Which open formation types can the AI actually fly well?

[twistking]

Hello,
i am currently learning "proper" USAF formations and assosciated tactics. For practicing in single player, i made a mission with different friendly AI 2-ships flying around NTTR in different formations for me to "join" them. However i only get the AI flight to hold formation properly during turns in formations that have wingman turn with "fingertip-reference" a.k.a. very close formations where wingman does NOT stay in the same plane of motion.

On more open formations where DCS AI tries to turn on the same POM as lead, it always seems to fail in the turn, leaving it's position and bumbling about until finally getting back on course and catching up. This looks stupid and is of course absolutely not usable as a reference for training...

My question is, if you have found formation types and setting combination (formation details, airspeed, maybe min/max turn radii, turn type) where the AI does not bug out when doing turns in a single plane of motion?
I would like the AI to fly close "Echelon" (single POM), ROUTE formation (open, single POM), TACTICAL ("relaxed line abreast", very open, single POM). The only formations i could get to work were "group close" where wingman holds full reference to lead, but that's only realistic for fingertip formation (weather penetration, show-formation).

Help!

[Grimes]

I did a thorough test on this. Usually no4 has the most extreme behaviors. Look for the more uniformity in their paths for the "best" at formation keeping behavior. 

https://imgur.com/a/TLFegLW

[twistking]

21 hours ago, Grimes said:

I did a thorough test on this. Usually no4 has the most extreme behaviors. Look for the more uniformity in their paths for the "best" at formation keeping behavior. 

https://imgur.com/a/TLFegLW

Great! That looks very scientific. I'll have a look... Thanks!

[twistking]

@Grimes your "research" was very helpful. thanks again.

however the thing i'm still missing is a somewhat close formation that turns within the same POM. it seems that in every close formationt hat i tried, the AI keeps lead reference and does a "airshow" turn. do you know if there is a close formation type where AI turns while keeping lead on the horizon line? from my understanding that is the more common way to fly formations outside of airshows and weather penetration... in DCS this seems to only happen in open formations though...

[Grimes]

Spread 4 maybe? 

In general the AI formation behavior is quite sub-par with all of the elevation changes they go through. Really with there was a way for them to do in place turns, but whatever. 

[twistking]

57 minutes ago, Grimes said:

Spread 4 maybe? 

In general the AI formation behavior is quite sub-par with all of the elevation changes they go through. Really with there was a way for them to do in place turns, but whatever. 

oh, you are right. thanks. just tested it. actually i forgot, if i tested with spread 4 or finger 4, but when set to "open" instead of "close" AI does turn in a single POM. "Open" on the spread and finger formations is still relatively close. The only unfortunate thing is, that both finger variants have the #2 on the right while orbit tasks always turn lefthand... and AI turns better when inside the turn... oh well... DCS... now we need righthander orbit tasks... or better AI, or both...

Edited June 16, 2023 by twistking