How to set up reliable JTAC?

I am struggling a bit getting hold of the whole concept of JTAC, it may seem.

Would anyone please give me a rundown of how to add reliable AI/CA JTAC to a mission?

I have questions like;

1. What units may be set to JTAC?

2. Do they need LOS, and what is the maximum range?

3. How do you assign call-sign and frequency to a JTAC unit, and are there any other requirements?

4. Is there any difference in performance for AI JTAC with "See all" and "Fog-of-War" in F10 map options?

5. When assigning a Predator for JTAC, would you use the same method as for a ground unit?

I am only flying the BlackShark, so obviously I cannot test JTAC on the MP maps I make. That is the reason I need a method for adding JTAC.

Yeah, I know; I should get into the A-10C, but I am a rotor addict. -Can't help myself! :D

1. What units may be set to JTAC?

I use HMMWV or Predators.

2. Do they need LOS, and what is the maximum range?

If you use "FAC-Engage Group" (Advanced waypoint option) you can check the checkbox "Visual".

If it is checked the JTAC do not need LOS to report the enemy.

3. How do you assign call-sign and frequency to a JTAC unit, and are there any other requirements?

You have to use the "Advanced waypoint option". There you can set a Callsigne and a Frequence.

Please use the range between 30.000 FM - 45.000 FM

Then you only need "FAC-Engage Group" to assigne the enemys you want to report.

If you use Predators, you don't need "FAC-Engage Group" because they have "FAC" by default and will report every enemy they can see (LOS needed).

4. Is there any difference in performance for AI JTAC with "See all" and "Fog-of-War" in F10 map options?

No, because with FAC-Engage Group you have to set every enemy you want to report.

5. When assigning a Predator for JTAC, would you use the same method as for a ground unit?

If you have clear sky - no - The Predators have FAC by default.

If you have cloudy sky - yes - use FAC-Engage Group because they don't need LOS then.

1. All of the U.S units. However ..

a. Only armed units can pop smoke

b. Only units which say -EPLRS(true) in advanced (waypoint actions) can provide target data via datalink.

2. see 3. below for LOS, range - quite big but no figure known for sure

3. a. Advanced (waypoint actions) - ADD -> Perform Command -> Add Callsign (take your pick), Add frequency (FM is 30-88, AM is about 110-150)

b. YES. Advanced (waypoint actions) - ADD -> FAC assign group (doesnt need LOS), or Advanced (waypoint actions) - ADD -> FAC engage group (does need LOS).

4. Haven't tested this yet, its on my to do list. By all means tst yourself and report back :)

5. You dont need to set callsign and frequency in advanced options as its already down in the main options above.

For predators you will see -FAC at the top of the advanced waypoint options. He will report all units he has LOS with. If you want complete control over which units he reports then delete this option and insert FAC - Assign group or FAC - Engage group.

Most of this is in the GUI manual, have a good read of it and leave it open when miz building. I still refer to it now and then.

(lastly in advanced options you can set your JTAC to invisible which means that enemy AI will not see him under ANY circumstances, useful if you dont want him to be shot at when LOS occurs. You can claim he's well hidden amonst trees or in a bldg).

If you have cloudy sky - yes - use FAC-Engage Group because they don't need LOS then.

FAC - Assign Group assumes full situational awareness by default. FAC - Engage group doesn't unless you play with visible box.

Also btw, using Assign Group in triggered actions allows you to interrupt the current assignment and start a new one. Useful when you dont want to have to wait for 'All units destroyed' before he assigns the next task. I've used it effectively in a miz I'm currently building.

@ Druid:

Do not use FAC- Assigne Group:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=77621&page=5

They are not able to report units which are activated by trigger.

Strange, I have it working with a trigger. Let me find my test mission and I will upload it.

EDIT: ahh for multiplayer it doesn't work. Or are you talking about the groups that arent activated JTAC problem?

I always talking about multiplayer. :D

I never was using the singleplayer in my DCS-live.

Yep but are you saying that with all units activated at the start of the mission, FAC- Assign Task will not work for clients in multiplayer?

OR

FAC - Assign Task will not work in multiplayer for units assigned that don't activate at mission start.

