unable to reproduce F/A-18C CCIP bombing training mission broken still, & minor error in unguided rockets training

[ajoleary]

Since the most recent patch that fixed the fusing options on the F/A-18 CCIP bombing training mission, it no longer progresses to the ripple bombing part of the mission. The training mission is supposed to detect the destruction of a truck after the first pass with Mk84s in CCIP, which would then queue the mission to progress to the ripple bombing tutorial. This truck destruction detection no longer seems to occur.
This breaks the mission and the ability to receive the ripple bombing tutorial to complete the training.

Also while I'm at it, the unguided rocket training mission has a minor error (it was broken before the most recent patch as well), the mission narrator explains there are 2x 19 shot 2.75" rocket pods on inner weapons stations, however the pods installed are only 7 shot pods. This does not break the mission.

Edited August 13, 2024 by ajoleary
changed from manual bombing to ripple bombing

[ajoleary]

Note I just attempted the CCIP mission 3 times and on 2nd time it worked okay and triggered training progression, 3rd attempt broken again. So the issue seems to be intermittent.

I grabbed a track file from my 3rd attempt where the fault occurs, despite doing two runs and destroying 2 groups of trucks with each Mk84.

Lesson 16-CCIP Mode Bombing.miz_13082024_15-52.trk

Edited August 13, 2024 by ajoleary

[Lord Vader]

Hey @ajoleary

It's truly strange that I cannot reproduce the blocking issue you mention. Every time I tried, the mission progressed.
Also, the track you supplied it also progresses to Mk-83 ripple drops. Perhaps you posted the wrong track. 

All I can think of is that you are not exactly hitting the trucks with enough damage to progress. The text does suggest you try again if you miss. Did you?

As for the rocket quantity item, I've reported it as a low priority item. But still important to correct, thanks. 

[ajoleary]

On both occasions, all I took out 4 trucks in two separate groups and they were all burning.

I'll have another go and see if I can capture it again. The Track file now I look at it was my 2nd pass that worked okay, even though I saved it after my 3rd run. Does the Track file not get rewritten if you select 'Fly Again'?

[frontRR]

Perhaps cause of the problem is some trigger not working.

 

[LeCuvier]

@Lord Vader: As @frontRR suspects (post above), the problem is almost certainly caused by the bug I reported on August 6.
The mission uses he trigger "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" with a parameter of 90%, and this trigger no longer works correctly. Whether it works or not, depends on how many elements of the group you have destroyed. In my mission the parameter is 50%. But I sometimes kill the target group completely in one attack and then the mission does not progress.

Edit: My work-around for my mission: I added an OR line with condition "GROUP DEAD"

Edited August 24, 2024 by LeCuvier

[ajoleary]

@LeCuvier is exactly right @Lord Vader.

Just did 3 mission replays of the CCIP training scenario again, and on my 3rd attempt I made 3 passes and shacked all three groups entirely (1 group per pass). The mission failed to progress. This time I've got the replay correct

Lesson 16-CCIP Mode Bombing.miz_25082024_04-32.trk

Edited August 24, 2024 by ajoleary

[Lord Vader]

Thanks for the new track. We'll see if the mission needs some tweaking.

[LeCuvier]

19 minutes ago, Lord Vader said:

Thanks for the new track. We'll see if the mission needs some tweaking.

Does that mean that the trigger "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" will not be fixed?

[Lord Vader]

I'm not sure what you mean @LeCuvier.

We've tested this mission once more, including following the new track. The mission flows correctly on our side to finish.

At this point, I can't figure out what could be wrong here. Triggers work as they should and mission flow is evident.

If we cannot reproduce this, I'm afraid the issue is on your side. Perhaps a missing mod still installed somewhere? 

[LeCuvier]

The trigger "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" is bugged as I have demonstrated in my post https://forum.dcs.world/topic/355492-trigger-group-alive-less-than-not-working-any-more/#elControls_5497431_menu
That's nothing to do with mods.
If it isn't fixed I can live with that, as I can easily work around it by adding an OR clause.

[Lord Vader]

Once more, we tested this and the triggers work. I am not trying to discredit you, just trying to figure out what could possibly go wrong on your side. 

[LeCuvier]

Well, so let's try to find out! I have removed all Mods which is easy using OvGME.
In order to simplify testing, I reduced the target group to one vehicle. If that vehicle is destroyed, the group is < 50% alive. Can we agree on that?

If yes, then the triggers "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" with parameter = 50% and "GROUP DEAD"  should both have the result TRUE when the one vehicle is destroyed. Correct?

So I created a test mission "Test Trigger 3.miz" which uses the trigger "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" with parameter = 50%. When that condition is TRUE then it should display the message "Oilers > 50% dead!".

And I created a control mission which is the same, but uses the trigger "GROUP DEAD" and displays the message "Oilers dead!" when the condition is TRUE.

I executed both missions, killing the one vehicle with bombs each time. The results are captured in the attached tracks "Trigger Test 3.trk" and "Trigger Test 4.trk".
"Trigger Test 3.trk" shows, on my rig, that the trigger "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" does not fire.

I hope you can reproduce the result!

Trigger Test 3.trk Trigger Test 4.trk

Edit:
I upload a track "Trigger Test 5.trk" where I use "GROUP ALIVE LESS THAN" with parameter = 50% with a target group that has 3 vehicles. Using guns, I destroy 2 of the vehicles and the trigger works, displaying the message "Oilers > 50% dead!". This confirms what I stated earlier: The trigger works if I kill > 50% of the target group's elements, but it fails if I kill all elements in one attack.

Trigger Test 5.trk

Edited August 27, 2024 by LeCuvier