Apache profile using Helios for a second monitor

[sobe]

Bunny Clark

Are you using the generic interface from CZ?

[Bunny Clark]

2 hours ago, sobe said:

Bunny Clark

Are you using the generic interface from CZ?

Negative, building a Helios native direct Interface.

[sobe]

That is a massive project to do so quickly 

[Bunny Clark]

Here's what I've gotten done so far. It includes the Pilot Left and Right MFDs, KU, and EUFD. Rotary positions from DCS aren't correctly syncing with Helios and I'm not sure why, but otherwise everything is working for me. 

If you'd like to use it drop it in your Helios/Interfaces folder and install it into your profile. 

DCS.AH-64D.hif.json

[sobe]

Bunny

I downloaded your json file but could not find it on the interface list.  Where do I initially place it?

[Bunny Clark]

1 hour ago, sobe said:

Bunny

I downloaded your json file but could not find it on the interface list.  Where do I initially place it?

Assuming you have a typical install, it needs to go to C:\Program Files\Helios Virtual Cockpit\Helios\Interfaces. It'll then appear as "DCS AH-64D" when you go to Profile > Add Interface.

[sobe]

Bunny

Sorry to keep bothering you, but when I first open my Apache profile, your interface does not appear on a shortened list.  If I open a new profile, your interface appears on a longer list.  So how do I get the two to work together?

In the module format, do I put helios drivers generated by this interface or basic telemetry only?

In the DCS vehicle do I put AH-64D or your DCS AH-64D?

In either instance, your interface does not appear.

Edited March 19, 2022 by sobe

[Bunny Clark]

10 hours ago, sobe said:

In the module format, do I put helios drivers generated by this interface or basic telemetry only?

In the DCS vehicle do I put AH-64D or your DCS AH-64D?

In either instance, your interface does not appear.

Curious. I'm not even sure what you mean by most of that, so it's entirely possible I've messed up something I don't understand. 

[sobe]

Bunny

I finally got your Apache interface working in my profile.  I noticed that the version you sent me did not have the TEDAC controls for the CPG cockpit.  Any chance of you finishing that part up?

I may try to do the TEDAC myself.  I looked at your Json file and if I knew where to get items like the deviceid (I think I know where that is), actionid, stopactionid, and stuff like that, I may give it a try.

Thanks for your help. 

Edited March 21, 2022 by sobe

[Bunny Clark]

4 hours ago, sobe said:

I may try to do the TEDAC myself.  I looked at your Json file and if I knew where to get items like the deviceid (I think I know where that is), actionid, stopactionid, and stuff like that, I may give it a try.

Most everything you need is in DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\aircraft\AH-64D\Cockpit\Scripts

"id" is in clickabledata.lua, "deviceid" is in devices.lua, "actionid" / pushid" is in command_def.lua.

You can also find some argument values in default.lua in DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\aircraft\AH-64D\Input\AH-64D_PLT\joystick

I found this tutorial from Zeen to be super helpful: 

 

[sobe]

Bunny Clark

It looks to me that not only will we need two monitor config files, but also two Helios profile files, one for the pilot and one for the CPG.  As a test, I tried to use the pilot MFD buttons that I assigned from your Json file, but they did not work in the MFD CPG cockpit.    I guess they have different deviceId numbers.  Perhaps a copy/paste from the pilot list and just change the deviceId numbers?  I think the pilot id's are 42 and 43 so perhaps the CPG deviceId's would be 44 and 45 based on the list in devices.lua.  Double work.  PERHAPS ONE JSON FILE AND ONE LARGE HELIOS PROFILE FILE CAN BE USED THAT INCLUDES ALL 4 MFD CODING.  WHAT DO YOU THINK?

Also, I did find some of the numbers needed to do the Json file, but not all of them.  It is definitely a migraine problem and may just be beyond my limited ability.  

Edited March 21, 2022 by sobe
LAST SENTENCE IN FIRST PARAGRAPH ADDED

[Bunny Clark]

I've been brainstorming that a bit myself too. My Helios profile right now includes both CPG and Pilot seats with a toggle button that switches on and off the different MFDs, KU, EUFD, and so forth. How well that actually works is going to be dependent on how ED implements display exports and if it'll switch which displays are being exported by seat. 

