BVR radar missiles tactics

[Yuriks]

A bit confused on BVR tactics  

"Stay lower than target, turn 90 digress from bandit radar for effective notching"

vs

"turn away from missile, full power"

vs

"Stay higher to have higher energy state,  and longer radar range. "

How to combine those tactics?

Edited February 5, 2023 by Yuriks

[Exorcet]

Here is one way to combine them:

 

Start high and fast, then shoot

After shooting dive and turn away

Maintain missile lock as long as needed, then turn 90 degrees or more to avoid incoming missiles.

[Yuriks]

shooting from above the target means radar sees it against the ground making it easy to notch

[Aquorys]

3 hours ago, Yuriks said:

A bit confused on BVR tactics  

"Stay lower than target, turn 90 digress from bandit radar for effective notching"

vs

"turn away from missel, full power"

vs

"Stay higher to have higher energy state,  and longer radar range. "

How to combine those tactics?

It depends. In general, if you engage a target, you should have a tactical advantage. In most cases that includes being able to make a more effective shot than your opponent, and that depends on the performance of the aircraft, the systems, including radar, and the missile.

In general, you should be high and fast in most situations, and you should maneuver to deny your opponent an effective shot until you are ready to shoot. Then you maneuver for an ideal ballistic firing solution for the missile that you are going to fire, if the situation allows it. After shooting, you maneuver to defeat any shot that your opponent may have taken at you, or to deny your opponent an effective shot. That typically includes a crank maneuver with a vertical component and if deemed necessary, a split-S to transition to a drag, or a horizontal maneuver with a similar outcome.

Simply turning away and flying fast is less effective than proper maneuvering, and the same goes for notching, unless your only remaining chance is for the missile to lose track.

Staying lower than your target is only a good idea if it comes with a really strong advantage, and that would typically be either due to your radar's performance, or due to your opponent radar's performance. If your radar does not have look-down/shoot-down capabilities, making it look up may be the only chance to get a reliable track, however, if your opponent's radar does not have that same problem, you have the tactical disadvantage with regards to your energy state and your missile's ballistics. If your opponent's radar does not have look-down/shoot-down capabilities, then staying lower could deny your opponent a reliable track, making the opponent unable to fire at you. In this case, you still have an energy & ballistics disadvantage, but if you can hit your opponent, and he can't hit you, it should be irrelevant. Things can change quickly though if something goes wrong, or if you misjudge your opponent's capabilities.

At very high altitudes, some additional factors (mostly maneuverability and energy management) will have an influence on the ideal altitude during various phases of the engagement.

Summary: It's complicated.

[Exorcet]

1 hour ago, Yuriks said:

shooting from above the target means radar sees it against the ground making it easy to notch

This is airframe dependent. Modern radars have lookdown capability and aren't bothered much by ground clutter. The ED radars are an exception, but ED has said they will revise these radar, so I expect them to improve. Even with current ED radars, you can still attack from above, you just need to maintain a shallow angle. As soon as you've launched a missile, you no longer need to stay high (although sometimes it's good to retain height) and can dive, removing concerns about lookdown and ground clutter.

If you happen to be in a plane that has look down issues, then you will need to descend. Starting high can still be an advantage though, as you can trade altitude for speed. Flying higher also generally helps range and endurance.

If you're looking for a perfect situation to start off every engagement, you're not going to find it. If the other plane you're trying to fight is good, it will try to make problems for you. Your job is to find advantages to use for your own gain and to create problems for your adversary. You listed a few common tactics in your first post, instead of trying to blindly apply them, determine if they are feasible in your current situation and which would provide the largest advantage to you. BVR is complex and dynamic, you can't boil it down to a simple 3 step process and learn it in a day.

[Mike_Romeo]

17 hours ago, Yuriks said:

A bit confused on BVR tactics  

"Stay lower than target, turn 90 digress from bandit radar for effective notching"

vs

"turn away from missel, full power"

vs

"Stay higher to have higher energy state,  and longer radar range. "

How to combine those tactics?

Read this: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ytii9JWW2LXyAXDMYs6BiLfJy8K4cB09/view

[Aquorys]

@Yuriks what aircraft are you flying?

[Yuriks]

15 hours ago, Mike_Romeo said:

Read this: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ytii9JWW2LXyAXDMYs6BiLfJy8K4cB09/view

thank you, impressive work by 57

7 hours ago, Aquorys said:

@Yuriks what aircraft are you flying?

Learning Hornet

[Aquorys]

11 hours ago, Yuriks said:

Learning Hornet

I created a couple BVR training missions for the F-16 a while ago, but I guess I could easily adapt them for the F/A-18.

[SharpeXB]

One of the things I try to not be mislead by are the YouTubers. You gotta realize they’re in staged fights with their friends on closed servers. What you see there just won’t be too applicable to real gameplay, either SP or MP.