Possible RWR issue in single player.

[Exorcet]

I just made the following track. It shows the AI launching at me when my ECM is on (this time, their radar was displayed on the RWR when firing at me, this is not always the case, the F-15 has 360 degree coverage for radars roughly in plane with it, so they should never be out of my RWR coverage unless I bank to turn). After I get a range notification from AWACS, I shut down ECM and continue flying directly at the AI. My RWR is blank, but clearly, the R-27 is still tracking me without radar guidance or ECM to home on. Some seconds later, the RWR picks up the missile.

 

I'll see if I can get a stranger track later on.

RWR test1.trk

[asparagin]

This is not a bug, but a neat trick you can do with the ER. The Flanker launches on you HOJ, and locks on your jam. When you turn your ECM off, the guidance from the lock kicks in, and you experience missile launch, although the missile is almost at your door.

Edited August 6, 2010 by asparagin

[Fahhh]

Yup, I've scored a number of nice long range 50-60 km ER kills on jamming bandits. The jammer denies/delays you the launch warning you would otherwise get when you are been fired upon...

[Exorcet]

This is not a bug, but a neat trick you can do with the ER. The Flanker launches on you HOJ, and locks on your jam. When you turn your ECM off, the guidance from the lock kicks in, and you experience missile launch, although the missile is almost at your door.

 

 

I'm aware of this tactic, the thing is, my RWR picked up nothing for a few seconds between me taking off ECM and getting a lock warning. All the while, the ER was pulling more/less than 1.0 g.

[Rambler91]

Is this happening all the time or just this once?

[RIPTIDE]

This is like LOAL mode. I wonder is it modelled in AI's?

[Rambler91]

Oh, man.... I forgot one thing: R-27 R/ER missiles are having an inerttional navigational system.

 

In addition to the seekers, the missile control system also includes an inertial navigation system with radio correction.

 

Source: Flaming Cliffs 2.0 Flight Manual

Source: Inertial navigation system on wiki

 

 

That explains the delayed RWR missile lock warning.

Edited August 7, 2010 by Rambler91
Grammar errors

[asparagin]

I'm aware of this tactic, the thing is, my RWR picked up nothing for a few seconds between me taking off ECM and getting a lock warning. All the while, the ER was pulling more/less than 1.0 g.

 

Well there are 2 posibilities:

1. There is a delay between lock and received signal on your RWR. You can check this by making further test. It can be easly explained by the fact that the RWR has to check for some time if there really is a change in the radar signal, what would signalize a launch. (see also here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=56638

 

2. It can aslo be that for some time the ER was idle, then lock was achieved and guidance kicked in. You can also do this: Lock a target, fire ER, release lock: the missile goes ballistic, re-lock the target: missile gets guidance again and resumes flight towards the target.

 

And about 1G for the missile, this nothing, the ER can take 18G.

[asparagin]

Oh, man.... I forgot one thing: R-27 R/ER missiles are having an inerttional navigational system.

 

This is what SARH is all about.

[Exorcet]

Is this happening all the time or just this once?

 

Happens fairly often.

 

Oh, man.... I forgot one thing: R-27 R/ER missiles are having an inerttional navigational system.

 

 

 

Source: Flaming Cliffs 2.0 Flight Manual

Source: Inertial navigation system on wiki

 

 

That explains the delayed RWR missile lock warning.

 

INS doesn't allow a missile to actually track though. At best, it's lets the missile move to my guess position before radar correction. INS could be the answer though, I'd have to see if the missile is following me or if it's maneuvering along its original path.

 

Well there are 2 posibilities:

1. There is a delay between lock and received signal on your RWR. You can check this by making further test. It can be easly explained by the fact that the RWR has to check for some time if there really is a change in the radar signal, what would signalize a launch. (see also here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=56638

 

2. It can aslo be that for some time the ER was idle, then lock was achieved and guidance kicked in. You can also do this: Lock a target, fire ER, release lock: the missile goes ballistic, re-lock the target: missile gets guidance again and resumes flight towards the target.

 

And about 1G for the missile, this nothing, the ER can take 18G.

 

I'll check number 1

 

About 2 and the 18g limit, I know about both. If the missile went idle, it should be flying at 1g because it would not know where to fly (with the exception of INS guidance at guess target location).

[Rambler91]

INS doesn't allow a missile to actually track though. At best, it's lets the missile move to my guess position before radar correction. INS could be the answer though, I'd have to see if the missile is following me or if it's maneuvering along its original path.

 

When SARH is launched ( in this case R-27 ER) he is tracking bogey.

If, from some reason, launching platform loses it's radar lock, INS comes in. INS works by remembering last input data form launching aircaft for the bogey (attitude, speed, heading) and the missile will continue it's flight based on that data. An if the bogey retains same these values, there is great chance that a missile hit will occur without renewed radar lock.

So, when launching aircraft loses lock with it's SARH, change all of those 3 parameters (and send him a "gift" in form of AMRAAM or other active radar missile).

 

I'll hope that thiss will help you to shake off those nasty little buggers.. :smilewink:

[Boberro]

Well there are 2 posibilities:

 

 

2. It can aslo be that for some time the ER was idle, then lock was achieved and guidance kicked in. You can also do this: Lock a target, fire ER, release lock: the missile goes ballistic, re-lock the target: missile gets guidance again and resumes flight towards the target.

 

And about 1G for the missile, this nothing, the ER can take 18G.

 

I tested and it doesn't relock on target often.... so nothing from silent attacks via ER :D

[asparagin]

I tested and it doesn't relock on target often.... so nothing from silent attacks via ER :D

 

:D, yes it's true not all the time