Impressive Loadouts

[topol-m]

It uses an EFP to penetrate armour rather than a kenetic penetrator.

 

It is explosively formed penetrator. But it actually penetrates with kinetic energy it itself doesn`t explode.

 

If the Taleban/Iraqi insurgent groups can make and EFP IED that can penetrate armour on modern NATO IFVs and occasionally MBTs is it so hard to believe we can?

 

Chech out the size of the IEDs and check out the size of the submunitions.

 

Edit: in fact the small the submunitions are they are not important for the energy of the EFP. It`s the skeets that are important and they are even tinier.

Edited September 3, 2010 by topol-m

[Eddie]

It is explosively formed penetrator. But it actually penetrates with kinetic energy it itself doesn`t explode.

 

I'm aware of that, I'll admit my reply was badly worded, blame lack of sleep. Don't forget that a stream of molten copper or other metal will penetrate armour better than a solid kinetic penetrator.

 

Chech out the size of the IEDs and check out the size of the submunitions.

 

I have checked them out, in fact I've seen both types in the real world on many occasions, as well as the effects they have of vehicles. EFP IEDs are generally quite small in terms of explosive weight, the large IEDs are normally simple artillery shells and the like wired to a command wire/PIR sensor/pressure pad.

 

Obviously the submunitions won't decimate an armoured vehicle like several hundred pounds of IED, or even penetrate the armour around the crew compartment of a modern MBT in most cases, but they will certainly defeat the armour surrounding the engine bay and other areas. You don't have to cause that much damage to remove an IFV/MBT from the fight.

 

The BLU-108 has seen action in Iraq and the Balkans and proved very succesful against all types of armoured vehicles. While isn't never been used against an M1A2/Challenger 2 class MBT, as I said previously other EFP weapons have been used against those vehicles and succesfully disabled them. There is no reason it couldn't do the job, after all, it's what they were designed for.

 

When it comes to explosives, it's not just the amount that counts, it's how it's used that really matters.

 

EDIT:

 

And don't forget you've got 40 skeets per CBU-97 coming down, so more than one will be hitting any given target.

[topol-m]

Obviously the submunitions won't decimate an armoured vehicle like several hundred pounds of IED, or even penetrate the armour around the crew compartment of a modern MBT in most cases, but they will certainly defeat the armour surrounding the engine bay and other areas. You don't have to cause that much damage to remove an IFV/MBT from the fight.

 

The BLU-108 has seen action in Iraq and the Balkans and proved very succesful against all types of armoured vehicles. While isn't never been used against an M1A2/Challenger 2 class MBT, as I said previously other EFP weapons have been used against those vehicles and succesfully disabled them. There is no reason it couldn't do the job, after all, it's what they were designed for.

 

When it comes to explosives, it's not just the amount that counts, it's how it's used that really matters.

 

I have yet to see a modern (Leo 2/M1A2/T-90/Challenger 2/etc.) MBT damaged by a CBU-97 EFP to believe it. When you compare the CBU-97`s EFP to an APFSDS or a RPG-29 warhead for instance you will see what I mean, it looks microscopic. I don`t underestimate its ability to penetrate armored targets but an APC is nowhere near a MBT in terms of armor protection. I`d like to see a modern MBT disabled by such small EFP. SO far I`ve seen only videos of CBU-97 being tested on APCs and old tanks exploding all around them but let`s get a closer look at the damage after that... And i`m not interested in the holes in the trucks and APCs. :)

 

 

When it comes to explosives, it's not just the amount that counts, it's how it's used that really matters.

 

And what is the special thing in using these? An explosion accelerating the penetrator, which hits the target. Nothing

too fancy here.

 

 

And don't forget you've got 40 skeets per CBU-97 coming down, so more than one will be hitting any given target.

 

This will have zero significance. The EFP makes a small hole. With the dispersion the chance of another EFP entering exactly the same place is... well a little bit larger than zero.

Edited September 3, 2010 by topol-m

[Eddie]

Well I've seen an EFP charge roughly the same size as a BLU-108 skeet cut through 200mm of steel like a knife through butter. So I have no problem believing they could cut though the relatively light armour surrounding a modern MBTs engine compartment and take out the engine itself. As for the crew compartment, maybe, maybe not.

 

If they can take out T-72s, I see no reason they can't score a mobility kill on a Chally 2/Abrams, after all if multiple RPG-7s can score a weapons system/sensors kill on a Chally 2, why shouldn't a much more advanced system be able to do the same.

 

This will have zero significance. The EFP makes a small hole. With the dispersion the chance of another EFP entering exactly the same place is... well a little bit larger than zero.

 

You don't need to hit the same place, you only need to hit a soft spot as I've said, the more submunition you have in area the more likely that is to happen.

Edited September 3, 2010 by Eddie

[topol-m]

If they can take out T-72s, I see no reason they can't score a mobility kill on a Chally 2/Abrams, after all if multiple RPG-7s can score a weapons system/sensors kill on a Chally 2, why shouldn't a much more advanced system be able to do the same.

 

You don't need to hit the same place, you only need to hit a soft spot as I've said, the more submunition you have in area the more likely that is to happen.

 

I agree it can make a sensors kill, but that`s not difficult to do at all. Now about mobility or weapons system kill... And about being advanced system, yes it is a very advanced system in terms of delivery, targeting and hitting multiple targets at once but don`t forget what RPG-7 has as well. Being granpa doesn`t mean it can`t bite and bite it can very well. For instance I would consider its tandem warhead grenade much better than the CBU-97`s EFP when it comes to dealing with ERA. It is designed to be more effective against ERA. You can`t say the same for the EFP though.

 

You don't need to hit the same place, you only need to hit a soft spot as I've said, the more submunition you have in area the more likely that is to happen.

 

The question is are these spots weak enough for the EFP to do significant damage.

Edited September 3, 2010 by topol-m

[mvsgas]

[mvsgas]

old but good

[zakobi]

 

18 missiles :D

Edited September 16, 2010 by zakobi

[MoGas]

B1-R with 20x AIM-120D

 

 

:bye_2:

[topol-m]

B1-R with 20x AIM-120D

 

 

:bye_2:

 

Impressive, but is this an actual program or it has been suspended?

[MoGas]

Impressive, but is this an actual program or it has been suspended?

 

I guess this is suspended by Gates already...

 

Maybe it would work on the B-1B as well, if nothing else would be there?

[zakobi]

B1-R with 20x AIM-120D

 

 

:bye_2:

 

Talking about spammram :music_whistling: