Customizable Touchscreen Keyboard

[ZQuickSilverZ]

I was just curious. Why hasn't one of the major pc hardware market guys made a fully customizable touchescreen keyboard for gaming?

Touchbuddy is great and all but for me it would just be better to totally get rid of the standard keyboard and get touch buddy functionality without having to have an extra monitor taking up space. Plus it would fit on my desktop and be easy to reach (I imagine most touchbuddy displays your reaching across the desk creating fatigue over time). I would like to see something so simple that you could litterly draw what keys you wanted with a styles on the keyboard and assign keys strokes or macros or for finer detail use a design program. Take a first person shooter for example. When I play CoD4 I only use 10 keys on the keyboard (the rest of what I need is on my mouse). It would be nice to eliminate the rest of them and put the others where I WANT them. You could have a switch button that would bring back the regular keyboard in case you wanted to text chat or something then flip it back. You could litterly make your keyboard key say landing gear for instance and have it shaped like a triangle. You could launch missles with a button that litterly looked like a missle. The keys could even be color coded according to the situation (like red for laser off and green for laser on for instance) The keys could even be animated (like fire coming out the back of a missle). You could even have your keyboard give you alerts like Email, Xfire messages, run a timer, display the DCS manual, display the time, display people speaking in teamspeak, on part of the left side and all your controls on the right. Play mini games while your helo starts up, watch internet TV while your flying that long haul to the waypoint, dial in your TrackIR settings in game. So what do you guys think.... should logitech or saitek do this? Maybee another company? What ideas do you have that you could use a fully customizable touch keyboard for. Would this be marketable?

Edited October 28, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[Sov13t]

Optimus Maximus has a similar concept. ArtLebedyev has had a few other concepts, ideas... are you willing to part with $2.4k for it?

 

http://www.artlebedev.ru/everything/optimus/

 

http://www.artlebedev.ru/everything/optimus-tactus/

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Thats sorta what I envisioned. I did'nt think of making icons on the keyboard though, thats a cool idea. I think thats a bit much but I might pay $200 to $300 dollars. I mean honestly what I had in mind is really just a keyboard shaped and sized monitor. Touch technology is becomeing the norm so the hardware should not be that expensive. It should'nt be much more expensive than a touch screen. Honestly the first time I thought about this was about a year after Nintedo DS came out. I thought to myself you know what, I bet laptops in the future will be built like this. One screen would just be a display touch screen (for main display but still touchable) and the other a touch screen that can display program specific interactive control interfaces. I honestly still believe this will come to pass. Its just a matter of time.

Edited October 28, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[JaseGill]

It already exists, and is just like a large Nintendo DS.

Its called the Toshiba Libretto W100. Google it, it looks cool but I hear isnt all that fantastic. Effectively its a book layout laptop and where the Keyboard usually is there is a touch-screen.

Could make a good networked Touchbuddy almost in the same way you envisage it.

Not cheap though...

J.

[power5]

Hardware is the cheap part. Learn programing code and spend the next couple years of your life working on drivers and GUI programming so it works with all mothboards and os'es in use today. Then spend the rest of your life modifying that code to work with all the next software.

 

$300 is a bit insulting for what you want. A capacitve touch monitor is way more than that much and you want a super thin keyboard sized one. I like the idea too but be reasonable with your price.

 

Libretto is sweet except for it's name.

