Upgrading from i9900K to AMD 7700X: Thoughts?

[Lurker]

Like the title says, I'm thinking of upgrading from an i9900k to the Ryzen 7700X. It has the same core count, but the AM5 motherboards and DDR5 have dropped in price sufficiently for it to make sense from a future proofing point of view. The i9 is a 2018 chip and is getting a bit long in the tooth, although to be fair it's plenty fast enough for most of my gaming/workflow etc. 

Anyone have a similar experience? How did it go? Did it improve your experience in DCS World? I heard that there could be quite a lot of problems with getting the system to post, etc. 

Edited January 4, 2023 by Lurker

[kiss4luna]

check this 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Processors-Benchmark-List.2436.0.html?&sort=b_671_2015&deskornote=2&or=0&showBars=1&cinebench_r15_single=1&cinebench_r15_multi=1&cinebench_r20_single=1&cinebench_r20_multi=1&x265=1&blender=1&7-zip_single=1&7-zip_multiple=1&geekbench5_1_single=1&geekbench5_1_multi=1&webxprt3=1&cpu_fullname=1&l2cache=1&l3cache=1&tdp=1&mhz=1&turbo_mhz=1&cores=1&threads=1

[EightyDuce]

Don't have experience with either, but, X3D models of Zen4 "should" be announced today at CES. Might be worth holding out for. 

[Thinder]

 

[Lurker]

14 hours ago, EightyDuce said:

Don't have experience with either, but, X3D models of Zen4 "should" be announced today at CES. Might be worth holding out for. 

I think the X3D models will be too expensive for me, but I will probably hold out for their release before upgrading to the 7700X or the 7800X just to see if there are more price drops. 

[Thinder]

25 minutes ago, Lurker said:

I think the X3D models will be too expensive for me, but I will probably hold out for their release before upgrading to the 7700X or the 7800X just to see if there are more price drops. 

You need to ballance that with the cost of a DDR5 system...

[Hoirtel]

35 minutes ago, Lurker said:

I think the X3D models will be too expensive for me, but I will probably hold out for their release before upgrading to the 7700X or the 7800X just to see if there are more price drops. 

I'm pretty much in the same place you are. Replacing i9 9900. I think the 7800X3D will be the one to go for if simming is your priority. I nearly started building a 7700X system so I could upgrade but the vcache is so close now it doesn't make sense. With many new releases having problems it makes sense to wait for reviews before buying anything. From my research the 7700X will give a decent lift over 9900, but for me if the vcache chips turn out to be too hot or broken in another way, then I'll prob just go with intel.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Hoirtel

[Lurker]

6 minutes ago, Hoirtel said:

I'm pretty much in the same place you are. Replacing i9 9900. I think the 7800X3D will be the one to go for if simming is your priority. I nearly started building a 7700X system so I could upgrade but the vcache is so close now it doesn't make sense. With many new releases having problems it makes sense to wait for reviews before buying anything. From my research the 7700X will give a decent lift over 9900, but for me if the vcache chips turn out to be too hot or broken in another way, then I'll prob just go with intel.

 

I'm excited about the AM5 platform, AMD will support it for a long time, which is why I think that upgrading to AM5 over anything that Intel drops will make sense in the long run. (Unless Intel goes against their "tradition" of the past 10 years where it's been necessary to upgrade your RAM+MOBO+CPU almost every other generation) I'm in this for the long run, by which i mean that I hope I won't have to upgrade my Motherboard for at least 4-5 years. 

Unfortunately the cost of living and pretty much everything else has gone up. I can't afford the latest and best anymore, I'm going to have to make my 3090RTX work for me a for a loooong time, and this might even mean giving up on DCS at least in VR unless they fix their damn game. 

This means that I'm going to have to buy a low to midrange AM5 motherboard, a decent DDR5 Ram kit, and a CPU that won't break the bank, in the hope that a couple of years down the line I can save up for a killer CPU. 

[Thinder]

In any case, don't forget that the Ryzen 3/3D are designed for lower latencies, so if you go this way, the only way to avoid their controllers to throttle back under load are Cl14 B.die RAM kits, especially with the 3D and their cache, the gain is significant.

Here is the difference between my previous system (5600X, 3200MHz Cl14 4 X 1 stick, both CPU and GPU boosted with Ryzen Master and Nvidia Afterburner 1080Ti), vs the 5800X 3D, 3600MHz Cl14 4 X 1 stick, same 1080Ti not boosted. Tested back to back with 3DMark Pro at 4K (under load) 2 X MSAA.

Note that you don't need to splash the extra dosh on the more expensive 3600MHz kit, the 3200MHz overclok very well, it was designed for the purpose.

 

[EightyDuce]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

This means that I'm going to have to buy a low to midrange AM5 motherboard, a decent DDR5 Ram kit, and a CPU that won't break the bank, in the hope that a couple of years down the line I can save up for a killer CPU. 

Not sure if you have access a Micro Center nearby, but I built a PC for a buddy of mine recently (upgrade from 7700K at 5.2 Ghz I built for him years ago) and was able to get a 7700X with a free 32Gb kit of DDR5 6000 CL36 for just under $350 and $20 off of B650 Aorus AX Pro; so roughly $600 out the door for everything. That being said, while the free ram is not trash by any means, they were in his case, Samsung chips not SK hynix. I was still able to get them down to CL34 but you can do much better with Hynix, like down to CL28 6200. To tell the truth, 32 Gb of DDR6000 CL30 or DDR5 6400 CL32, which are pretty much guaranteed to be SK hynix Mdie if not Adie (for the 6400) can be had for $180ish. You should easily be able to hit 6000-6200 CL28 on both. 

The gigabyte B650 Aorus AX Pro ($250) is no slouch; 3 m.2, pcie5x16, solid VRMs enough to drive any 7XXX CPU, a boatload of USB ports, wifi6. Only lacking part is the audio as it only has a mic and line our (it does have an optical out as well). Honestly, I'm torn between this board and the Asus B650E-F at $300, has more Gen 2 USB ports, full audio breakout, and I'm just more used to Asus bios layout. 

My budget, expecting a roughly 4-5 year life cycle with VR is $3000. With a RTX4090 I blew through 1800 of that budget already, so I'm trying to maximize my remaining budget. I will be cutting it close with a PSU ($200), motherboard($250-300), CPU($350-450) and RAM ($180-275 hoping 64gb but it's gonna be tight). I would also like a waterblock and ditch the air cooler on the 4090, so that's another $250ish right there. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by EightyDuce

[Lurker]

I wish I had access to US hardware stores. Unfortunately I live in Europe. Everything over here is basically converted to Eur and then you get an added 15-20% to MSRP at the very least on top of the US prices AT THE VERY LEAST unless you happen to get an awesome deal. 

What Im trying to say is that I can't get a motherboard+CPU+32GBDDR5 RAM Combo for 600$, that's just not possible, not even if I went for the 7600X which to be honest is a really underwhelming chip. I'll be very lucky if I am able to pick up a decent deal for 750 Eur, it will probably be closer to 770-780 depending on the prices. 

In any case I'll be waiting for at least the next two weeks, once the X3D and non X chips are out in the wild just to see if their release changes things for the better. If the prices surge, I might even wait for the next price drops which will realistically happen in spring at the earliest. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Lurker

[EightyDuce]

Yeah without Micro Center free RAM, even stateside you're looking at 700-750 for MB+CPU+RAM(32) sadly. 

 

How is your AM4/Zen3 with Ddr4 pricing? 

 

If budget is an issue, I would strongly consider 5800X3D with a board with a bunch of USB ports and some DDR4 3600 CL14... Should be a solid setup for couple years. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by EightyDuce
Budget option

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, EightyDuce said:

Yeah without Micro Center free RAM, even stateside you're looking at 700-750 for MB+CPU+RAM(32) sadly. 

 

How is your AM4/Zen3 with Ddr4 pricing? 

 

If budget is an issue, I would strongly consider 5800X3D with a board with a bunch of USB ports and some DDR4 3600 CL14... Should be a solid setup for couple years. 

 

Yeah AM4/Zen3 is quite a bit cheaper. Especially considering that I would be able to re-use my DDR4 Ram. But if I go down that route, I might as well get the i5-13600K which seems to best it in both price and performance, in some cases by a large margin. 

The i5-13600K is seriously worth considering. 

