Conflicting keybindings

[Monash]

lHello,

I have a couple of questions regarding keybinding in DCS that have arisen during setting up the F/A-18, but I suspect are issues arising from my ignorance of how the various different categories of keybindings work together in DCS.  My issues arose after I purchased and installed the A-10C, which I have loaded up, but now flown yet.

What is the difference between the UI Layer and General categories of keybinds?  Some items are in both categories, e.g., BDA show/hide.  Why? 

I want to set a button on my (real not ingame) MDF controller to the pause command which is in the UI Layer category. But when I do so, the assignment panel shows that the button I want to assign is already assigned to "Right MFCD OSB 19 (A-10C II) and F10 Theater Map View (General)"  This is shown in an attached screenshot.

However, as shown in the screenshots, these bindings are NOT set (because I've gone through and removed them as part of trying to trouble shoot this).

What is going on?

[Monash]

A follow on question.

While still trying to trouble shoot this, I returned to the UI Layer page and tried to set a keybind.  But now I get a message saying that if I change things then all changes in the A-10C profile will be lost. Why?  I mean, all I want to do is assign "pause" to a button.  Does it really have to be this complex?

 

null

[LeCuvier]

There are many commands that were duplicated across all aircraft modules. UI Layer was introduced later in order to reduce duplication. So these commands only need to be bound once under "UI Layer" and they will be effective across all modules. What's important: UI Layer bindings override whatever you have bound to a button in an aircraft module.
The "General" category is older. It was based on a similar concept, but it does not override module bindings. I hope that ED will consolidate all common commands under UI Layer, but I'm not sure they will.
The F16 MFD 1 and F16 MFD 2 have default bindings to the OSB buttons in the sim MFD, and frankly I don't think it's a good idea to bind them to PAUSE or something like that.
These default bindings are defined in the files "F16 MFD 1.lua" and "F16 MFD 2.lua" under "K:\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\aircraft\A-10C_2\Input\A-10C_2\joystick".
For example, the line below binds JOY_BTN19 on your F-16 MFD module to OSB19 of the right MFD in the sim.

{combos = {{key = 'JOY_BTN19'}}, down = iCommandPlaneRightMFD_OSB19, up = iCommandPlaneRightMFD_OSB19_Off, name = _('Right MFCD OSB 19'), category = _('Right MFCD')},

However you can bind these buttons to something else. Why you got the warning although you had removed the bindings, I have no idea. I suppose you saved your changes before you tried to re-bind them?

[Monash]

Hello LeCuvier

Thank you for the explanation re UI Layer vs General.  I appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

Putting to one side the wisdom of assigning Pause to an MFD button (which works for me because I use the clickable cockpit controls to operate the in-game MFDs), I still do not understand why it shows a conflict with other keybinds when those conflicts simply do not exist (as shown in the screenshots). 

I investigated "F16 MDF 2.lua" in the A-10C_2 folder you pointed to.  I do see the line you quoted in your reply.  But this raises a number of other questions for me:

1. Why is that keybinding in the file when it most certainly does not exist in game (because I deleted it in-game).

2. Why is a control for the F16 (which I do not own) of any relevance?  I accept it is, but I do not understand why.

3. Why is a control for the F16 included in the controls for the A-10C. 

4. Why does any of this make it so complex to set a keybinding for pause in a completely unrelated module?

As things stand, I am unable to do something that should be simple: assign pause to a button.

Sorry if I am coming across as frustrated. I do appreciate your help. 

[LeCuvier]

1. The lines in that file do not change when you add/delete/change bindings.
These actions are recorded in the related "....diff.lua" file under saved games. So, if you have deleted default bindings from the F16 MFD 2 for the A-10C II, you should see these recorded in the file "F16 MFD 2.diff.lua" under "C:\Users\xxxxx\Saved Games\DCS.openbeta\Config\Input\FA-18C_hornet\joystick".
2. The file name relates to the hardware ID. Your MFD hardware is identified as "F16 MFD 1" and ... 2, and the file name relates to that hardware ID.
3. There is no reason why the Thrustmaster MFD's could not be used with the Hog.
4. Only ED can answer that. It certainly is a complex subject and I have made suggestions to streamline the functionality, but there was no response from ED.

Note: for some aircraft modules default bindings are defined by "...diff.lua" files in the aircraft folder structure. Example: FA-18C has, among others. the file "F16 MFD 1.diff.lua" under "K:\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\aircraft\FA-18C\Input\FA-18C\joystick". This file has the same structure as the related file that records your changes under "\Saved Games...".

I do not understand all the warnings you get and I cannot look into your setup. As you seem to be a relatively new user (guessing by the number of posts you've made), I still recommend you stay awy from things defined under UI Layer.

[Monash]

Thanks again, this is very helpful to me.  You are correct: I am very new to DCS (moving over from IL-2). 

I think I need to step away from this for a while, take a break, and come back to it tomorrow.

Cheers,

Monash

[Ozone42]

Were you able to solve your issue? I’m just speculating, but since you are assigning a button to the UI Layer, it will overwrite the settings that were in the A-10C module, since the A-10C module was introduced before the UI Layer was introduced (and thus has the same settings there). I would just go ahead and let it overwrite your A-10C specific UI Layer corresponding settings and rebind them in the UI Layer, which is the new way.

If you are scared of messing things up, take a backup of your “Saved Games\DCS\Config\Input” folder (or the complete “Saved Games\DCS” folder) before you make changes, so you can restore them if needed.

[Monash]

Hello Ozone

Thanks for following up.  I have "solved" this issue by recognising that changing bindings in the UI layer can affect existing bindings for modules.  I'll admit to not fully understanding the issue, but since I really only wanted to map one key (pause/break) from the UI Layer, and now it seems to be working, I'm leaving well enough alone. 

Thanks for the tip about how to backup the input folder. 

Cheers,

Monash