The F-15 and MP gameplay

[EtherealN]

Lattice fins. ;)

 

I didn't vote, since my option would have been that "servers should field realistic, timed, scenarios and people should stop playing airquake". I can dream, can't I? :)

 

It would be interesting to test out some missions made off of the Battlefield series game setup, where there's a set of objectives and time pressure for teams to execute missions. Force people to co-operate if they want to do more than take-off, get one kill, and then a "mission failed" message.

[Teknetinium]

Where is the evidence that the F-15 would work better in jamming environment then Su-27.

 

F-15 can take TWS shots from 45km now,, What you did in FC2 is that you deleted the jamming problem from F-15s TWS, now you have all the time in the world to guide you missiles, and more time to react to the warning from SARH lunch.

I see clearly that some F-15 fan boys had their input after the Blinking whining, Even if the SARH had bigger problems whit blinking, You had to incres the burnthrow range to let F-15 fanboys use theire TWS no matter of the jamming environment.

 

GOOD work and where is the evidence. ED- JANSE - GAMES

EXELENT WORK!

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[GGTharos]

Where is the evidence that an SPJ would jam a radar operating in search mode at all?

[RIPTIDE]

GOOD work and where is the evidence. ED- JANES - GAMES

EXELENT WORK!

Fixed.

[RIPTIDE]

Where is the evidence that an SPJ would jam a radar operating in search mode at all?

I have a question about F-15C IRL. What's the longest range shot that one has killed a bandit in anger using TWS? Or in the recent conflicts are the ROE limited to STT? Or is it classified? BTW this isn't a loaded question, I am genuinely curious.

[Teknetinium]

Where is the evidence that an SPJ would jam a radar operating in search mode at all?

 

Where is the evidence that F-15 would even be able to fire Aim-120 in jamming environment. GG LOL

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[GGTharos]

You laugh, but the question is serious. Do you have any evidence? Because so far, all jammer manuals indicate that they react to STT.

 

Where is the evidence that F-15 would even be able to fire Aim-120. GG LOL

[Teknetinium]

Where is the evidence that the F-15 would work better in jamming environment then Su-27.

 

F-15 can take TWS shots from 45km now,, What you did in FC2 is that you deleted the jamming problem from F-15s TWS, now you have all the time in the world to guide you missiles, and more time to react to the warning from SARH lunch.

I see clearly that some F-15 fan boys had their input after the Blinking whining, Even if the SARH had bigger problems whit blinking, You had to incres the burnthro range to let F-15 fanboys use theire TWS no matter of the jamming environment.

 

GOOD work and where is the evidence. DCS- JANSE - GAMES

EXELENT WORK!

 

 

GG its sad to see that the advantage F-15 gets is not even based on a educated guise. This actions are pure F-15 pimping.

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[GGTharos]

Bring your evidence to ED directly then.

 

GG its sad to see that the advantage F-15 gets is not even based on a educated guise. This actions are pure F-15 pimping.

[EtherealN]

Where is the evidence that F-15 would even be able to fire Aim-120 in jamming environment. GG LOL

 

Why would it not be? Seriously?

 

If anything can launch in a jamming environment, why would the F-15 and AIM-120 not be able to do so?

[Teknetinium]

Bring your evidence to ED directly then.

 

 

Im not like you GG there is no evidence. Therefore the burntru ranges should stay the same or that F-15 should not be able to use TWS in jamming environment.

 

This changes based on nothing comes clearly from F-15 fan boy whining not able to use TWS, now its my turn.

 

Whats the POINT of jamming in Russian birds? Just to have one extra missile fly at you whit no support?

 

GG I thought you wanted more realistic environment not JANSE stile.

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[EtherealN]

Teknetinium, seriously. Grow up.