Edited October 28, 2010 by power5

[Flim]

Our software can do this and more, all you need is a touch LCD.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

power5 how is what I asked for any different than current LCD monitors outside of the keyboard like measurements? LCD's are already super thin (ever seen an IPhone, and that has a processor, a camera, phone electronics and a battery) so how is making one as thin as a keyboard a big deal? How is using a touch keyboard any different than using a touch screen except for the location? Its not. That touch interface is already being made for the monitors. Those all have to work with all the things you mentioned (drivers, GUI's, motherboards, OS's) so why could'nt the keyboard? Also if the touch keyboard takes off they don't have to program for future software. The software will have to be programmed to take advantage of the keyboard. Also the monitors are not way more expensive you can get a 15 inch touchscreen right now on newegg for $359. So how do you figure that a 15 inch (which is a bigger display) with built in speakers is a doable consumer price but $300 for smaller sized screen with no speakers is unrealistic. Your making alot of comments but none of them seem to have any kind of research behind them. You even had a poster come in here and say that his company's software can already do it. $300 dollars is not insulting sir..... your comments are insulting.

Edited October 29, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[Shaman]

There's one thing I hate about touch screens, I don't feel the texture and shape of controls under my fingers. And the whole point of working with your fingers is to use their most complex nerve endings.

This is something I find more and more shitty about a/c touch-glass cockpits. Because you can't blindly look for the controls, you must read the screen first and put finger in the right place. In old cockpits you can work blindfolded, more efficient, more reliable, safer.

[Flim]

There's one thing I hate about touch screens, I don't feel the texture and shape of controls under my fingers. And the whole point of working with your fingers is to use their most complex nerve endings.

This is something I find more and more shitty about a/c touch-glass cockpits. Because you can't blindly look for the controls, you must read the screen first and put finger in the right place. In old cockpits you can work blindfolded, more efficient, more reliable, safer.

 

In real airplanes, I love switches, but we all know the future of pilot traning and real aircraft will end up with touchscreens- maybe one switch for the battery if your lucky!

[power5]

power5 how is what I asked for any different than current LCD monitors outside of the keyboard like measurements? LCD's are already super thin (ever seen an IPhone, and that has a processor, a camera, phone electronics and a battery) so how is making one as thin as a keyboard a big deal? How is using a touch keyboard any different than using a touch screen except for the location? Its not. That touch interface is already being made for the monitors. Those all have to work with all the things you mentioned (drivers, GUI's, motherboards, OS's) so why could'nt the keyboard? Also if the touch keyboard takes off they don't have to program for future software. The software will have to be programmed to take advantage of the keyboard. Also the monitors are not way more expensive you can get a 15 inch touchscreen right now on newegg for $359. So how do you figure that a 15 inch (which is a bigger display) with built in speakers is a doable consumer price but $300 for smaller sized screen with no speakers is unrealistic. Your making alot of comments but none of them seem to have any kind of research behind them. You even had a poster come in here and say that his company's software can already do it. $300 dollars is not insulting sir..... your comments are insulting.

 

Helios is awesome software and I can not wait to buy. Its not a keyboard though. Its not a touchscreen keyboard. How much does an iPhone cost? Pretty sure they are still way over $300. Power requirements for an iPhone are much lower than a keyboard sized screen. Heat increases with power also so getting it into a iPhone slim container becomes more expensive. Helios will only do what they program it to do. It will not work in office. It will not work in firefox. They are working on one part of your big complex puzzle.

 

Why dont you do some research and find out how much a screen in your dimensions will cost. Then start looking into software developers who could write code for it and how much that will cost. Someone will have drivers and GUI all done for you. None of that will need to be worried about I guess. I wasn't trying to insult you, but your price is low and naive, or the market would have been flooded with them by now and that Art Lebedyev stuff would not be the only concept.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Power requirements should not be an issue if its powered off of USB. I have seen alot of smaller touch screens powered this way (backlit too) and even if thats not possible an electrical outlet can be used. A touchscreen keyboard by design is not portable so compareing it to an IPhone does'nt work since it does not require a battery. Also an IPhone has a CPU inside it, memory, a battery (which is expensive by itself), a camera, flash, GPS function, high performance speakers, and a high performance mic. All those things add to the cost beyond simply the price of the touchscreen. An IPhone is not just a phone with a touchscreen its a mini computer. I also believe that Apple products have an inflated price anyway. I have to assume that since current small screen monitors don't get hot and current touch screens don't get hot that heat won't be a problem. I belive that this product could very easily be made for that pricepoint. I could do it right now but the dimensions would not be right (though I would have to use a power cord) using a 15 inch monitor. I could make this now for $358. The only differene is what I would have to use now has a bigger screen and no software. So if I can do it now for $358 then why is 300 low and naive.

