Rabbit_

I base that on many many simulators made in the past. Belsimtek also didn't make Robinson first and then started to work on Mi-8. I think it's based only on the approach to development and I'm not saying it's wrong, but I didn't see any special reason, why to have so many trainers.

Finally someone who understand to this discussion. Thanks, it's very refreshing.

You are totally off the point. Nobody is assuming, that rest of people here will feel the same. Shall I spell it in capital letters or what? This is not about forcing anyone to think the same. It is a discussion. And suddenly saying, that training is part of the combat. Yes it is. But in real life. We are flying a damn game, You know. You don't have to have a training jet to not trash some multi-billion piece of hardware. YES...as we got info from Pman, there is a vision of special campaign, where You will go through real training from trainer to multi-role fighter, but don't tell me, You knew it right from the beginning. There wasn't any info mentioning this before. And I really doubt, that every of these trainers will have its own training campaign and its "goal" combat jet. Sorry, but You can say all of this only because You read it in this forum a few days ago. Because special training and ranks progress were never mentioned along with training jets, when developers were announcing it..

OK...then sorry for that, mate. :-)

First of all, nobody is whining here. Second...I´m not limiting anything and not forcing anyone to not buying it. This whole topic is about reasons behind all different trainers and so on. I think it´s not that difficult to understand. Sure, You have many good points and I agree with You.

Yes...You are right. It has potential for a lot of people. I know this kind of arguing is like having a chat about what is better...WW2 sim or modern sim. I prefer to wait a little longer and get a hardcore awesome module. But we are getting to "I want" area and that's not a constructive. :-) On the other hand, it's nice to see, how many people will welcome these trainers with open arms. :-)

I understand, You have that feeling from this topic, but it wasn't the point. I started this, because I was confused, why is this and why is that. I'm not saying "don't buy these modules". It just looked depressive to me, when I saw third little jet and I'm glad we got a word from someone like VEAO. That was my goal here. To find out, what people think. I didn't want same flaming about little things and forcing my own personal priorities to any of You.

Anyway, guys, Thank You very much for keeping this discussion calm and intelligent. Especially, I want to thank to Pman from VEAO for sharing some much appreciated info, even we are not on official VEAO forum. :thumbup:

:-D

Campaigns are very important for me, when I fly single player and even taking it's nicely scripted missions to multiplayer. I don't feel like messing in the editor for 3 hours to fly a mission. I really would like less, more complex aircraft, than a wide array of simple aircrafts. Yes...Cobra isn't trainer. That' a good info. :-) I referred to it, because it's version is very old. It's absolutely not about ignoring other operation areas of any aircraft. It's about lack of these areas. You got it all wrong, but thanks for reply anyway. Everyone prefers something different. That's how it is. :-)

:-D I hope it's no that bad. I also hope, nobody will take my topic and comments as hate. I love DCS and love all the work developers do. :-)

You always explain it nice and clear and I understand You. And when it fits to that training campaing later, it's gonna be great. Thanks for explanation.

This sucks.

I can't agree. Civil sector just can't be allowed here. This is combat simulator. If they will start to make civil airplanes, the old magic of DCS will just vanish, because there will be many pilots, who just don't give a damn about huge manuals and will buzz around in tiny little Cessnas and Pipers with their keys in the ignition. Very disturbing image for me. Nobody will give my A-10 a "hold short" because of some stupid ultralight on the runway. :smilewink: I also don't agree, that You have to make a more simple aircraft to proceed to more complicated. You are testing it on the way anyway. There is no rule, You have to make Alpha Jet to be able to make Rafale. Sorry guys, but this is bullshit. If You are not going to make that progression campaign from trainer to combat jet, then do the combat jet right away. You must have all the info anyway, if You have it on the production list. First everyone said, it's because of the complexity. Then it's because there will be some complex training campaign (and this is the first time I heard this). I agree, that if it's done because of that training campaign and then going to EF-2000 or anything else, it's damn amazing idea. I still don't understand, why so many. Just suddenly everyone knows, why the trainers are developed. I found it very funny, to be honest.

When You put it this way.....it would be a fantastic experience. I have to admit! I haven't put this topic here because of some hate on 3rd party developers. I just wanted to write my worries down here and wait, what others think. But having a chance, to go through a "real pilot" training is a great idea and I can't wait, how it's gonna turn out.

Yeah...maybe campaign built like true flight training. Good idea.

Such an honest post. :)

Agree! Hardcore Su-25T module would be great. And the campaign is already prepared. :-)

You are certainly right, but don't forget, that F-15 or for example Mi-8 are still used in more or less modified version even today and they still have place in modern warfare.

I can understand that.

At least, L-39 is made in my country. :thumbup: But now You really scared the sh** out of me. So so many little jets.

Yup...I can agree on that and I also agree with Buzzles who said something similar. But my frustration goes on. :smilewink:

Yes...but still not usable for campaign. And I didn't say anything about T-51. It's for free. BTW, I see Oculus Rift in Your specs. Is it good with DCS? Thanks.

I meant T-2 but it's not trainer. OK. But still. :smilewink:

Hi guys. I'm starting to be a little concerned about how the modules development and modules choice is shaping up. I know a lot of people like a lot of different things, but three different training aircraft? Isn't it a little exaggerated? Three very talented developers are creating more or less the same aircraft. That's what I call a waste of development time. I know I know...there are many virtual aerobatic teams and maybe they will be happy to choose from different TRAINING ONLY aircraft. But You know...this is Digital COMBAT Simulator. There should be a list of wanted and not wanted modules just to prevent this from happening. Don't get me wrong, these modules are top quality and everything looks great, but this effort could go into some real combat aircraft or helicopter. And that's what troubles me. Do You really thing, there will be a campaign for these types of aircraft.....yeah...maybe....something like....."do three loops in a row"......"go under this bridge with gear down and inverted" and so on...well, not really a campaign, right? And in the end, why training aircraft? We are virtual pilots, we can afford to train with actual machines right from the scratch. I just don't get what is behind this all. Maybe I'm missing something. I just don't want DCS to become FSX. I can only imagine, how the lower "modules bar" in DCS main menu will look like. Mess of icons with something not COMBAT and not DIGITAL. Sometimes I don't care, sometimes it pisses me off. I'm with Eagle Dynamics since their Lock On and it was always a ride, but in recent days, reading the forum,....I feel like in some museum trip. I still don't know, what to think about Cobra. Why not more modern version? There already was a very emotive discussion. Yeah, I will buy it anyway, but what I really hate, is when the modules don't have the environment, enemy units and overall scenario to fit in. Every module is always a blast, great visuals, physics and it's fun to fly, but then You realize, You are done. You can't get into it on 100%, when You don't have believable campaign. I would like to see modules, we can use to its full potential. MODERN combat jets and helicopters, we can cooperate with in multiplayer and enjoy great campaigns. Why not making a Kiowa with it's great scouting capabilities, hiding behind hills and "lasing" targets for Your buddy in A-10. I know it's easy to say "DO THIS", but that's how I thought the DCS will work. It was just an example. In fact...there is only one module, living up to "digital combat" name. A-10C. Yeah...just one. I know it takes a lot of effort, informations and time and I really love Mi-8, Uh-1 and P-51, but I think it's time to step into 21st century. Seeing things like F/A-18, EF-2000 or AV-8 in developer's "to do" lists is damn exciting and I can only hope, there will be no more training jets to step in the way of the development of such amazing modules. Mig-21 BIS is going to be released soon and yes, developer took an older jet, but decided to create one of its latest versions. Aerobatic pilots hate me, others maybe don't and I don't really care anyway. This is how I see it. :thumbup: