Why Campaigns (generally) aren't as fun as they could be

[Slick Twitchy]

Don't get me wrong I keep coming back to campaigns. I don't play multiplayer, and single missions don't satisfy that "I am a real combat pilot" feeling. But here are some of my criticisms-with some solutions that I think are feasible. I know there are a bunch of solutions that really boil down to "put more time and energy into the game" but sheeeesh I have spent more time learning this game than I spent with my kids (who are all in jail and addicted to various drugs due to my parental negligence-kidding they're pretty badass)

1. I don't know what the other pilots/FAC/AWAC are saying-I have figured out the F-18 generally, but when I drop into a campaign, and the FAC, AWACs are telling me stuff I don't get it- I LOVE the succinctness and specificity of military parlance-but many times (I'm talking to you Arctic Thunder) I don't understand what I am being tasked to do-esp if I have to fly off pre-planned flightplan-SOLUTION-put a dumb downed Text message next to the message texts with simple language;

2. I spend A LOT of time getting to the interesting part of the mission, screw it up then die. Then have to reload and (at minimum) watch the whole boring part at 3 x speed -which seems to take longer than just manually flying it. I absolutely want that "boring" part-it adds so much to the game and is fun ONCE (maybe twice) but I'm that terrible of a pilot and it can take 5-6 times to complete. Solution-Quick Save-Once per mission you should be able to do a Quick Save-then after failing the mission the game should give you an option to start at that point.

3. I LOVE DCS-and I love campaigns and will always buy and play them-but the fun is mitigated sometimes by the above.

[Dangerzone]

2 hours ago, Slick Twitchy said:

Don't get me wrong I keep coming back to campaigns. I don't play multiplayer, and single missions don't satisfy that "I am a real combat pilot" feeling. But here are some of my criticisms-with some solutions that I think are feasible. I know there are a bunch of solutions that really boil down to "put more time and energy into the game" but sheeeesh I have spent more time learning this game than I spent with my kids (who are all in jail and addicted to various drugs due to my parental negligence-kidding they're pretty badass)

1. I don't know what the other pilots/FAC/AWAC are saying-I have figured out the F-18 generally, but when I drop into a campaign, and the FAC, AWACs are telling me stuff I don't get it- I LOVE the succinctness and specificity of military parlance-but many times (I'm talking to you Arctic Thunder) I don't understand what I am being tasked to do-esp if I have to fly off pre-planned flightplan-SOLUTION-put a dumb downed Text message next to the message texts with simple language;

2. I spend A LOT of time getting to the interesting part of the mission, screw it up then die. Then have to reload and (at minimum) watch the whole boring part at 3 x speed -which seems to take longer than just manually flying it. I absolutely want that "boring" part-it adds so much to the game and is fun ONCE (maybe twice) but I'm that terrible of a pilot and it can take 5-6 times to complete. Solution-Quick Save-Once per mission you should be able to do a Quick Save-then after failing the mission the game should give you an option to start at that point.

3. I LOVE DCS-and I love campaigns and will always buy and play them-but the fun is mitigated sometimes by the above.

Fair points you raise. The save game one I don't see happening. ED have made their save game feature, and it seems to have revealed that they're going with the same approach that other community contributors used with already mostly existing functionality - as opposed to redeveloping from the ground up the ability to save the actual state of the game. I have seen some campaign designers 'cheat' by having a separate mission that is post a certain event. (ie, post-refueling, to allow those who can't air to air refuel the ability to proceed from a certain point). That's the only way I see at present or in the foreseeable future that a campaign creator could possibly get around this particular issue - have a starting position that is closer to the action. It is of course a work-around and adds to the content creators workload, but I can't see another way. 

For me, I find it lacking immersion. I think that really has to do with the 'flow on' effect from one to another. How well you do in one mission doesn't change/affect another. Heatblur may have helped bridge a gap here with the F4 - how you treat it on a previous session impacts how it will be the following one for instance. But overall - I think this is where I suspect a lot of people are hanging out for the dynamic campaign engine instead - so it's unique and more immersive. 

But this conversation does raise a thought. How epic would the dynamic campaign engine be, if it was an engine for campaign designers. ie - instead of just being a 'go and play' - it was like the mission editor where campaign creators could actually use it as a tool to create their campaign, but the end result would be something dynamic and 'living'. 

Edited October 1 by Dangerzone

[Slick Twitchy]

That does sound cool. I'd probably have some of the same issues-but maybe a "loss" would be part of the overall model and acceptable. 

The dynamic campaign will definitely be game changer-campaign creators could follow your idea-make some specific events happen, and then the player responds.

I remember in ancient times playing Falcon 4.0 and that dynamic mission. 

[MAXsenna]

1 hour ago, Slick Twitchy said:

campaign creators could follow your idea-make some specific events happen, and then the player responds.

If this is even going to be possible. I hope so!  

[Canada_Moose]

When ED said that 'save game' functionality was coming, I think most players assumed it would be working for campaign missions as this is the obvious need....or at least it seems to be for a large number of posters on here. 

I had also assumed that this would eventually come. Are we now to believe that the save game option will never come to campaign missions??

[Slick Twitchy]

Another issue is the F10 menu option and the inability to select generic AWACS or ATC even when on the correct frequency. I can't get "picture" etc. This just makes everything harder in missions-thus another reason I die so often.

[MAXsenna]

22 hours ago, Slick Twitchy said:

Another issue is the F10 menu option and the inability to select generic AWACS or ATC even when on the correct frequency. I can't get "picture" etc. This just makes everything harder in missions-thus another reason I die so often.

Could you be more specific? I might misunderstand you.

The ingame ATC and mission added AWACS must be contacted through other F options in the communications menu if you want to contact them directly, and not through mission scripts. I've never had any issues with that. If you need the generic ones, you can't use F10. F5 is ATC IIRC. (I use VAICOM, so I don't really use the menus), and of course the correct PTT must be used for the correctly tuned frequencies, but you seem to have that in order. 

Cheers! 

[Slick Twitchy]

22 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

Could you be more specific? I might misunderstand you.

The ingame ATC and mission added AWACS must be contacted through other F options in the communications menu if you want to contact them directly, and not through mission scripts. I've never had any issues with that. If you need the generic ones, you can't use F10. F5 is ATC IIRC. (I use VAICOM, so I don't really use the menus), and of course the correct PTT must be used for the correctly tuned frequencies, but you seem to have that in order. 

Cheers! 

Hi, Yes all communications need to go through the F10 menu-and are pre-scripted responses (usually)- meaning if I just want to get an AWACs "picture" or "bogey dope" I can't. To get a "generic" evaluation of the battle etc is impossible. I'm not sure if there is a solution-i.e. campaign specific AWACS, and also "generic" AWACS that can give me information at will. Not sure if I explained it very well.

Ultimately the BIG problem is the one I stated above-45 minutes of flight, 5 minutes of "heat" and then f**cking it up. I have seen some missions that are broken up into 2 sections (with the latter mission being just prior to the "heat" - which is very respectful of my time.

[MAXsenna]

24 minutes ago, Slick Twitchy said:

Not sure if I explained it very well.

Well, I'm not always the best at understanding either.

25 minutes ago, Slick Twitchy said:

Yes all communications need to go through the F10 menu-and are pre-scripted responses (usually)- meaning if I just want to get an AWACs "picture" or "bogey dope" I can't.