Edited October 31, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[Slayer]

Microsoft patented a multitouch touchscreen keyboard that detects where your hands are, so no matter where you place your hand the keys are always in proper position..maybe we will see something in a few years.

[power5]

There is a CPU in a KB I would think. Especially if its a LCD touch screen. Not a A4 or whatever an iPhone has, but still a CPU of some sort I assume. Also will have ram and a graphics chip. Just a weaker "computer" than an iPhone. No GPS or camera or speakers I guess but still more than just a screen.

 

Touchscreens get hot. That is why the monitor case has vents in it. Takes a lot more power to light a 15" screen at 300cd/m^2 than the same brightness for an iPhone screen.

 

A 15" monitor uses a screen that thousands of products use. Economy of scale says that will decrease the cost of the single unit. Your KB would use a screen that absolutely no other product uses. So, no economy of scale on your parts.

 

Software is what makes a tech device. The hardware is just a small proponent of the final object. You are taking the price of a 15" monitor and deciding that since a KB is smaller it will be cheaper. The difference in price would be used for designing the case and software. Testing and marketing is all free I suppose. All of the investment needs to be amortized into the cost of the units.

 

I would love to see an affordable KB like you want as well. But seeing as there are clicky keyboards from logitech that are over $150, I see no way of making a LCD touch for just double that price.

 

Again, not attacking you silverZ, just having a debate.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Slayer thats a great idea. The problem is you have to touch it to center. Typist keep thier fingers on the home row so it works great. In a game enviroment you dont have your hands positioned like a typist your pushing 1 to 3 keys. So it would be difficult to say just push the g button.

 

Power I don't know about cpu's in keyboards.... maybee they have them. Keyboards usually don't have memory your PC software takes care of all that. They could have memory (for profiles and such) but its not neccessary in any way and it surely is not ram. No keyboard / monitor has ram. Why would ANY keyboard need short term memory? No keyboard / monitor has a graphics chip. Why would they? The tower has graphic cards. Touch screens may get warm.... but they don't get that hot otherwise they would burn you. You have a valid point about economy of sales. However, your point about it being a product noone uses (software I mean)....... almost every PC product uses a keyboard. Your comments about graphics chips and memory in a touchscreen tell me that you have little experience with computer hardware. Your making an arguement for something that its very clear you have little understanding of. No offense power5

Edited November 1, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[power5]

god damit. Long post got sent to oblivion. So short version:

 

I admit I do not know how stuff works inside a computer together. I have built 4 computers in my home so far so I do know the basics of what the parts do, just not how. If your KB uses all computer resources then it will obviously impact the PC performance. That is why I thought the KB could have its own hardware. Your KB will need a power cable, unless a couple USB can power it. It will also need a monitor cable, unless USB can carry that without too much lag.

 

If you do know enough about the hardware required, why not press forward? Having a screen produced at your size should not be too difficult. Then a simple KB case made from Fiberglass. A flash representation of the GUI would be more than good enough to show to investors for a business loan and patent applications.

 

If you get anywhere near your price point, I would definitely buy at least one.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

I would not begin to know where to find someone to make a prototype KB. I don't posses the skill to make the software for that. Anybody out there know where to find a company that can make a touchscreen to fit? I might just download some touchbuddy software and make the thing myself. I had considered taking 2 10 inch monitors and combining them. I have seen pics where the bezel was removed to make one display on other bigger monitors. I think this monitor would be perfect for my needs.