There is a big difference.

The JTAC is active (was not deactivated) and the units he have to report was activated by trigger while the mission is running.

The JTAC was not able to report this activated units to a A-10C Client.

"No further tasking available bla bla bla"

Edit: But I noticed this bug a long time ago.

Maybe ED fixed this isue. I have not tested it yet because since that I always using FAC-Engage Group with [Visual].

Ahh ok. I tend not to activate units in my missions for a variety of reasons. But like I say the great advantage I see of using AI TASK - FAC Assign Group is the ability to make him assign task much quicker.

i.e. When there are 4 multiplayer aircraft available and 3 groups of enemy units. Why would the JTAC WAIT until you have completely destroyed the first group before assigning the next group? In reality once you have the first group visual/targeted he would assign the next group.

FAC- Assign Group allows you to do this.

e.g. ONCE -> GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN 90 Group1 -> AI TASK FAC - ASSIGN GROUP Group2

Once you have started slaying group1 the JTAC will start assigning the second group immediately (and not wait until you have completely destroyed the first group). Particularly useful if there is just 1 damn infantry guy left to destroy somewhere.

Nice idea.

Was just messing about with this the other day. Here is the test mission I used.

AFAC_assign_gp.miz

FAC- Assign Group allows you to do this.

 

e.g. ONCE -> GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN 90 Group1 -> AI TASK FAC - ASSIGN GROUP Group2

This is not working for FAC-Engage Group?

Why not?

Because FAC - Assign Group is a Perform Task option which will execute immediately interrupting ANY other action that is in process.

FAC - Engage Group is an Enroute Task which once the process condition is met and it has started , it must finish before starting another enroute task. I think there might be a way to interrupt it using a Lua function but I am yet to investigate and test.

Ideally in the ME GUI it would be nice if we had 2 further tick box options (a bit like VISIBLE) which are

1. DO NOT RELEASE (i.e. FAC will not say 'there is no more tasking you may depart' but instead will say 'Standby for further targets').

2. ALLOW INTERRUPT ON CONDITION (So when stop Condition is true, he will stop the assignment process and move on to next Enroute Task)

Would be nice to have... but I think the current "Server disconnect problems" have a higher priority. :D

Awesome! Dragon and Druid, you are truly of great help :thumbup:

Even when reading the manual, it is of monumental importance to get to know the bugs.

Hey guys, working with Kos a little and also trying to get the hang of JTAC.

I used a Fast Mission creation and fiddled with the JTAC. It called out two groups for me then advised that it had no more tasking. From that point it appeared to drop off and not be contactable even though I moved it into the vicinity of more potential targets.

Once the JTAC advises of no more tasking, is that it for that JTAC? Is there any way to wake them back up?

Your best not modifying fast miz creation as it can produce unpredictable results.

If the JTAC is just using FAC -a then he will only report units he sees (or should do). He won't wake up so to speak if he detects something after telling you theres no more tasking, you will always have to contact him to 'wake him up so to speak'. If the next time you call him he sees targets then he will start allocating once again.

If the next time you call him he sees targets then he will start allocating once again.

... if your a lucky boy and it is not bugged! :music_whistling:

Fair enough. I'll start one from scratch - I was setting up what I thought was exactly the same in the fast mission and I moved the FAC so it was within meters of an enemy tank but it wouldn't call out the contact and the contact wouldn't show up on F10.

Only way I could get the FAC to work was within the Fast Mission and all the options were set the same as far as I could tell in my mission.

AFAC worked fine straight away but you can't control those in CA which is what I would like to be able to do.

Thanks for the tips guys.

This is as simple as it gets but I can't seem to get it to work here.

Can see the first unit since I have fog of war going and it won't call out the contact. Using CA, I move the HMV so it's in sight of the 2nd vehicle and it also comes up on my F10 map but in the JTAC radio, Axeman is no longer available.

Thanks.

Test JTAC.miz

Post the mission up that you were having problems with and I will take a look.

It should be attached to my last message.. thanks.

Answered here

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=91723

can you clarify a little.

best to use "engage group" or "assign group", for a MP mission.