Can someone comment on this tactic?

[dooom]

So a simple forum search should reveal that I have been taking my lumps learning how to fly the Su27 online and actually get a few kills. It hasn't been going particularily well unfortunately as i find my R27ER tactics in BVR are about as useful as mammaries on a log.

 

That said, I managed to capture a few f-15 kills finally yesterday on the 104th server by employing the following tactic.

 

I lift from Sochi, and fly east of Wpt 2 north bound just below mountain tops. I am trying to take advantage of look down clutter vs the f-15 tws radar. I run my radar in HI pulse at +4 at 60nm range. I would typically pick up enemy contacts bearing southbound to wpt 2 above me.

 

Once i am confident on aspect, I take my tws off the contact and wait until it is just about above me, all the while i am decreasing my scan range accordingly.

 

when the ea is above me, i pull into a hard climb, lock and fire.

 

I got 3 this way yesterday.

 

Is this a bad habit i should prevent from forming or is it a valid and realistic approach vs the f-15?

 

please comment.

 

Thanks!

:pilotfly:

[Frostie]

What I can make out your getting very close to the F-15 right?

 

This is not a good idea unless you can get close without being picked up, by notching and not using your radar so much etc.

 

When your painting targets with your radar experienced guys will know of your threat and act accordingly.

I should imagine the guys you killed doing this were very inexperienced because any F-15 pilot worth his salt would have seen your radar signal and picked you up on their own radar killing you with a silent TWS shot while you approached.

 

One tactic you should work on is getting the F-15's defensive using your longer ranged R-27ER's while changing your altitude, this way you can make harder work for their TWS and also reduce the risk of a stray AMRAAM aquiring you after they've already gone defensive. Once they are defensive its on you to press and use your EOS effectively to track and monitor on whether you can follow them without being picked up by any other bandits, stealth is important and that means minimum radar usage and paying extreme attention to your RWR.

 

Use your EOS to its max potential and try to be as sneaky as possible as most F-15 pilots will run as soon as shot at..

Edited July 2, 2010 by Frostie

[dooom]

... By saying force the f15 defense - are you meaning throw out a Launch overide r27er at him?

 

 

How do i get closer witha notch? understand notching to mean "beaming" the radar in a look down situation?

 

Would i get closer by basically doing very large S turns?

 

also how do i know when i am in a notch?

[Sov13t]

Notching is decreasing relative closure rate and introducing ground clutter to the bandits radar. No Split-S! Roughly you want to make aspect at around 100-110 degrees but this depends on velocity vectors of both you and the target.

 

The way to tell is to pay close attention to your RWR nails, the moment they disappear from that bandit you are in the notch. But this is a very delicate process and a risky one at that. Do not expect it to work in all situations.

 

Solo SU-27 is a very tough yet very exciting task. You have to be very patient and not be ballsy. Don't be afraid to waste your munitions when you are alone... if you allow the F-15 to shoot at you at will you will be in trouble and will have to go defensive, thus lose any advantage you had. Be aware of the situation around you, if you lose that awareness you lose control and it is time to extend and get safe, reestablish yourself and then press again. But once you start getting kills, they are a lot sweeter.

Edited July 2, 2010 by Sov13t

[GGTharos]

+1 for Frostie, he gave you the basics.

 

There's no hidden meanings or techniques in what he said. There's no need for you to launch-override anything, the R-27ER is a faster missile than the 120 and will get to its target first, PROVIDED that you take care to make the 120 take its time by not flying straight into it.

 

Your tactic isn't bad, and it is part of real soviet doctrine, with some caveats: Real soviet doctrine would have you sneak in under guidance of GCI while another element draws the attention of the bandits.

 

This is typically referred to as 'sneaking in an unknown shooter', and yours is but one way of accomplishing this goal. Any time you can take your opponents by surprise, do it! It maximizes your chances of survival and minimizes theirs.

 

Given what is actually happening in your example though, yes, you're dealing with inexperienced crews. More experienced crews will make you fight for it, and even more experienced ones will steamroll over you and make you feel like you were less than a speed-bump. This is a rare occurrence IMHO, but you might see it happen on occasion. It's the price you pay for being a singleton.

[thaFunkster]

Wow. Flanker flying is a whole different kettle of fish.

 

The combination of various radar modes and EOS means there are so many more options at your disposal and tactics you can use and even invent than in the Eagle.

 

Wow, I had no idea flying the Flanker online was so in depth. No wonder I steer clear of it! :)

 

dooom, with the tactic you mentioned, I dont understand how an Eagle would let you fly right up underneath them?

 

Unless you are notching, which you arent, there radar should pick you up as soon as they get nails on the RWR and turn to see who it is.

 

Being low down can mean being a bit harder to find, meaning by the time they see you you may already be ready for a shot, but most of the time they should pick you up on radar just as you did to them.

[RIPTIDE]

try to be as sneaky as possible as most F-15 pilots will run as soon as shot at..

heheheh. I laughed hard. :thumbup:

[RIPTIDE]

dooom, with the tactic you mentioned, I dont understand how an Eagle would let you fly right up underneath them?

 

Unless you are notching, which you arent, there radar should pick you up as soon as they get nails on the RWR and turn to see who it is.

 

Being low down can mean being a bit harder to find, meaning by the time they see you you may already be ready for a shot, but most of the time they should pick you up on radar just as you did to them.

I will guess its another case of new guys that haven't understood why you need to move your scan cone.

[Exorcet]

Due to internet issues, I haven't been online in a long long time. Does the 104th use AWACS currently? If so, your radar should almost never be on when not firing. Use IR and the datalink. In the Su-27, I think more of my kills are from ET and R-73 than ER. When I do use ER though, I never take advantage of the range. Instead I try to get close undetected so that after firing, there is no hope of escape.

 

My time in the Flanker also tells me that it is much harder to fly solo in than the F-15, so I suggest recruiting at least one wingman while you're waiting for the engines to spool up on the ground.

[RIPTIDE]

Due to internet issues, I haven't been online in a long long time. Does the 104th use AWACS currently? If so, your radar should almost never be on when not firing. Use IR and the datalink. In the Su-27, I think more of my kills are from ET and R-73 than ER. When I do use ER though, I never take advantage of the range. Instead I try to get close undetected so that after firing, there is no hope of escape.

 

My time in the Flanker also tells me that it is much harder to fly solo in than the F-15, so I suggest recruiting at least one wingman while you're waiting for the engines to spool up on the ground.

The 104th's revamped Moonshield mission does not use AWACS. The FC2.0 starting mission they used was Liberty. Nowadays I think its rotating mostly on Moonshield.