What can you kill with A/G gun?

[PawlaczGMD]

I've had no luck killing even lightly armored targets with the Hornet gun. What kind of armor penetration is it supposed to have, and what kind of targets would you recommend attacking?

For example, the BTR-80 which has I believe only 10 mm of armor cannot be hurt by the gun. I was also barely scratching the SCUD, which seems like it should be a completely soft target. I've tried both the default HEI ammo, as well as the PGU SAP rounds, but it looks like anything more than a truck is a struggle. Is there a trick to it, or should I not bother with such targets?

 

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Trucks are fine. I can kill SCUD. I am not sure about IFV and some other AFVs, this is a good topic for experiments. Anyway, if I want to kill a ground object with gun, my sole go to choice is the A-10.

Edited July 5, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[AndrewDCS2005]

Good topic for some research and experiments! M61A2 installed on F/A-18C is a 20mm gun, with the PGU-28A/B semi-armor piercing 20mm munition (100g projectile with 1050m/s muzzle velocity) as the only option against light armor. 

Here's what I got with 6000 shots per minute rate of fire, in a shallow 25-30% dive, side/rear/front aspect attacks, with two 2-3s bursts on each target:

- killed BTR-80 and BTR-82A, bunch of MLRS and MTLB

- BTR-RD, BMP-1/2/3, BMD1, BRDM2 have zero damage like if nothing happened.

 

Track and mission attached (endless ammo and fuel just to speed up the test).

fa18-gun-range.trk F18-gun-range.miz

Edited July 5, 2024 by AndrewDCS2005

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

I can kill SCUD, ER and even AMX-13, but no any BMP, not even WW2 stuff like M4, PzIVH... Video later.

I am going to try those with 30mm if it is any better.

Edited July 5, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

OT: 30mm on Ka-50 and MiG-29 work on BMP-1 & 2, not 3, and not to mention the WW2 antiques...

Edited July 5, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[PawlaczGMD]

1 hour ago, VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants said:

OT: 30mm on Ka-50 and MiG-29 work on BMP-1 & 2, not 3, and not to mention the WW2 antiques...

 

Oh yeah for sure!

7 hours ago, AndrewDCS2005 said:

Good topic for some research and experiments! M61A2 installed on F/A-18C is a 20mm gun, with the PGU-28A/B semi-armor piercing 20mm munition (100g projectile with 1050m/s muzzle velocity) as the only option against light armor. 

Here's what I got with 6000 shots per minute rate of fire, in a shallow 25-30% dive, side/rear/front aspect attacks, with two 2-3s bursts on each target:

- killed BTR-80 and BTR-82A, bunch of MLRS and MTLB

- BTR-RD, BMP-1/2/3, BMD1, BRDM2 have zero damage like if nothing happened.

 

Track and mission attached (endless ammo and fuel just to speed up the test).

fa18-gun-range.trk 7.58 MB · 3 downloads F18-gun-range.miz 10.71 kB · 1 download

 

You might be getting much better results then me by getting in real close. I was testing it in combat, so I was shooting just after the in range cue and rolling out. Reduced distance might push the penetration over the edge, interesting.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Some hard target (sorry pun intended) really need to get up close, because the velocity of the round, which translates to its kinetic energy, is less dragged down by the air it goes through.. And part of the penetration equation depends of the velocity of the round hitting the armour,  closer range helps.

Big gorram fun time last night trying this or that, like snipping a BMP-2 at a range of 2.9 kicks hovering at 4m from a Ka-50III with onboard cannon, before being shot down by a BMP-3. Oh well, read my signature.

Videos under editing, I am not sure you will love it, but I have enjoyed.

Edited July 6, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[AndrewDCS2005]

For PGU-28, the impact energy (0.5*v^2*m, where velocity is higher at closer range) should not play a role. The spec by manufacturer says

>Projectile Material: Hardened steel with aluminum nose cap

Aluminum nose is not what penetrates the target, but the shaped charge inside of it - see the projectile cut here. Nose is hollow anyway and filled with incendiary mix. So it does not matter at which speed the projectile hits, as it immediately discharges on impact.

My conclusion - Hornet A2G gun is only effective against non-armored targets. I don't recall IRL fighter stories which would mention successful use against armor, but happy to be corrected

Edited July 6, 2024 by AndrewDCS2005

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Videos:

 

 

 

 

Edited July 6, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[PawlaczGMD]

17 hours ago, AndrewDCS2005 said:

For PGU-28, the impact energy (0.5*v^2*m, where velocity is higher at closer range) should not play a role. The spec by manufacturer says

>Projectile Material: Hardened steel with aluminum nose cap

Aluminum nose is not what penetrates the target, but the shaped charge inside of it - see the projectile cut here. Nose is hollow anyway and filled with incendiary mix. So it does not matter at which speed the projectile hits, as it immediately discharges on impact.

My conclusion - Hornet A2G gun is only effective against non-armored targets. I don't recall IRL fighter stories which would mention successful use against armor, but happy to be corrected

 

For sure it is not doctrine or even a good idea to strafe with the gun in the Hornet, but regardless, it seems that the PGU projectiles are not modelled correctly if your description is right, as their energy seems to matter a lot.

This does have a use in the game, as we don't always have a large package with dedicated CAS roles, so you might want to finish some targets off.

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

A bit off-topic: some time when there is a soft TOO, and your office has run out of heavier munition or you want to save it, a gun onboard could be quite handy. And I found F-15E was a bit less than full when its A/G gun mode was not fully functional at first.