 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Lurker

[EightyDuce]

9 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Yeah AM4/Zen3 is quite a bit cheaper. Especially considering that I would be able to re-use my DDR4 Ram. But if I go down that route, I might as well get the i5-13600K which seems to best it in both price and performance, in some cases by a HUGE large margin. 

The i5-13600K is seriously worth considering. 

 

 

Well, you may have your answer there. 13600K is no slouch, even more so if you're not looking to do VR as the main focus. 

[Lurker]

21 minutes ago, EightyDuce said:

Well, you may have your answer there. 13600K is no slouch, even more so if you're not looking to do VR as the main focus. 

Yeah, I can get a great DDR4 Z790 ATX Board + the 13600K for less than 620 Euros. Which is still expensive and might be overkill, but it's still cheaper than a DDR5 AM5 solution by quite a margin. Still it feels like a stopgap and not sure it's worth it. 

Do you know (or maybe someone else can comment) on whether it's worth going for the cheaper B760 chipset boards, I've always bought the high end Z series boards from Intel, but if Im going the stopgap route, they may really not be worth it?

Edited January 5, 2023 by Lurker

[EightyDuce]

47 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Yeah, I can get a great DDR4 Z790 ATX Board + the 13600K for less than 620 Euros. Which is still expensive and might be overkill, but it's still cheaper than a DDR5 AM5 solution by quite a margin. Still it feels like a stopgap and not sure it's worth it. 

Do you know (or maybe someone else can comment) on whether it's worth going for the cheaper B760 chipset boards, I've always bought the high end Z series boards from Intel, but if Im going the stopgap route, they may really not be worth it?

 

Someone else would be better suited to answer that, as I haven't kept up with Intel since 8/9th Gen.

Historically, Z vs B chipsets most differed in being able to OC unlocked CPUs (I think they may have relaxed some of this allowing for some overclocking on B chipsets), VRMs (thought now it's less so and B boards are shipping with beefy VRMs), number of PIC-e lanes/most current M.2 drive slots, and rear I/O ie # and types of USB, 2.5/5Gbit NIC, wifi, audio interface...

[Lurker]

I have now actually discovered that I can buy a Z690 board, which I can BIOS flash to support 13gen i5k. This is pretty cool as this means I can actually get a great board with a great feature set, for very little money. The 13gen i5 is looking mighty attractive right now, I can get the CPU+BOARD for as little as 500-550 Euros. 

[EightyDuce]

4 hours ago, Lurker said:

I have now actually discovered that I can buy a Z690 board, which I can BIOS flash to support 13gen i5k. This is pretty cool as this means I can actually get a great board with a great feature set, for very little money. The 13gen i5 is looking mighty attractive right now, I can get the CPU+BOARD for as little as 500-550 Euros. 

True. Just check the memory QVL for the board make sure it supports the RAM you're going to use and Z690 has slightly different memory compatibility from Z790. Though if you're reusing RAM you're probably fine.

[Thinder]

16 hours ago, Lurker said:

I wish I had access to US hardware stores. Unfortunately I live in Europe. Everything over here is basically converted to Eur and then you get an added 15-20% to MSRP at the very least on top of the US prices AT THE VERY LEAST unless you happen to get an awesome deal. 

What Im trying to say is that I can't get a motherboard+CPU+32GBDDR5 RAM Combo for 600$, that's just not possible, not even if I went for the 7600X which to be honest is a really underwhelming chip. I'll be very lucky if I am able to pick up a decent deal for 750 Eur, it will probably be closer to 770-780 depending on the prices. 

In any case I'll be waiting for at least the next two weeks, once the X3D and non X chips are out in the wild just to see if their release changes things for the better. If the prices surge, I might even wait for the next price drops which will realistically happen in spring at the earliest. 

 

I got a lot of stuff from Newegg without any issues, I even had a refund within a week after a mislabeled RAM kit was sent to me, replacement kit arrived shortly after order.

You have access to UK hardware stores online but don't know it, especially after some guys posted a "boycot it" topic about them, most customers are not experiencing this kind of issues.

