Potentiometer for X52

[Spadje]

I have been trying to find a potentiometer for my X52 forever and have not found any local or available for a reasonable price online. Could any one assist?

 

Thanks

:)

[Bucic]

Hi!

Which potentiometer exactly? Which axis? What are the current symptoms that tell you it requires replacement?

[Spadje]

Its for the rudder axis (twist) on the X52. I cleaned it a while back and that helped for a bit but now cleaning doesn't matter. When I can calibrate it fine but once I twist it to the right and let go it starts twitching it will not stay at center. I tried deadzoning it out but the issue is getting worse.

[Sokol1_br]

Is not a "PnP" solution, but you can transform the damaged pot in a HALL Sensor with a Allegro A1324 and magnet:

 

http://simhq.com/forum/files/usergals/2015/03/full-37484-99347-dscf5844.jpg

 

http://simhq.com/forum/files/usergals/2014/11/full-37484-90677-post_59452_0_69477800_1415263502.jpg

 

Or adapt a quality pot (Bourns, Spectrol, Alphs...) in the place - if find one with 50-90 degrees of electrical range, better:

 

[Bucic]

Hall sensor:

You might want to read on the problems with replacing the pot with hall I personally bumped into. I wrote about it in the main X-52 modding thread.

Edited September 18, 2015 by Bucic

[Spadje]

I have seen a few videos on replacing the pot, I know there is some soldering required and am capable of doing that. Just need to know where to get one of the buggers...

[Bucic]

I have seen a few videos on replacing the pot, I know there is some soldering required and am capable of doing that. Just need to know where to get one of the buggers...

In any elec shop. Seriously. If they don't have a regular 50KOhm linear pot they do money laundering :)

 

But, the original pot is a non-standard one. Everything has been explained in the comments below this video

Personally, I would cdisassemble and clean the original pot first.

[Sokol1_br]

Using a "non-joystick" pot' - this have a special serigraphy for limit the electric range in 30-40 degrees - you are limiting the axis resolution, since a conventional 270 degrees pot' expect the voltage variation in this range.

 

But if no other option, better than a fault pot, as see in YT video. :)

 

One these don't fit? Is 15$.

 

http://pt.farnell.com/bi-technologies-tt-electronics/6127v1a60l-5/sensor-hall-0-2v-20v-to-10v-60deg/dp/2319671

 

Since the Saitek circuit work with 3,5v will be need take +5V from USB cable for supply the HALL.

[Spadje]

I've watched that video but no one says where you can get one. The shop we have in my small town only has 10kOhm single turn pots... :( I tried ordering one from Amazon but it got cancelled, not once, not twice, but three times...something about the shipper not being able to meet demand. I have taken it out, resoldered the lines, cleaned it and it still does not work like it used to. Only thing I have not done is disassemble the pot itself and seen if I can clean the contacts with alcohol....

 

The 15 dollar one may work but not sure where it is shipping from, would like to get it from somewhere here in the states. I found a guy on ebay with some http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ohmite-Potentiometer-50K-Ohm-2W-Single-Turn-CMU-5031-New-In-Box-/141766637540?hash=item2101f337e4 that should work correct?

 

Thanks,

Spadje

[Bucic]

As for resolution problem araising from lower voltage (or resistance, same effect) variation per degree of a 270 deg pot. Am I right that to achieve the same resolution one would have to use a 270 deg pot of:

Ro/ao=Rr/ar

Rr=Ro/ao*ar=50000/30*270=450000 [ohm]

Ro - original pot resistance

ao - original pot angular range

Etc.

?

[Sokol1_br]

You can buy the BI Tech sensor online in Digikey (USA) or Mouser.

 

http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en?mpart=6127V1A60L.5&v=987

 

Same for Bourns, Spectrol potentiometers. In this case look for one pot' with similar physical size of the one that will replace, to make more easy to fit. You need a 50k LINEAR (B code) potentiometer.

 

The shop we have in my small town only has 10kOhm single turn pots.

 

You can buy this and test, the fact that are 10k is not a issue.

 

The ideal is remove the Saitek pot' and take to the shop to compare with the available.

The more critical detail is the axis diameter.

 

There a different device, a R/C transmitter, but with the same problem, replace the 30 degrees pot', and a different solution, include for the electric range (30 vs 270):

 

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2007556

Edited September 18, 2015 by Sokol1_br

[Spadje]

Wow, so now you guys are getting a bit over my head. I understand the concepts but not the math of it. If I can use a 10k ohm pot then yes I will go pick one up, I can remove the one in the saitek since it is bad anyways and if they match in size I should be ok? If I replace it with the 10k will it still perform the same or would I be limited?

 

Thanks

[Sokol1_br]

No, the 10k don't limit the response, since in USB joystick* is not used for read resistance but voltage variation.

 

What limit the response is degree of movement.

 

Joystick pot' have a resistance trail done for read the voltage variation 0 - 5v or 0 - 3,5v in Saitek (to hidden electrical noise in cheap circuit) in ~40 degrees.

This models are done under order for the industry (probable you find cheap ones of this version in AliExpress).

 

Pot' that you find in electronic shop have trail for 270 degrees, so if you turn then only ~30 degrees, the voltage variation is proportional smaller as the axis resolution.

 

How critical? Don't know, so do the test.

 

In the perfect world you just buy a new 30/40 degrees pot from Saitek and replace the fault one.

 

But in real world you need improvise (or buy a rudder pedal). :)

 

BTW - I see many people in sim forums that replace fault pot' with DIY HALL sensor assembly (like the one in the previous pictures) and are satisfied with results, include in X-52.