 

You have no idea what went through the process of the updates that were added with FC2. I'll say that there are some things that I wish had been shown to ED that would have made the F15 even better. (Though the reasons is not really about the F15 itself, it's just that the technical solution gave me a nerdgasm when I read the documentation since it ties in in some ways to my profession as a consultant in certain applications.) But ED have this curious habit of requiring documentation and evidence to implement stuff, and those things were not available at that time.

[GGTharos]

You mean you have no evidence, because the statement as you wrote it is not true.

 

Im not like you GG there is no evidence.

[Teknetinium]

Teknetinium, seriously. Grow up.

 

You have no idea what went through the process of the updates that were added with FC2. I'll say that there are some things that I wish had been shown to ED that would have made the F15 even better. (Though the reasons is not really about the F15 itself, it's just that the technical solution gave me a nerdgasm when I read the documentation since it ties in in some ways to my profession as a consultant in certain applications.) But ED have this curious habit of requiring documentation and evidence to implement stuff, and those things were not available at that time.

 

 

And I guise the jamming evidence is still not available so why making the advantage for F-15, Im happy whit everything I get, And those who could fly F-15 were making most kills in 1.12, now its even better. And all this is based on pure fanboyism.

 

Some of you should grow up your self a litle and try to understand that Im not complaining about the work ED made. Im just whining like all of u did about blinking and Aim-120s not be accuret, I will not even goin to Russian missiles at this point.

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[EtherealN]

And I guise the jamming evidence is still not available so why making the advantage for F-15.

 

Fun thing called physics, and suchlike, is my thought, combined with some knowledge about how jammers and radars both work.

 

You are portraying a picture of F15 "fanboys" simply whining to ED and this persuading ED to implement changes. I say that that is a very serious insult to ED and shows that you do not appreciate how ED operates. (You may want to remember that ED are mainly russians, you know...)

[Teknetinium]

My intention is not to insult DCS, But to help them making the game better and more realistic. I was talking about that missiles were to accurate in 1.12 and they are not as accurate now, many more proximity hits.. Thank you ED.

 

Now I see that jamming war game put the F-15 in to advantage where I have hard to find evidence.

[Krippz]

My intention is not to insult DCS, But to help them making the game better and more realistic. I was talking about that missiles were to accurate in 1.12 and they are not as accurate now, many more proximity hits.. Thank you ED.

 

Now I see that jamming war game put the F-15 in to advantage where I have hard to find evidence.

 

 

But Tekneinium you can't base things on conjecture. You have to back up claims with facts "And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free". I'm sure that everyone wants the most accurate representation of system modeling in DCS but you can't "have your cake and eat it too".

 

You can't ask the devs to create a high fidelity world and gripe if your beloved aircraft does not perform better than another.

Edited August 23, 2010 by Krippz

[Teknetinium]

You really dont understand, maybe its my Sig that miss lead you:) Ill change my signature to F-15 picture maybe it gets esier to read between my lines. Im not whining about anything that F-15 dose better, its about burn-thru ranges for all airplanes not only F-15.

[Krippz]

Well you finally qualified your statement however in your earlier statements you were primarily speaking about the F-15 and Su-27 which lead to the misinterpretation. But once again you are basing things on conjecture; you feel the burn-thru ranges on the aircraft are not correct so they must be changed. Provide us with proof (e.g. Charts, documentation, etc) not conjecture. ED can't just change the range to an arbirtrary range they need documentation.

[Teknetinium]

I have been searching for it :) when you find it let me know. There is sources claimming that you can get mutch closer to the bandit then 45km before the burnthru.

Edited August 22, 2010 by Teknetinium

[EtherealN]

So you are complaining because it doesn't "feel" right, but you have no documentation, and you are asking others to give you documentation to reinforce your complaint? Sorry, but... What? :)

 

As I said, physics. When things are classified, having some knowledge about how the real-world systems work in general principle (physics) plus access to SME's, there are sometimes times when a change is made and it's not possible for mortals to find the source because the source is either classified or based on other venues of research.