[sobe]

Bunny Clark

1.  So far, the TEDAC buttons that I have tried and believe are implemented work fine. 

2.  Interesting, the Keyboard works in both the Pilot and CPG seats but not the MFDs.

3.  I believe that ultimately, we are going to need two Helios profiles, but who knows.  Your idea of toggle buttons is interesting, but we will just have to wait and see.

4  Do you agree that I can copy/paste the MFD json commands and just change the deviceId from 42 to 44 and 43 to 45?

PS:  I also believe that if I copy/paste the MFDs, besides changing the deviceId number, perhaps the device name should be change from Left MFD to CPG Left MFD to avoid confusion when assigning commands to the buttons if I end up using one large json file.

Edited March 21, 2022 by sobe
added ps

[Bunny Clark]

46 minutes ago, sobe said:

4  Do you agree that I can copy/paste the MFD json commands and just change the deviceId from 42 to 44 and 43 to 45?

PS:  I also believe that if I copy/paste the MFDs, besides changing the deviceId number, perhaps the device name should be change from Left MFD to CPG Left MFD to avoid confusion when assigning commands to the buttons if I end up using one large json file.

 

I don't know, I haven't looked into it. The ActionIDs are shared between all the MPDs so those are easy, the DeviceID will for sure need to change but is the same for the entire MFD, the button ID is what I am not sure of, those may or may not be different for every button.

The device name should absolutely change, or you won't be able to tell them apart in Helios. That will probably blow up all the existing Pilot MPD binds since I don't think I named them with adding CPG displays in mind. I have been considering making two different Interfaces for the Pilot and CPG, but I think keeping it all in one makes the most sense.

[Bunny Clark]

Big changes to the AH-64 interface. It now includes the Pilot and CPG MFDs, Pilot and CPG EUFDs, Pilot and CPG KUs, Pilot and CPG Lighting Panels, and the TEDAC. Everything is working DCS to Helios, though I haven't been able to crack getting Helios to read DCS switch and axis states. Unfortunately, this will also break any profiles you've built with previous versions of the Interface, as I renamed everything to make more sense with different Pilot and CPG controls in the same Interface. You'll just need to reassign all the buttons in Helios.

I'm having luck with a single Profile that has a button to toggle between the Pilot and CPG seats. This works by toggling the "Hidden" state for every panel - at start all the Pilot panels are visible and the CPG panels are hidden, hitting the button swaps all of those. Display exports are still a mess until ED fixes them, so right now I can only see Pilot screens, but at least all the buttons work. 

DCS.AH-64D.hif.json

[sobe]

How come the TEDAC screen does not appear in the CPG cockpit?

Are the button commands in the lower right screen above included-I could not find them.  Don't I need those buttons to switch cockpits so I can code the MFDs separately for the pilot and CPG?

 

 

 

Edited March 22, 2022 by sobe

[Bunny Clark]

2 hours ago, sobe said:

How come the TEDAC screen does not appear in the CPG cockpit?

Because the way DCS is doing screen exports right now there's no way to turn it off in the Pilot seat and it would blow up the EUFD. Since I'm spending most of my time in the Pilot's seat, I've prioritized screen exports for that. All the buttons on the TEDAC work, just not the screen export from DCS.

Quote

Are the button commands in the lower right screen above included-I could not find them.  Don't I need those buttons to switch cockpits so I can code the MFDs separately for the pilot and CPG?

None of them are using the DCS Interface. The Kneeboard buttons just send the default keyboard commands for toggling the kneeboard and changing pages. The Pilot / CPG button is a Helios-only button that toggles panel hiding, it doesn't talk to DCS at all. 

[sobe]

I could not find this button in your interface list:  "The Pilot / CPG button is a Helios-only button that toggles panel hiding, it doesn't talk to DCS at all."   Is this a button you did or must I do it in helios that will trigger the hidden panels (which always gives me problems)? I assume that once I find/figure out how to do this button, I can then code the Pilot MFDs etc and separately code the CPG MFDs etc? 

