Upcoming advanced DCS tech and appropriate computer hardware

[DaveSD]

This is a two part post.

First, if I've posted this in the wrong area or it's been covered elsewhere (I did do a search), I apologize. So with the upcoming overhauls to DCS software that will allow advanced rendering that takes advantage of new tech (multi-threading being one of them, I guess), are there general recommendations I should consider when shopping for a new computer? Although I built a PC more than 20 years ago, I wouldn't consider myself an expert in this field. I'm okay with buying something already built or building my own. I know there are guides online for generic gaming computers, but I'm asking about anything that would be particularly well-suited for DCS. Any suggestions? I almost certainly wouldn't be using VR, just head tracking.

Second, I posted essentially the same thing you see above earlier today and it's gone. Did I somehow break forum rules? I read through them and nothing stood out as being problematic according to the rules. I would assume admins would either issue a warning, or in especially bad cases, would remove the content and issue a warning. Nothing like that came through, so... Glitch? Rogue admin? Problem with my browser that's causing my post ot not be seen? I've never had a post deleted before. And in my first post I did apologize in advance if I'd asked about something already covered or posted it in the wrong place. I looked for appropriate places and didnt see anything, and I didn't get many search results when I checked before posting.

Thank you,

Dave

[Dragon1-1]

It was likely not deleted, new users' posts sometimes have to be approved by a moderator. This is mostly to keep spambots down. Also, check the hardware board, someone might have moved it there, because it's a thread about hardware. In fact, if you post there you'll get more responses from people who know

Me, I'm setting up an interim system based around a Ryzen 5800X3D on a B450 motherboard (an outdated chipset, but it does what I want), my current 1080ti, and a pair of fast, low latency RAM sticks for 32GB in total. I'm hoping this will be a good system for flying in VR, although it won't be able to take advantage of DLSS due to the old GPU. I might upgrade again after my economic situation improves, this will be a remarkably inexpensive setup. 

Once I have the money, I want a latest i7 or i9 CPU (or maybe a high end Ryzen with 3D cache, if the 5800X3D works out), 64GB of RAM, whatever is the best bang for buck GPU I can get, and a custom water cooling loop to top it all off. However, this is far in the future. I fully expect the rig I'm building to last me a good long while.

[DaveSD]

Thanks, @Dragon1-1. I didn't see a hardware board, but I guess I just didn't poke around enough. I've got the specs you mentioned saved in a text file so when the time comes - hopefully soon - I'll start doing some serious shopping.

Dave

[BodyOrgan]

@Dragon1-1I think you're going to like the 5800X3D. I upgraded to it from a store bought i7 6800K and GTX 1080. With the 2.8 update I was reduced to 15-20 fps at low to medium settings at 1080 resolution. Just updating to the 5800X3D alone gave me 100 fps... I couldn't believe it.

 

 

[Dragon1-1]

That's what I'm expecting, and that's why I've decided to spend money now instead of saving up for increasingly expensive latest gen tech. I do consider it a stopgap of sorts, seeing as it has no room to grow, the only thing I could do is to expand the memory and storage (although I fully intent to put it in a cheap, but snazzy-looking case, complete with RGB fans and a huge glass pane for admiring the innards). DCS is pretty heavily limited by CPU, and that one has a 3D cache that does more in that regard than raw clock speed. Plus, I'm upgrading from a 4770k and 16GB of DDR3 RAM. There's no way I'm not going to see massive improvements in performance over that dinosaur with something remotely modern.  

[Lurker]

I went with the i5 13600k over the 5800X3D. Still waiting for my new motherboard to arrive , but in most benchmarking scenarios, especially with multithreaded games, the i5 comes out on top. A lot of recent games seem to like the big cache on the X3D chips, but the even newer engines seem to like more physical cores even more. I was skeptical of the P + E core configuration of the new Intel chips but they seem to work really well now. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Lurker

[DaveSD]

On 1/10/2023 at 1:18 AM, Lurker said:

I went with the i5 13600k over the 5800X3D. Still waiting for my new motherboard to arrive , but in most benchmarking scenarios, especially with multithreaded games, the i5 comes out on top. A lot of recent games seem to like the big cache on the X3D chips, but the even newer engines seem to like more physical cores even more. I was skeptical of the P + E core configuration of the new Intel chips but they seem to work really well now. 

