KomodoSim

This is how the WAH-64D Apache Collective looks so far. This won't be part of the Multi-Grip range due to the shear number of buttons, triggers and HAT switches it has. It's going to need a custom control board making for it. BR Rich

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Hi, From what you say then maybe FF controls are able to replicate the AP and SAS on some aircraft. SAS is a stability and trim system for helicopters. From your video even with a short shaft the fidelity of the FF seems very low and would only be magnified on a longer shaft making it less accurate. The system we are designing will hopefully have a much more accurate and finite control. Yes our prices are high, but that is mainly due to supply and demand. Because the market for these types of controls is very small it's not possible to make them in large enough quantities to reduce the cost significantly enough to make them the same sort of price as Saiteks and other companies controls. Also our controls are made mainly from aluminium and Nylon, making them much stronger and sturdier than other controls out there. They also use hall sensors with many custom designed parts. If we could make them cheaper then we would. Also from the level of some of the cockpits on this forum some people are willing to go the extra to get as close to real thing as possible. As for my position in the company I'm not sure it has any relevance, but I'm the owner, designer and engineer. BR Rich

No probs!! Not quite, see below. Our current VBS ProStart Collective - Not interchangeable -£450 Our current VBS ProCyclic - Not interchangeable - £450 Future VBS Mulit-Grip System Collective base - £275 eatimated Future VBS Mulit-Grip System Cyclic base - £275 estimated Future VBS Mulit-Grip Collective Grips - £175 estimated Future VBS Mulit-Grip Cylcic Grips - £175 estimated As you say these are all plus VAT where applicable and plus P&P. These are very rough estimates and good be totally wrong!:doh: but hopefully they shouldn't change too much. Each grip may vary slightly from grip to grip depending on how complex each grip is. BR Rich

Great stuff, we are talking to the organisers to try and get a date for next years event as sons as possible. We are hoping them to be around the same price as the controls as they are at the moment so around the £450 mark as rough estimate. But this may change depending on how development goes. We are just finishing off the 3D model for the B8 and will also be looking at the collective for the Huey. We have access to the one at the Weston Museum for measurements etc.. BR Rich

Our controls can be used for any type of helicopters, hydraulic or not. The reason I phrased my answer the way I did was that there is a common misconception that you feel vibrations etc.. through the flight controls of helicopters and therefore people ask for FF to simulate this to increase realism. As the majority of larger helicopters, ie non-piston engined, have hydraulic assisted controls any vibrations etc.. are damped out by the hydraulics and therefore there is nothing to force feedback. To my knowledge the FF sticks on the market don't simulate the autopilot or SAS system. So yes we are working on something that we feel is more accurate to helicopter based systems. Thanks for adding to thread and no further exclamation marks. BR Rich

Hhhmm force feedback!! Now there's a debate!! No they don't come with force feedback, mainly due to the fact that helicopters with hydraulic controls don't feel any feedback thru the controls. We are working on a trim system that will motor the controls when the helicopter is being flown by the autopilot or hold the controls in position when a SAS is engaged. You then press a button to release the system to allow you move the controls, then release the button to either hold them in the new position or allow the AP to take over again. The cyclic at the moment uses friction bearings to hold the controls in position when you let them go. So it's a sort of trim function that allows you to fly hands off. The collective also has a friction adjuster that allows you adjust the amount of friction on the stick. You can either have it solid so it can't move, have it totally free with no friction whatsoever or anything in between. BR Rich

They might be a little wobbly. They come with four mounting holes, one in each corner. Best bet would be to probably mount them to a larger board. BR Rich

Hi, The plan for the collective is the same as for the cyclic. You buy a base unit that has all the sensors and electronics in and the then which ever collective grip you want. You then just switch out the grip and change to another one. The adapter to attach the collective shaft is near the base meaning that any throttles that are housed in the shaft near the switch head can easily be accommodated. We are also looking to build in an adapter to allow you to either floor mount (AS350 style) the collective or have mount at seat level (B206). We are also developing toe brakes for the pedals. Due to the more complex working of toe brakes, these wont be interchangeable. You will have to buy one or the other or both, but to be honest it's not an issue flying with toe brakes with a skidded aircraft. Our VBS ProStart Collective it specifically designed to work with the DodoSim 206 and you can do a full start with it with full working idle release etc.. Yes, as far as I know Weston is going ahead next year and we are hoping to be there. BR Rich

Thanks for the great comments guys. The controls have come a very long way since Weston a few years ago. They are in a different league from then, they all use Hall Sensors with 12bit resolution now. I don't think there is nothing that hasn't been changed since then!! That's evolution for you!! Don't worry there is no plan to increase the price. We are constantly working to find ways to reduce the costs!! BR Rich

Hi guys, Thanks for the replies, have been around the forums for a while and just hunting around all the relevant threads. Thanks for the links!! We are based in the UK. Our current VBS ProCyclic, which is based on the 206 is £450 (+vat + P&P). The VBS ProStart Collective, based on the 206 and is fully functional is also £450 (+vat + P&P). And our ProAT Pedals are £225 (+vat +P&P). Images below! We're hoping to keep the prices around this sort of figure, but just waiting for the first quote to come back on the B8 grip. Cheers Rich

Hi Guys, We will soon be launching our new range of interchangeable flight grips. The VBS Multi-Grip Controls are going to be for both the Cyclic and Collective controls. The idea is that you buy the base unit that has all the sensors and interfaces in and then choose which grip you would like. If you want to fly a different helicopter in the future you simply buy a different grip from the Multi-Grip range and unscrew one and attach the other. Our initial range of grips for the Cyclic is going to be the B8, AS350/Eurocopter, KA-50 and WAH-64D grips. With the B206, AS350 and KA-50 in the collective range. They will all be as accurate as possible with has much functionality as possible. We are hoping to have these available early in the new year, as we are currently gathering images etc.. and making the 3D models of all the grips. If you any one has any images of the KA-50 controls they would be greatly appreciated or if you have a request for a particular grip please let us know!! We will keep this thread updated of progress!! Cheers Rich Komodo Simulations