just said "you don't need a slip indicator/ball to fly" up there is either on drugs or hasn't learned to fly in a real airplane with a good instructor.

 

Keeping the ball in the middle with your feet is by far one of the most important things you must do as a pilot, all the time, period, forever and now until the end of time, UNLESS you are landing or taking off :)

[JNelson]

This is 100% incorrect. It fails to take into account aerodynamic effects from the engine, or asymmetrical airframe drag. Even then, I can be wings level and uncoordinated in a glider as well.

 

There is no scenario where you can be wings level, uncoordinated and not be yawing in one direction or the other and by yawing I mean heading is increasing or decreasing (just being completely explicit).

[BlueJacketGuy]

There is no scenario where you can be wings level, uncoordinated and not be yawing in one direction or the other and by yawing I mean heading is increasing or decreasing (just being completely explicit).

 

Engine torque alone disproves this. Either that being uncorrected turning tendencies, or engine out operations in a twin. An intentional slip used as a maneuver shows that the wings can be level and the aircraft can be both hold a heading and be uncoordinated. Induced drag from aileron deflection will caused adverse yaw, I know many planes that require aileron to maintain wings level flight.

 

Do you have any operational experience in prop driven aircraft? If you do, I implore you to chair fly a slip, climb, do slow flight, etc with your feet on the floor only using ailerons. I reiterate, holding heading is not coordination.

[bongodriver]

Bluejacketguy is absolutely correct, the aircraft can be in a 'straight and level' condition with rudder applied to make the aircraft uncoordinated, it will still fly constant heading and maintain track and has nothing to do with drift. it is in effect simply a sideslip but in maintained level flight.