 

Thanks Lurker! All this stuff is going into a text file I'm building for when the time comes to buy.

[SharpeXB]

When selecting a CPU you’ll want to look for one with the fastest single core performance. This still matters even though DCS will eventually support multi core. Basically something from the top of this list. 
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

[Lurker]

33 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

When selecting a CPU you’ll want to look for one with the fastest single core performance. This still matters even though DCS will eventually support multi core. Basically something from the top of this list. 
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

I would never look at synthetic benchmarks as anything other than guidelines. Especially for gaming. You need real world performance, and you can get that only from reliable gaming enthusiast sites and content creators. 

This particular table is especially bad. 

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

I would never look at synthetic benchmarks as anything other than guidelines. Especially for gaming. You need real world performance, and you can get that only from reliable gaming enthusiast sites and content creators. 

This particular table is especially bad. 

Well that’s what it is, a guideline. I don’t know how you’d expect to see any broad evaluation otherwise. A CPU that performs well here will certainly do well in games or DCS. Honestly trying to search random sites is a goose chase and any of those enthusiast etc probably aren’t running DCS. Bottom line is you can’t go wrong with the stuff at the top of this list. And again what you’re looking for is single thread performance.

Heres another one. Again basically showing you the same lineup 

https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks

This is the sort of site that’s trouble to look at for DCS

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-cpus,3986.html

“Overall best CPU for gaming”. What sort of game? Chances are it’s not a CPU heavy game like this sim. An i5-12400 is way down on the list for the one attribute that matters here. It’s not terrible but it’s not the “best”

Edited January 16, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Lurker]

I'm sorry but a site that lists the i3-12300 as better rated than an AMD Ryzen 9 5900X can't be trusted. At all. This siteand it's synthetic benchmarks are complete BS. And the two others you listed are not much better. Tom's Hardware used to be one of the best sites around, 10 years ago. Now I can't trust them to write a single review. 

Single threaded performance is King in DCS now, that much is true. But for proper benchmarks look at youtube channels like Gamer's Nexus or JayZay2Cents, at least they take the time to benchmark games directly. 

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

I'm sorry but a site that lists the i3-12300 as better rated than an AMD Ryzen 9 5900X can't be trusted. At all. This siteand it's synthetic benchmarks are complete BS. And the two others you listed are not much better. Tom's Hardware used to be one of the best sites around, 10 years ago. Now I can't trust them to write a single review. 

Single threaded performance is King in DCS now, that much is true. But for proper benchmarks look at youtube channels like Gamer's Nexus or JayZay2Cents, at least they take the time to benchmark games directly. 

It’s also possible that you’re completely wrong. How is it that all these tests aren’t valid? This is looking at a benchmark of the CPU, not a particular game. But the relative performance you see in one of these is also going to be relative to the game as well. Unless you have some actual information you’re just speculating. YouTube channels aren’t going to test and list every one of these here so that doesn’t help anyone much trying to make an informed decision.  
The point here about single thread performance is that it’s important now and in the future when DCS gets multi core. Don’t lose sight of that when looking for one. 

[Lurker]

22 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

It’s also possible that you’re completely wrong. 

Okay, so one of the best gaming chips released ever, probably the best of the last generation (and proven to be especially great in DCS World) is according to this benchmark beaten by an entry level i3. Sure. I'm wrong. 

Edited January 17, 2023 by Lurker

[SharpeXB]

21 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Okay, so one of the best gaming chips released ever, probably the best of the last generation (and proven to be especially great in DCS World) is according to this benchmark beaten by an entry level i3. Sure. I'm wrong. 

Do you have any actual data that indicates otherwise? The Geekbench test seems to rank them a bit different. They seem nearly equal though. The point is that it’s important to look at single core speed for sims like DCS. The only practical way you have of evaluating this is to looks at benchmarks like this. 

Edited January 17, 2023 by SharpeXB