BTW, I renamed your latest interface so I can still keep your prior interface that I have already coded for the pilot.  AH-64D AND NAH-64D.

How does Helios know which MFD I am coding-pilot or CPG?  Do I code each MFD button for both the pilot and cpg so that it will work in either cockpit.  Sorry if these questions may sound silly, but I am getting confused.  I may just want to go with 2 helios profies-one for each seat to keep things simple-although not the greatest solution.

Edited March 23, 2022 by sobe

[Bunny Clark]

7 hours ago, sobe said:

I could not find this button in your interface list:  "The Pilot / CPG button is a Helios-only button that toggles panel hiding, it doesn't talk to DCS at all."   Is this a button you did or must I do it in helios that will trigger the hidden panels (which always gives me problems)? I assume that once I find/figure out how to do this button, I can then code the Pilot MFDs etc and separately code the CPG MFDs etc? 

The Interface only has one job - to translate between Helios and DCS. Functions that don't need to be sent to DCS, like hiding and un-hiding objects within the Helios profile, aren't on the Interface list because there is no DCS function for them to perform. DCS doesn't care if the TEDAC is visible on your touchscreen or not, only if one of the buttons on it is pressed. 

Quote

How does Helios know which MFD I am coding-pilot or CPG?  Do I code each MFD button for both the pilot and cpg so that it will work in either cockpit.  Sorry if these questions may sound silly, but I am getting confused.  I may just want to go with 2 helios profies-one for each seat to keep things simple-although not the greatest solution.

You'll need to create two pairs of MFDs, one pair for the Pilot and another pair for the CPG. Then assign buttons to them from the Interface per their role. In my photos of my setup it looks like the Pilot and CPG MFDs are the same thing, but they're not, they're two copies of the same thing. In Helios the Pilot setup has two MFDs and the CPG setup has two MFDs, they're 4 separate panels. 

[Soyouz2000]

Hello Bunny Clark, 

Could tell us how you've created the .json file.
I made the profile for the A4, but the .json file was already created by Derammo (in Helios). I had to updated it, but i'm very interested to know how to create one for a new module.
Thanks

Edited March 23, 2022 by Soyouz2000

[Bunny Clark]

1 hour ago, Soyouz2000 said:

Hello Bunny Clark, 

Could tell us how you've created the .json file.

I started a while ago with fixing up some problems I've been having with the Hornet and Viper Interface, during which I learned the format of the file and where to find the needed data in the DCS files. I mostly relied on Zeen's tutorials and just trial and error. 

Using that experience, I just started writing a new file from scratch for the Apache. I'm not a programmer, I'm just good and poking things and figuring out how they work.

[Bunny Clark]

Another update to the Interface, and I'm happy enough with my Profile now to share it as well. 

Added to the Interface: Pilot and CPG Master Warning/Caution panel, Pilot and CPG Arm/Safe panel, IHADSS Video panel.

I also solved the issue with DCS communicating with Helios, so it'll sync switch and axis positions now.

My Profile files, extract to Documents\Helios\

DCS.AH-64D.hif.json Bunnys AH-64 Helios Profile.zip

[sobe]

This looks great; however, any chance you could publish your monitor config file (I know it is going to be different from mine but I can use it for a reference) and the viewport names that you used for the various init lua files?

 

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by sobe
added ()

[Bunny Clark]

35 minutes ago, sobe said:

any chance you could publish your monitor config file

Sure, it's kinda a mess right now to get the Apache working. It'll make the Pilot screens work, disable the CPG screens, and break any other modules using the LEFT and RIGHT MFCD viewports. 

Helios Touch.lua

[sobe]

Bunny

You are much more advanced than I am.  However, I took your prior json file and created a single monitor config file and a single Helios profile that worked for both the Pilot and CPG seats.  In order to do so, I had to put the CPG MFDs in the HUD, but double coded the MFD buttons so they worked for both the Pilot and CPG MFDs.   When in the CPG seat, the MFDs in the HUD as well as the TEDAC work.  In the pilot seat, the MFDs in the second screen work and of course the TEDAC goes blank.  I have a headache just thinking about this.