 

Is just not "PnP" is need fit, test... again and again and again. :)

 

What you can try, is cheap. 2/3$ for the sensor (Allegro A1324, Honeywell SS495A1), ~1$ for circular diametrical neodymium magnet.

 

* About the pot K value what I read in these forum are:

 

In a USB joystick circuit a lower value 1 ~ 10K will take more more amperage from the USB circuit, a high value 50 ~ 100K will take less, but is subject to pick more electrical noise.

 

For example, in the popular Leo Bodnar BU0836A USB joystick controller you can use potentiometer from 1 to 100K.

http://www.leobodnar.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=94&products_id=204

Edited September 19, 2015 by Sokol1_br
mistype

[Spadje]

So the one I listed from Ebay, would it work?

 

Link http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ohmite-Potentiometer-50K-Ohm-2W-Single-Turn-CMU-5031-New-In-Box-/141766637540?hash=item2101f337e4

[Blech]

So the one I listed from Ebay, would it work?

 

Link http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ohmite-Potentiometer-50K-Ohm-2W-Single-Turn-CMU-5031-New-In-Box-/141766637540?hash=item2101f337e4

 

 

Hi,

 

Don't know.

But it seems that it has a "round shaft"

 

Have a look to the old and new one - they have a "D-shaft"

[Sokol1_br]

eBay: 50k linear D-shape potentiometer:

 

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=50+k+linear+d+shaft+potentiometer&_sop=15

 

Alpha is good brand.

 

Bourns in Digikey:

 

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/39SB-1RB-503/39SB-1RB-503-ND/2564490

Edited September 21, 2015 by Sokol1_br

[Spadje]

I wouldn't be afraid to take a file to the straight shaft and make it a D shaft :) its nice that it would come from Ohio and that is just a few hours from where I live. I am wondering about the other specs, would they work?

[Spadje]

Well I was able to order http://goo.gl/k5v6fX I received them on Wednesday of this week. I did the replacement last night and wow what a difference. When I pulled the old one off there was hardly any resistance to the turning of the shaft. I pulled the old one off, and with these being a split shaft I drilled out the hole in the bottom portion of the container, in the receiver, so that the split shaft would fit. Once done I put everything back together and tested, wow what a difference. There is no jumps or twitches when using the rudder now, it is pretty smooth and works perfectly.

 

Also I have 4 more of these things, if anyone needs one let me know and I will see what I can do.

[Bucic]

Well I was able to order http://goo.gl/k5v6fX I received them on Wednesday of this week. I did the replacement last night and wow what a difference. When I pulled the old one off there was hardly any resistance to the turning of the shaft. I pulled the old one off, and with these being a split shaft I drilled out the hole in the bottom portion of the container, in the receiver, so that the split shaft would fit. Once done I put everything back together and tested, wow what a difference. There is no jumps or twitches when using the rudder now, it is pretty smooth and works perfectly.

 

Also I have 4 more of these things, if anyone needs one let me know and I will see what I can do.

What about the problem with the rotation range not matching?

[Sokol1_br]

Good to know if this reduced the resolution significantly.

 

Run the JoyTester2 and see what the resolution is informed for the axis with new potentiometer. Not sure if rudder is RZ axis, if is in X-52 is originally 1024.

 

Download here: http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1310&p=9996&viewfull=1#post9996

 

Is the value in "Precision" field.

 

Well, even with less resolution is better than a spiking axis. :)

Edited November 13, 2015 by Sokol1_br

[Spadje]

What about the problem with the rotation range not matching?

 

If I move the sliders on the side for the dead zone closer to the center the range is much better. I just move it so its even on both sides and it maxes out on the test screen in the Saitek Control panel.

 

On the test joytester2 software I am showing 60 in the precision field, however, It seems to be different each time I run it for the precision field for R. I have ran it multiple times and it ranges from 15 to 120. I have the mode set toe Rudder test so not sure what I should be seeing, in game it is smooth as butter though and no jittering or all of the sudden left rudder.

 

Edited November 15, 2015 by Spadje

[Bucic]

@Spadje

I'm not as experienced in modding as Sokol but during my experiments with HAL sensor I got limited resolution because the sensor provided only 1V variation max. So, I recommend again for you to look into it, as I wrote in post #10. Simply put I'd test a standard 270 deg 500k pot and check on the tester what resolution is reported.

Edited November 16, 2015 by Bucic

[Sokol1_br]

Two things to try, to improve the resolution, a voltage amplifier:

 

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=26779452&postcount=6

 

Use conductive paint limiting the reading area of the potentiometer:

 

picture host

 

Original Saitek pot reading area is 32º - you can open then and confirm.

Edited November 15, 2015 by Sokol1_br

[Spadje]

Like I stated earlier, once I set the dead zone to the picture above the pot works perfectly, I have not had to make any modifications other than that. I have full range of motion when setting the rudder up and no issues with the deadzone being that large. Unfortunately it took me a month to get the 50k pots that I used in the device, I am not about to try and order 500k pots lol, no telling when those would get here. I am having NO issues at all with these pots and my current settings.

 

I also play Star Citizen and am loving the X52 over my Logitech G940 setup, kind of sad actually.

 

Spadje

[Bucic]

Like I stated earlier, once I set the dead zone to the picture above the pot works perfectly, I have not had to make any modifications other than that. I have full range of motion when setting the rudder up and no issues with the deadzone being that large. Unfortunately it took me a month to get the 50k pots that I used in the device, I am not about to try and order 500k pots lol, no telling when those would get here. I am having NO issues at all with these pots and my current settings.

 

I also play Star Citizen and am loving the X52 over my Logitech G940 setup, kind of sad actually.

 

Spadje

Axis resolution at 60-120 is certainly not fine. That's why I posted the suggestion. But if it's sufficient for you then good for you :thumbup: