Cluster bomb munitions impact points

[Riverseeker]

Hello, i think this is a bug so i am posting this here, if it is not just move the post pleae.

 

I noticed a strange behavior using the cluster bombs, i found that the impact of the minitions seems to not change sweep after sweep... Here comes what i did.

 

I sat up an easy mission to train with: ramp start from kuitasi, 2 waypoint (to eventually visual/radar fix), target with 8 apc on the abandoned airport + egress and landing. Pretty standard.

 

The nav system was perfectenly aligned, even without any in-flight manual fix, maybe becouse the takeoff was good so the system started in a "good shape" :D (only think always do is maniacal runway alignment + reference button press)

 

At like 4.5Km from the target i released the 2 BK 90 dispensers than i executed a sort of barrel roll to loose speed and get some height to look better at the target zone: the munitions fully centered the target (that weapon is so fun to use :thumbup: ).

Apc's where covered by explosions, only 4 got destroyed + 1 that lost 25% integrity.

 

 

SO was nice, everything worked fine.

 

I landed, turned off the aricraft, reloaded the weapons by ground crew and restarted startup from scratch. (Reloaded data cartrige etc etc.)

I re-done the whole mission from there, the nav system had no variance so this was perfect.

When i released the bombs for the second time in the SAME mission on the same target i noticed that the munitions impacted on the exact same spot as the first time...

I assume this becouse the 3 apcs that survived the first run were still there with 100% integrity, the other one that had previously lost 25% now was on 50%...

I was a little like... this is odd.

 

So i done the third run and everything was the same except that the last element was on 25%... and then guess what? I had to go bed so i stopped there :megalol:

 

 

Target zone was configured as long area (921)

There was no wind, just an easy training mission.

 

Is this behavior intended?

I found zero variance on the impact zone. I really dont mind this problem too much but i reported anyway.

 

Anybody else had this sort of experience?

 

BTW viggen it's a star to fly... :)

[Northstar98]

Can you actually see the submunitions being dispensed from the BK-90? If not, that might explain it.

 

I have the Viggen, but I haven't flown it yet because my headset has failed and I can't really use it for TrackIR, so I can't see if this is the case.

[whaaw]

The nav system was perfectenly aligned, even without any in-flight manual fix, maybe becouse the takeoff was good so the system started in a "good shape" :D (only think always do is maniacal runway alignment + reference button press)

)

 

thats somthing strange everyone seems to do that (reference button press when aligned)

your not suposed to do that. We did this in the early viggen days as a go around for a Bug.

it just causes problems now, if you not aligned 100% just go from BER to NAV before entering RWY and lift off, dont do the manual initial fix unless you have a shit metric ton of side wind

[Riverseeker]

thats somthing strange everyone seems to do that (reference button press when aligned)

your not suposed to do that. We did this in the early viggen days as a go around for a Bug.

it just causes problems now, if you not aligned 100% just go from BER to NAV before entering RWY and lift off, dont do the manual initial fix unless you have a shit metric ton of side wind

 

on the manual you can find this:

 

If needed. Press Reference button (on

stick) after carefully aligning with the

runway heading.

 

And i am doing that becouse when i am aligned with the runway the real heading is not matching with the planned one...

[Riverseeker]

Can you actually see the submunitions being dispensed from the BK-90? If not, that might explain it.

 

I have the Viggen, but I haven't flown it yet because my headset has failed and I can't really use it for TrackIR, so I can't see if this is the case.

 

I cant see munitions, just the dispenser.

[AbortedMan]

thats somthing strange everyone seems to do that (reference button press when aligned)

your not suposed to do that. We did this in the early viggen days as a go around for a Bug.

it just causes problems now, if you not aligned 100% just go from BER to NAV before entering RWY and lift off, dont do the manual initial fix unless you have a shit metric ton of side wind

 

on the manual you can find this:

 

If needed. Press Reference button (on

stick) after carefully aligning with the

runway heading.

 

And i am doing that becouse when i am aligned with the runway the real heading is not matching with the planned one...

 

Hmm...I'm very curious about this. Which is the correct way to be sure the targeting system is accurate?

[-IRRE-Rolluptito]

I am confused now. :D

 

I am currently applying the second one, and it works pretty well. I almost never have to do nav fixes and hit target precisely.

[whaaw]

on the manual you can find this:

 

If needed. Press Reference button (on

stick) after carefully aligning with the

runway heading.

 

And i am doing that becouse when i am aligned with the runway the real heading is not matching with the planned one...

 

I just want to say you need to be very carefull when doing that, and there is absolutly no gain from doing it, all that can happen in worst case is that your initial fix is bad. you dont have any advantage when doing that. not a single.

your heading will fix it self after take off when initial auto fix is made. I dont want to say your doing it wrong! just want to make you aware of the problems that can happen.

 

Hmm...I'm very curious about this. Which is the correct way to be sure the targeting system is accurate?

I am confused now. :D

 

I am currently applying the second one, and it works pretty well. I almost never have to do nav fixes and hit target precisely.