What I got from them in 2022 in one package: MSI MEG X570S ACE MAX motherboard. Thrustmaster Warthog. Thrustmaster VG TWCS Throttle.  CORSAIR RMx Series RM850x. SAMSUNG 870 EVO Series 2.5" 2TB SATA. G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) 288-Pin PC RAM DDR4 3600.

Previous order Jan 2021. G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) 288-Pin PC RAM DDR4 3200.

Everything was shipped to me in good condition and arrived within a week <> of order.

 

[Lurker]

Bought the i5 13600KF (same as K minus the integrated graphics) managed to snag it for 350 Euros, also ordered the Gigabyte B760 Gaming X DDR4 motherboard for about 180 Euros. In the end I went for the 760 chipset, it doesn't support overclocking out of the box like the Z series, but it's cheaper, it's a very new chipset which is designed to work with 13th generation processors out of the box, and it's got all the stuff I'm ever gonna need on it really. 

I could have gone with an mATX form, which would have been even cheaper but I dislike how they really cram everything in there and you get even fewer USB and M2 drive IO lanes. 

I'll let you know how this thing flies when I assemble it later this week. Thanks to everyone for their replies. 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Lurker

[Hoirtel]

On 1/9/2023 at 10:02 AM, Lurker said:

Bought the i5 13600KF (same as K minus the integrated graphics) managed to snag it for 350 Euros, also ordered the Gigabyte B760 Gaming X DDR4 motherboard for about 180 Euros. In the end I went for the 760 chipset, it doesn't support overclocking out of the box like the Z series, but it's cheaper, it's a very new chipset which is designed to work with 13th generation processors out of the box, and it's got all the stuff I'm ever gonna need on it really. 

I could have gone with an mATX form, which would have been even cheaper but I dislike how they really cram everything in there and you get even fewer USB and M2 drive IO lanes. 

I'll let you know how this thing flies when I assemble it later this week. Thanks to everyone for their replies. 

 

@LurkerHow did the building and testing go? 

[Lurker]

6 hours ago, Hoirtel said:

@LurkerHow did the building and testing go? 

Still not there yet, apparently the store had to order the MB directly from the supplier, so the motherboard should be arriving Tuesday. 

Edited January 15, 2023 by Lurker

[Hoirtel]

14 hours ago, Lurker said:

Still not there yet, apparently the store had to order the MB directly from the supplier, so the motherboard should be arriving Tuesday. 

 

Ah no worries. Really interested to hear what you get from it!

[Lurker]

13 hours ago, Hoirtel said:

Ah no worries. Really interested to hear what you get from it!

Well apparently I'm an idiot. 

The board arrived today. Eagerly I threw myself at the upgrade. Unfortunately, I am a complete tool. Apparently my cooler is missing the LGA1700 backplate and mounting brackets, despite being advertised as supporting the socket. I checked online, i didn't look in the box. I will never make the same mistake again.

So I contacted the BeQuiet manufacturer, and hopefully they can send me the mounting brackets.*I will know more tommorow. The worst part is that this cooler DOES SUPPORT 12th and 13th gen Intel processors, however when I bought it that platform and that socket didn't exist. They added support later, and well....tldr I DIDNT LOOK IN THE GODDAMN BOX....

Needless to say I'm down and more than a little angry with myself. 

 

*of course they will charge me for them, that is assuming they have them in stock

Edited January 16, 2023 by Lurker

[Hoirtel]

10 hours ago, Lurker said:

Well apparently I'm an idiot. 

The board arrived today. Eagerly I threw myself at the upgrade. Unfortunately, I am a complete tool. Apparently my cooler is missing the LGA1700 backplate and mounting brackets, despite being advertised as supporting the socket. I checked online, i didn't look in the box. I will never make the same mistake again.

So I contacted the BeQuiet manufacturer, and hopefully they can send me the mounting brackets.*I will know more tommorow. The worst part is that this cooler DOES SUPPORT 12th and 13th gen Intel processors, however when I bought it that platform and that socket didn't exist. They added support later, and well....tldr I DIDNT LOOK IN THE GODDAMN BOX....

Needless to say I'm down and more than a little angry with myself. 

 

*of course they will charge me for them, that is assuming they have them in stock

 

Sounds like what would happen to everyone. When you open coolers a whole load of brackets fall out. How would you even know what you need for yours until you actually try and put it together?