AIM-54 Spoofed By a Single Chaff Packet And Additional Concerns

[DCS FIGHTER PILOT]

   In the tests I ran, I had the Aim-54c shot at me. All it takes to defeat the thing is to break left or right, put the missile on the beam, and drop one piece of chaff. Do that and the thing goes stupid. Now I do realize that by putting on the beam you are effectively notching the missile but I would think that the Phoenix, particularly the C, would be well suited against such a tactic. Again, all it takes is one piece of chaff and the thing flies right by. Additionally as of 12/24, the missile gives no warning that it has gone active, at least when shot by the AI. Finally, I would also like to point out the fact that all versions of the Phoenix continue to make very violent changes in their trajectory, particularly at the apex of their loft curve, which bleeds off 100's of knots of airspeed. 

Aim-54C Spoofed By 1 Chaff 2.trk Aim-54C Spoofed By 1 Chaff.trk

[nighthawk2174]

If you launch the trk's in tacview you can also get the closure rate to see if they were or weren't notched at that moment.  Dont disagree with such missiles being way too sensitive to chaff though, should be a lot more resistant.  The rest of what you posted are either us waiting for the new missile API or already reported bugs.

Edited December 24, 2020 by nighthawk2174

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

Same goes for aim120 though

[dundun92]

AIM-120 is much more chaff resistant. Its still easy to notch, but its gonna take more than 1-2 chaff. More like 10-15 chaff.

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

I don't think it is , especially lately. For a while the phoenix was even more chaff resistant than the 120, even the old analog phoenixes. 
 

[Black6]

Hi, I used this period of tests to fly new F-14A, why is my favorite plane. I'm seriously surprised by missing of loft trajectory for AIM-54, which should be its default way of use for medium and long distances. In many available materials you can read about its climbing to level over 30km for cruising flight ....
By fliing directly to the target it reduses significantly its range.

[nighthawk2174]

1 hour ago, Black6 said:

Hi, I used this period of tests to fly new F-14A, why is my favorite plane. I'm seriously surprised by missing of loft trajectory for AIM-54, which should be its default way of use for medium and long distances. In many available materials you can read about its climbing to level over 30km for cruising flight ....
By fliing directly to the target it reduses significantly its range.

 

Yup the code is there for this just gotta wait for ED to iron out the bugs, seems that the new phoenix API is still not quite working fully according to HB/ED.

[dundun92]

8 hours ago, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

I don't think it is , especially lately. For a while the phoenix was even more chaff resistant than the 120, even the old analog phoenixes. 
 

no, the AIM-54 was always less chaff resistant than the AMRAAM. Just because at one point it had a lower ccm_k0 didnt matter, because it still used the old chaff code. Id recommend you actually get in the sim and test this stuff.

Edited December 26, 2020 by dundun92

[Blinky.ben]

12 hours ago, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

I don't think it is , especially lately. For a while the phoenix was even more chaff resistant than the 120, even the old analog phoenixes. 
 

For awhile there the Aim-120 was completely chaff resistance so this statement is not true

Edited December 26, 2020 by Blinky.ben

[nighthawk2174]

4 hours ago, Blinky.ben said:

For awhile there the Aim-120 was completely chaff resistance so this statement is not true

 

A shame it didn't stay this way for very long as from all indications that is far more realistic.

Edited December 27, 2020 by nighthawk2174

[Blinky.ben]

1 hour ago, nighthawk2174 said:

A shame it didn't stay this way for very long as from all indications that is far more realistic.

 

I would have to disagree also. A missile can’t be perfectly resistant, Radar just doesn’t work like that.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Blinky.ben

[dundun92]

I really dont get why people thought the AIM-120 was totally resistant to chaff. It wasnt. Far from it. Yes, if you were used to the old "put missile in vague direction of 3-9 line and spam chaff" meta yea that may make it look chaff proof. But if you focused on being accurate with your notches than depending on chaff spam it was far from completely chaff resistant. The biggest issue actually was the desync induced by the chaff, which made it impossible to know where exactly the missile was.