Detecting targets at different altitudes

[ZHeN]

Greetings! Merry christmas, y'all!

 

Sorry, but I won't provide any track (mission track is ~3hours long) or a tacview file (I don't have tacview installed), that's why I'm not writing about it in the Bugs section. Just want you guys to read this and confirm or reject some issues.

 

Experiencing issues when trying to detect targets which are significantly higher than me.

I do change my antenna elevation, but that doesn't help at all.

Example: I'm flying at 15.000ft, a big target (Su-27) is at 40.000ft. Distance is ~30nm. Radar antenna up, VTB - blank. Target is descending, I'm even starting to see it's contrail. We're less than 15nm already, radar still blank. Can't take it anymore, I pitch up, go in to 530's CCM-mode , see the contrail in the hud, it's even launching a missile at me. Voila, target locked. I'm hit, what the crap ?

I must mention, I don't fly SP, all of my experience is MP only. And my opponent (that shot me down) even told me he found this trick not long ago, said it's the most effective way to fight mirages in a no-R27ER/ET environment - just go very high, they'll be blind.

And I must admit this issue happened to me many times before, even half a year ago, many patches back. So don't think it's new. Just didn't want to write about this, I thought it was me doing something wrong ...

 

another thing I should mention is when a target is slightly lower than me:

I'm at 23.600ft, target is at ~16.000ft. I'm slightly lowering my antenna, VTB - blank. The only way I can detect the target in this case is if I pitch down a bit (descend to 19.000ft, for example) and return my antenna into default position.

 

also when I'm @ 40.000ft myself and got a target locked, that's flying low near the ground @ 4.000-5000ft, when I start diving at it at a steep angle, I'm having a hard STT lock, which can't be broken, shooting my 530D just fine, so there's obviously no issue with ground clutter, RDI works just fine

 

must be something wrong with the algorythm of radar ... I don't know :dunno:

Edited December 26, 2016 by ZHeN

[myHelljumper]

What are your max and min scan altitudes at what distances when you have those problems ?

Because if the target is outside the radar cone you can't see it and "antenna up" and "slightly lowering" does not tell us where the antenna is looking.

[ZHeN]

What are your max and min scan altitudes at what distances when you have those problems ?

Because if the target is outside the radar cone you can't see it and "antenna up" and "slightly lowering" does not tell us where the antenna is looking.

 

I don't recall the exact numbers, but when I was @ 15.000ft and target was @ 40.000ft, D~30nm, I pitched up radar antenna to the highest position possible

 

radar cone isn't so narrow, I'm sure each time targets were in it

I think it might have something to do with TomCatMucDe's issue

[T_A]

I don't recall the exact numbers, but when I was @ 15.000ft and target was @ 40.000ft, D~30nm, I pitched up radar antenna to the highest position possible

 

radar cone isn't so narrow, I'm sure each time targets were in it

I think it might have something to do with TomCatMucDe's issue

 

 

you don`t need to change elevation so much , the really high angles for elevation are used in very close range combat situations , at 30nm with 15kft difference you only need a few degrees of elevation (you can see the the altitude ranges near the elevation indicator)

 

also , if you both were flying the same course and approximately the same speed then you have to change the radar PRF mode from HRF to INT or BRF or the radar will filter that contact

 

and last - if you already have a visual on him , try to narrow the radar search field, the radar wont 'instantly' detect a target even if you did everything right.

[Frostie]

And my opponent (that shot me down) even told me he found this trick not long ago, said it's the most effective way to fight mirages in a no-R27ER/ET environment - just go very high, they'll be blind.

 

 

It's not a trick specific against Mirages, many players spend most of their time in the weeds hence they scan low and so does everybody else looking for them. Scanning high is quite alien to a lot online so a lot goes missing. The trouble you're probably having is elevating too high, just a slight degree change is needed, use your TDC altitude at the expected range for maximum effect.

[ZHeN]

thanks everyone for your comments !

 

I don't actually spend most of my CAP time "in the weeds" :D

I usually CAP at average altitudes - just below contrailing (23.600ft in that mission, where I spend most of my time)

 

and no, I don't elevate to the highest position at once, I move the antenna very slowly to the top, but VTB usually shows nothing

[myHelljumper]

This is not how you should do it, you should use the radar elevation max and min values right of your TDC.

[ZHeN]

using max and min values right of my TDC doesn't mean I shouldn't move my antenna, right ? :D I will still be moving my antenna.

[Zorro23]

It happened to me as well on multiplayer at least twice about a week ago.

 

I was at 40k ft with hard-lock on target at 4k ft head on. When I was about to fire at about 14nm I lost my lock. I tried to regain lock on them but even following closely the AWACS indications they never show up again on the VTB. So after a 180° turn I tried again (this time I was at their six) with no success. Then even the AWACS lost them and when I managed to lose altitude a SAM shot me down.

[myHelljumper]

You have to provide a track or a tacview or we can't help.

 

Most probably the target has notched your radar

[Oceandar]

Here is from Chuck's guide page 59

 

Last night in Blue Flag I ambushed M2000 flying high at 27kft and I was at 10kft, it was head on. I wouldn't know he was there if it wasn't because GCI told me his angels. It was easy kill.