 

But you have to see that you can't just say that you have no source of your own but it feels wrong and therefore you can complain about an F15 lobby (as you did). Just doesn't work. :)

 

So since there's no documentation offered by either side, shall we cancel this "debate"? ;)

[Teknetinium]

So you are complaining because it doesn't "feel" right, but you have no documentation, and you are asking others to give you documentation to reinforce your complaint? Sorry, but... What? :)

 

As I said, physics. When things are classified, having some knowledge about how the real-world systems work in general principle (physics) plus access to SME's, there are sometimes times when a change is made and it's not possible for mortals to find the source because the source is either classified or based on other venues of research.

 

But you have to see that you can't just say that you have no source of your own but it feels wrong and therefore you can complain about an F15 lobby (as you did). Just doesn't work. :)

 

So since there's no documentation offered by either side, shall we cancel this "debate"? ;)

 

So can you explain why we had range of 25 before and now 45? :)

I have some people in my squad that understand Physics.

 

 

Where is the evidence that the F-15 would work better in jamming environment then Su-27.

F-15 can take TWS shots from 45km now,, What you did in FC2 is that you deleted the jamming problem from F-15s TWS, now you have all the time in the world to guide you missiles, and more time to react to the warning from SARH lunch.

I see clearly that some F-15 fan boys had their input after the Blinking whining, Even if the SARH had bigger problems whit blinking, You had to incres the burnthrow range to let F-15 fanboys use theire TWS no matter of the jamming environment.

 

Therefore the burntru ranges should stay the same or that F-15 should not be able to use TWS in jamming environment.

This changes based on nothing comes clearly from F-15 fan boy whining not able to use TWS, now its my turn.

Whats the POINT of jamming in Russian birds? Just to have one extra missile fly at you whit no support?

 

My intention is not to insult DCS, But to help them making the game better and more realistic. I was talking about that missiles were to accurate in 1.12 and they are not as accurate now, many more proximity hits.. Thank you ED.

 

Now I see that jamming war game put the F-15 in to advantage where I have hard to find evidence.

Im not whining about anything that F-15 dose better, its about burn-thru ranges for all airplanes not only F-15.

 

There is sources claimming that you can get mutch closer to the bandit then 45km before the burnthru.

Edited August 23, 2010 by Teknetinium

[EtherealN]

ED got better sources than they had before? ;)

 

And I have people in my squad that I don't even know if they feel allright with me saying, so let's just drop the e-peen and recall that ED has access to SME's and people with PhD's in relevant topics, and note that said access has improved as ED was moving into the military markets.

[Grimes]

 

I didn't vote, since my option would have been that "servers should field realistic, timed, scenarios and people should stop playing airquake". I can dream, can't I? :)

 

It would be interesting to test out some missions made off of the Battlefield series game setup, where there's a set of objectives and time pressure for teams to execute missions. Force people to co-operate if they want to do more than take-off, get one kill, and then a "mission failed" message.

 

^^^^^ Heh.... yeah.

 

It is interesting to note that the two main categories recieving more than 2 votes are. "Learn to adapt and grow a pair" and "F-15s should be on one side and outnumbered." I'll admit I'm of the school of thought of keeping F-15s outnumbered. It makes complete sense from a gameplay perspective. F-15s have the best missiles, they can target multiple bandits at once, and they are incredibly good at dealing with multiple threats at the same time.

 

Btw, when I said it recieved a performance boost I meant that it got a better improvement when compared to everything else. Yes all aircraft received updates to at least something in their functionality, but the missile changes and aim 120C benefit the F-15 more so than other fighters.

[Teknetinium]

ED got better sources than they had before? ;)

 

And I have people in my squad that I don't even know if they feel allright with me saying, so let's just drop the e-peen and recall that ED has access to SME's and people with PhD's in relevant topics, and note that said access has improved as ED was moving into the military markets.

 

 

Good work. :)