Damage modelpocalypse

[Cik]

Hi. I'd like to just pop in and air my grievances and ask if anyone else is having the same issue.

 

So background: I play 107th primarily PVE and usually as CP/G. My experience is that in actuality, radar guided threats (SA-8, etc.) Are less dangerous than ironsighted infantry weapons. While it seems to me that lots of aspects of the damage model of the apache are WIP or not implemented, I worry that when they are eventually added the bird is going to get roasted by light infantry fire that seems extremely and unrealistically accurate.

 

I have been repeatedly killed while moving at distances <1000 by RPGs and have been absolutely shredded at 800+ by pinpoint accurate rifle and machine gun fire by infantrymen. While this latter case doesn't seem to do much if any damage (maybe realistic, can't say) I worry that it's warping the balance of power so to speak of this range. It seems like once you start taking rifle or machine gun fire <3000~ the fire (despite not being ranged or aided by anything that measures velocity) is as or more accurate than the apache's own gun. From my understanding hitting a moving helicopter with any sort of weapon that doesn't have an FCS should be pretty difficult unless maybe it's flying right over you.

 

Using rockets or cannon (without just hovering far beyond the range of anything not radar-guided) is unduly risky (IME)

 

I think that the aircraft once it receives more updates to the damage model might be at an unrealistic disadvantage vs. it's primary threats and I'd like to see if anyone else has seen / experienced this and thinks it should be looked at.

 

Thanks.

[Scaley]

Check what skill level the AI are set to. My impression (after a LOT of testing) is that when DCS AI are set to the top skill level essentially ALL random miss distances/random imperfect behaviour is removed. In the air to air arena, for example, the top skill level AI jets will react immediately to being shot by a missile, and go to a perfect 90degree notch against the missile, even when said missile is not active and therefore would be impossible for them to detect. 

Similarly, in the Apache, if you hover in range of an RPG infantry at max skill level he will shoot you immediately, with one round, through the pilot's head. He has near 100% hit rate, regardless of wind. Clearly that shot (at 400m) would be insanely hard with an unguided RPG, even before you start accounting for wind and inbuilt variations in the rocket, launcher and sighting system. 

Turn the AI down to the lowest skill level and you'll find it much more sensible I suspect. I think people think the top skill level may make the AI "smarter" but it doesn't it just makes them more like terminator...

[NeedzWD40]

6 hours ago, Scaley said:

Check what skill level the AI are set to. My impression (after a LOT of testing) is that when DCS AI are set to the top skill level essentially ALL random miss distances/random imperfect behaviour is removed.

For the ground AI, the only difference from bottom skill to top skill is their reaction speed. Their accuracy is unchanged and an average skill unit is just as headshot capable as an excellent skill unit. Boosting the skill level just means they react quicker and get to that perfect aimpoint in a fraction of the time.

[Mr_Blastman]

Well that is silly.  Green units should have far worse accuracy than vet.

Edited September 11, 2022 by Mr_Blastman

[NeedzWD40]

You would think so, but after extensive playing around with it recently, all AI skill is equal in capability. I was trying to bring some AAA guns down to size with an accuracy reduction via script, but it's not possible to override AI targeting parameters unless you set the target groups to invisible. It's actually pretty realistic with the scripting because it's simply using getPoint and getVelocity coupled with fireAtPoint, making the guns shoot a large area in front of where the target is going, but having to set groups to invisible can break other parts of the game.

[Scaley]

1 hour ago, NeedzWD40 said:

For the ground AI, the only difference from bottom skill to top skill is their reaction speed. Their accuracy is unchanged and an average skill unit is just as headshot capable as an excellent skill unit. Boosting the skill level just means they react quicker and get to that perfect aimpoint in a fraction of the time.

OK, that's interesting and may have changed. The last time I did extensive testing was pretty much straight after the Apache launched and there was (based on just repeating the same scenario over and over and tracking hit stats) a difference. I guess another run of tests is in order. If it is ONKY reaction time that seems worse than previously. 

[dedlike.]

i wouldnt be suprised if one of the updates just broke something