Right, so what you mean is that in some campaigns the ordinary F7 (?) won't give you any response from AWACS? Well, then I guess the AWACS doesn't exist. (Never seen this though). There are probably only triggers and voice overs. Because, IF there's an AWACS there and you know the frequency, "bogey dope" should absolutely work with the ingame radio menu without needing the extra F10 menu. Example. In Reflected's Paradise Lost campaign. At one point you're landing on a ship, and due to DCS limitations, he can't script the ship to lower the rails, which makes the mission marginally harder. BUT, I can easily contact the ship through the ATC commands F5 (?), approach from astern, request landing and the ship will lower the rails for me.

If the campaign makers on purpose have made the mission so that it's impossible to contact the assets outside of the F10 option, I can understand your frustration, even if I don't understand how that is possible.

All the options on the radio menu under the F10 option are scripted, (and more often than not quite heavily), to get the mission flowing in the correct driections. Like Reflected has said. It's more like an interactive story like an adventure game/Half life etc. These campaigns are not in an open world, even DCS has the option in other types of missions.

Basically. You must use the other options on the menu like ATC/AWACS, and not the F10 option unless the mission permits it. In Reflected's Hunters Over Yalu. The F10 option gives you basically four options through the campaign, which you are supposed to use to get you through. Deviate from that. And you might break the flow. 

Now it's my time to say I might be bad at explanations!  

Cheers! 

[Slick Twitchy]

22 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

Well, I'm not always the best at understanding either.

Right, so what you mean is that in some campaigns the ordinary F7 (?) won't give you any response from AWACS? Well, then I guess the AWACS doesn't exist. (Never seen this though). There are probably only triggers and voice overs. Because, IF there's an AWACS there and you know the frequency, "bogey dope" should absolutely work with the ingame radio menu without needing the extra F10 menu. Example. In Reflected's Paradise Lost campaign. At one point you're landing on a ship, and due to DCS limitations, he can't script the ship to lower the rails, which makes the mission marginally harder. BUT, I can easily contact the ship through the ATC commands F5 (?), approach from astern, request landing and the ship will lower the rails for me.

If the campaign makers on purpose have made the mission so that it's impossible to contact the assets outside of the F10 option, I can understand your frustration, even if I don't understand how that is possible.

All the options on the radio menu under the F10 option are scripted, (and more often than not quite heavily), to get the mission flowing in the correct driections. Like Reflected has said. It's more like an interactive story like an adventure game/Half life etc. These campaigns are not in an open world, even DCS has the option in other types of missions.

Basically. You must use the other options on the menu like ATC/AWACS, and not the F10 option unless the mission permits it. In Reflected's Hunters Over Yalu. The F10 option gives you basically four options through the campaign, which you are supposed to use to get you through. Deviate from that. And you might break the flow. 

Now it's my time to say I might be bad at explanations!  

Cheers! 

No - you explained it well. So many times the problems have been "user error" so I wouldn't be surprised if I am messing it up. The kneepad has the frequency for the 'scripted AWAC' so I may not be contacting the 'generic AWAC' but I am not sure how I would find that frequency if the developer has not integrated it into the game....I will give another example in campaign Cereberus North-I cannot even find the correct ATC in the available ATC menu ( I also use Vaicom-but use the "options" menu very often) I see in others video clips there is interaction on the radio but I can't seem figure it out. Once again most probably user error. So much to learn...

Edited Friday at 12:52 AM by Slick Twitchy

[Slick Twitchy]

I just restarted Persian Lion I-so well done. Just hard enough each level to keep me "evolving"- each one a tiny bit more complex than the previous mission. No giant jumps in knowledge with a focus on the one larger change (eg JDAMS, or inputting info for an inserted waypoint). All the triggers seem to work, and comms works well (no problems like my previous complaint). Clear orders, and confirmatory dialogue. Never lost.  These are my favorites so far.

[Mistermann]

On 10/3/2025 at 7:54 PM, Canada_Moose said:

Are we now to believe that the save game option will never come to campaign missions??

Correct.  ED publicly stated so.  Payware campaigns are protected and cannot be altered - so the save game solution won't work.

It also won't save script states so ANY moderately complex missions using scripts are off the table too.