 

http://notebooks.com/2010/07/12/imo-monster-10-inch-usb-powered-touchscreen-monitor/

 

The author of the article says the price at 259.99 is steep. So that tells me you can get simular tech cheaper. the screen is only 1 inch thick. Kinda like a regular KB huh? I suppose I could buy one now for proof of concept tests.

Edited November 1, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[Gadroc]

I have two 10.4" touch screens I've built up in my cockpit.

 

1) 10.4" 800x600 LCD Panel - $114

2) VGA Driver Board for LCD Panel - $35

3) 10.4" 5 Wire Resistive Touch panel w/ USB Controller - $80

 

You could fit these into about an 1" / 1.5" deep case, but I'm not sure how cooling would be in that configuration.

 

Each LCD panel has 1/4 to 1/2 or more metal around it on each side and the visible area of the panels does not go all the way to the metal. So if you tried to join two you would have at least a 3/4" bezel in the center. Not to mention that would require two VGA inputs to drive, unless you add another $100+ for a Matrox Dual Head to Go setup.

 

You're just not going to find an LCD keyboard or build one for <$300, especially since it would be pretty much the only device which needs LCD panels of that size and shape.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Alot of the smaller touchscreens are now USB powered. The case would not be a problem for a purpose made product. Your point about it being the only product that uses that size and shape of LCD is lost on me. LCD's are made in all shapes and sizes these days. Look at all the phones out there with different sized LCD's, all the kiosk out there with different sized LCD's, all the car stereo equipment out there with different sized LCD's. As far as building one myself I have seen 2 (larger) screens combined in a home cockpit before that had the middle part of the bezels removed and the screens made flush to create one screen (though it had a line down the middle).

 

So your problems were

 

Case - Solved with purpose built case

Gap in the middle of the screen - Solved in a purpose built screen, possible problem if I built it myself

VGA inputs - solved with USB connected and powered monitors

Properly Sized Screen - I don't beleive this to be as much of a problem as you do I suppose since LCD's are made in all shapes and sizes.

 

I believe this keyboard to be an inevitability. With all this touch tech floating around I am sure it is just around the corner. Let's see how much it cost when it comes out.

Edited November 1, 2010 by ZQuickSilverZ

[Slayer]

Theres several freeware programs to make a keyboard on touchscreen monitors. Just look on google

[power5]

They can make LCDs in any size. Apple buys way over the minimum order quantity for the iPhone size. As do all the other types you mentioned. You may be able to get a prototype made, but it will not be at the minimum order price. If you want to make it yourself, I would look into setting a normal 20" 16x9 touch (roughly the same width as a full KB) into a desktop. Or find something that uses a similar size to what you want and ask the manufacturer for one. Then pick one of the softwares from google and be satisfied. Making it a KB would be sweet, but you said you do not have the ability. I would not be surprised if there is a software designer forum of some sort to find a person willing to make it on the cheap for you as well. There are programs out there it seems if you wanted to go premade.

 

If you google and find custom LCD prototype manufacturers and get one, making the case would be easy. Make a mockup of the screen dimensions of wood. Then find some pink foam at home depot and shape it by hand with sand paper and other tools. When shape is correct, put some release agent in the mold and lay fiberglass in it. Remove mold and finish with dremel and hand tools. May not win a fashion show, but will work. I made models like that in college every quarter. Takes some time but not much money.

 

I do wish you luck and I will be very jealous when you do get it working in whichever way you want.

[ZQuickSilverZ]

Thank you power5. I think right now I will give it 6 months and see what happens. I do think this product will be announced soon. Its just a logical step. Someone has already posted a dual screen laptop. I think thats a sign of things to come. Keyboards are great for what they are but it would be much better for a keyboard to be able to design itself according to the software your using to make programs more user friendly. The only fault I see with this system is lack of haptic feedback. It is just a question of if what you gain is worth losing the physical feedback you get from a keystroke and how adaptable they can make it. If they can ever solve that then the age of the standard keyboard will truly be over.