 

 

 

For more detailed Infos about initial fix read Page 131 on the manual or open the spoiler:

 

Automatic and manual initial course.

 

In order to determine the current course of the aircraft and all subsequent movements of the

 

aircraft, the system requires an initial course.

 

Automatic

 

During take-off (between the intervals of 110 – 200 km/h) the computer compares the course

 

servo with the entered runway heading. In case of a deviation from this heading, an average of

 

the course indication from the Attitude Director Indicator (ADI) is immediately added, result-

ing in correct course. This is indicated by the Course scale in the HUD moving slightly due to

 

the correction. The course correction servo is connected and is indicated by the course ring on

 

the Central Indicator and the Attitude director indicator (ADI) rotating. After the initial course

 

setting the magnetic course servo is disconnected which has continually been connected since

 

the ADI fast erect on start-up.

 

If the angle difference between the entered runway heading and the ADI (FLI) course angle

 

during the take-off roll is more than 15° the computer will compare it to the opposite runway

 

heading, or if the take-off base has been defined by a reference number, the other possible

 

runway directions on that base. If a runway heading is found, that one is used for the heading

 

correction.

 

If no runway heading is found, due to a large indication error or the wrong runway heading /

 

base has been entered, no initial course setting will occur. This is indicated by the warning light

 

NAV SYST.

 

Manual

 

The automatic setting can be overridden by pressing the reference switch on the control stick

 

after the aircraft has been carefully aligned with the runway. The computer will use the differ-

ence in angle between the entered runway heading and the course angle from the ADI (FLI)

 

for correcting the heading. This can be repeated until a satisfactory result. The computer will

 

conduct the same checks in regards to the runway heading as with the automatic course setting.

 

This is used for take-offs on slippery runway and / or with a strong crosswind.

 

Please refer to the “Manual initial course setting” section of the procedures section.

 

Edited July 20, 2017 by whaaw

[Riverseeker]

k, thanks for clarification.

 

I have started a week ago to fly the bird so i dont know really much about it.

 

I know for sure that in thunderstorm weather the nav system seems unusable, and just adding some wind sometimes make the system drift alot. No wind equal nearly no drift (on air).

 

 

:thumbup:

[-IRRE-Rolluptito]

You can enter wind direction and speed in the data panel, maybe it helps for drift problem in that condition?

[Riverseeker]

I thought meteo condition was already sat in the cardridge :cry_2:

(never checked that btw)

 

Thanks again :megalol:

[AbortedMan]

I just want to say you need to be very carefull when doing that, and there is absolutly no gain from doing it, all that can happen in worst case is that your initial fix is bad. you dont have any advantage when doing that. not a single.

your heading will fix it self after take off when initial auto fix is made. I dont want to say your doing it wrong! just want to make you aware of the problems that can happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

For more detailed Infos about initial fix read Page 131 on the manual or open the spoiler:

 

Automatic and manual initial course.

 

In order to determine the current course of the aircraft and all subsequent movements of the

 

aircraft, the system requires an initial course.

 

Automatic

 

During take-off (between the intervals of 110 – 200 km/h) the computer compares the course

 

servo with the entered runway heading. In case of a deviation from this heading, an average of

 

the course indication from the Attitude Director Indicator (ADI) is immediately added, result-

ing in correct course. This is indicated by the Course scale in the HUD moving slightly due to

 

the correction. The course correction servo is connected and is indicated by the course ring on

 

the Central Indicator and the Attitude director indicator (ADI) rotating. After the initial course

 

setting the magnetic course servo is disconnected which has continually been connected since

 

the ADI fast erect on start-up.

 

If the angle difference between the entered runway heading and the ADI (FLI) course angle

 

during the take-off roll is more than 15° the computer will compare it to the opposite runway

 

heading, or if the take-off base has been defined by a reference number, the other possible

 

runway directions on that base. If a runway heading is found, that one is used for the heading

 

correction.

 

If no runway heading is found, due to a large indication error or the wrong runway heading /

 

base has been entered, no initial course setting will occur. This is indicated by the warning light

 

NAV SYST.

 

Manual

 

The automatic setting can be overridden by pressing the reference switch on the control stick

 

after the aircraft has been carefully aligned with the runway. The computer will use the differ-

ence in angle between the entered runway heading and the course angle from the ADI (FLI)

 

for correcting the heading. This can be repeated until a satisfactory result. The computer will

 

conduct the same checks in regards to the runway heading as with the automatic course setting.

 

This is used for take-offs on slippery runway and / or with a strong crosswind.

 

Please refer to the “Manual initial course setting” section of the procedures section.

 

This is great info, thank you. I guess this explains why I was getting NAV SYS errors on the Blue Flag server when taking off from road FARPs with no known runway heading.

 

What I get from this is that you don't have to do anything if you see a discrepancy between your ADI heading and actual heading (as per the F10 map) and that it will correct itself upon takeoff. Please correct if wrong.