GumidekCZ Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I want to ask here, if it could be possible to implement ARL-S Lazur'-M ground control guidance to airborne target into Leatherneck MIG-21BIS cockpit? http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=45.0 It could help with Mig-21 role in DCS world simulation allot. Now without human GCI, it is very difficult to intercept enemy planes.
xxJohnxx Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I agree the Lazur equipment would be very nice to have. However it seems to be quit complex. While it only features a couple of controls and indicators in the cockpit it probably requires a lot of background work to make the actual guidance happening. For example, the Lazur system guides you to your target and once close allings you to the target parameters (altitude, speed, etc.). Having the actual simulation providing you with that guidance information is probably quit a programming task. I don't want to say it is impossible, very similar things have already been done (normally by much bigger teams though), but it is probably a lot of work. An example for a quit similar application is the ATC in FSX. While it is not exactly the same, giving vectors to the player's aircraft to get from cruise altitude to the runway (often including several steps, turns, etc) in the end, is probably similar to what the Lazur would to. However, anyone who has ever flown with the FSX ATC probably knows that while it often gets you to your destination it also often just doesn't work. In the end, with both the Lazur or the ATC, it would be converting human intelligence into AI, which is difficult, and therefore probably unlikely to happen. A nice thing though would be to have the Lazur system aboard the simulated aircraft, but without any built-in guiding AI. Instead it would be nice to have an API that allows skilled programmers (as this community seems to have) to find solutions to the problems given. It would even allow for human Lazur System Ground Controllers (or however those guys are called). Together with programs like LotATC it could be quit interesting to have an actual person send out data link commands to several MiG-21s (and maybe future MiG-2x versions that also have data link possibility) in an MP session. Check out my YouTube: xxJohnxx Intel i7 6800k watercooled | ASUS Rampage V Edition 10 | 32 GB RAM | Asus GTX1080 watercooled
1.JaVA_Platypus Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I think they (leatherneck) might have given a few comments about that in the past. I don't know if it is ever going to be implemented. I agree with XXJohnXX about the subject but I think it would be rather easy to code. We have the option of adding AWACS support to the missions in DCS. It is not the same, but better then nothing. We'll see what will happen in the future!! Happy Flying! :pilotfly:
Fishbreath Posted January 6, 2015 Posted January 6, 2015 Don't we have the version of the MiG-21bis which has the ILS instead of the datalink? Black Shark, Harrier, and Hornet pilot Many Words - Serial Fiction | Ka-50 Employment Guide | Ka-50 Avionics Cheat Sheet | Multiplayer Shooting Range Mission
xxJohnxx Posted January 6, 2015 Posted January 6, 2015 Don't we have the version of the MiG-21bis which has the ILS instead of the datalink? That is true actually. We have the Fishbed-N for the Soviet Air Force. The Fishbed-L for the Soviet Defence Force has the Lazur equipment installed. Check out my YouTube: xxJohnxx Intel i7 6800k watercooled | ASUS Rampage V Edition 10 | 32 GB RAM | Asus GTX1080 watercooled
GumidekCZ Posted January 7, 2015 Author Posted January 7, 2015 With this topic I only wanted to let all of you and the LN team to know, that there was another Fishbed-L for the Soviet Defence Force, which has this type of equipment, which from my point of view would be much more usefull in todays DCS world. Question is how will Leatheneck response if we will request this equipment to switch with radio navigation (ILS). And in the end how many of us will like this change.
Fishbreath Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 IIRC the reason we have the MiG-21 we have is that both groups who worked on it (originally Beczl, eventually Leatherneck) had better access to information about Polyot than Lazur. That said, the GCI version would be nifty to have, too. Black Shark, Harrier, and Hornet pilot Many Words - Serial Fiction | Ka-50 Employment Guide | Ka-50 Avionics Cheat Sheet | Multiplayer Shooting Range Mission
Random Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 Sounds like an interesting system and would be a lot of fun to fly GCI using Lazur. Could also be the basis for other datalink systems for later modules....
Kobymaru Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 On one hand I don't want to spam, on the other hand I'd like to express that Lazur equipment would be pretty darn nice. At the present moment, Mig-21 is not particularly combat effective with a Radar that has a max range of ~25 km. I particularly like Johns API-Idea. That would improve combat effectiveness on Multiplayer servers dramatically. - Put up a Su-33 as an "AWAC" somewhere high but close to the combat area - Use radar to identify targets and send the Mig-21's to intercept.
lmp Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 - Put up a Su-33 as an "AWAC" somewhere high but close to the combat area - Use radar to identify targets and send the Mig-21's to intercept. To be honest, I'd be very surprised if it worked anything like that. I expect you would need ground controllers (player or AI) to assign targets to interceptors, plot routes, guide the pilots into the rear hemisphere of their targets. It may be automated to a degree, but it's still 1970s Soviet electronics. Probably only a limited number of EWR/command centers could provide the guidance and you couldn't "plug and play" a Su-33, let alone have the pilot of that plane prioritize targets. Actually, does anybody here really KNOW how this system worked? What would an example interception look like from the side of the pilot and the ground controller?
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