JTAC-FAC / ME trigger queries

[coolts]

In the current absence of a beta GUI/ME manual I am having a few issues getting my head round the JTAC advanced actions in the ME and their meaning with relation to getting the most from your JTAC units.

 

Please don’t confuse this with radio-noob-ness. The WarriorX posts have helped me sort the comms system out and I can always contact my JTAC once he is triggered, although getting a response is a different matter. Here are the options as i see them

 

Assumption #1

JTAC “Actions” can be added to a unit on either its “route” or “triggered actions” tabs. Now I am assuming here that the former is the default for bog standard units who you want there for the start of a mission for example, whereas the latter are for dynamically triggered / flag driven events.

 

Assumption #2

The “perform command” action type is where you get your JTAC/FAC call sign and frequencies. This works fine and I can set this in the “route” or “triggered actions” sections and get both to work correctly.

 

The grey area

Under the “perform task” action type I can assign “FAC-Attack group”

Under the “start enroute task” action type I can assign “FAC-engage group” and “FAC”

 

Now there may very well be many ways to peel an onion but could someone please describe the difference of these three?

 

FAC – has no options and I presume is for pure “enemies within visual range” passive “sentry” type FAC operations? I have used GESKES method of using this FAC type to get taking from a predator drone and allow the actual FAC to be a few miles behind the lines in a safe area.

 

FAC – Engage group, obviously wants to you define a single enemy unit and gives the weapons choice of “auto” only when targeted at a group

 

FAC – Attack group, obviously wants to you define a single enemy unit and gives a whole lot of weapons choice as well as auto once targeted.

 

Now as my humble FAC/JTAC is a hummer and hasn’t got access to missiles and cluster bombs I assume that the FAC – Attack group option is intended to guide the players flight in employing weapons the JTAC chooses.

 

Does that mean that FAC – Engage group implies that the JTAC will engage the enemy ITSELF, (not good), or just won’t define a preferred engagement weapon fron the players flight?

 

JTAC Tests

I have created a test mission where I have an enemy convoy crossing a bridge and approaching an area with my JTAC hummer who is pointed at the bridge.

The bridge has a trigger zone. Once the enemy convoy hits the Trigger zone it activates several AI TASKS;

 

 

These were defined on the JTAC units “Triggered Actions” TAB as follows;

Now, as soon as these action trigger, i get the JTAC option in my FM comms menu and call him, but get no response.

 

Now either;

1. He has no LOS to the enemy, (i've been repeatedly calling him when the enemy are less than 1km from his posotion and he must be looking right at them. Will he not call back with "no tasking" if this is the case?
   
2. I’ve chosen the wrong option somewhere
   
3. The FAC – engage group can’t be triggered dynamically
   
4. The FAC – Attack group can’t be triggered dynamically
   
5. I’ve done something else daft.
   
6. once triggered the JTAC checks once to see if it has an enemy within range then goes to sleep if its targetted unit is not within range.
   
7. WIP
   

Any help would be appreciated as always guys

Cheers

 

C

Edited November 14, 2010 by coolts

[nomdeplume]

Have you read the "New AI Task System" PDF in the docs directory? This gives a fairly good explanation of how things are intended to work. None of the FAC options will attack the enemy itself; that would I think be left up to the normal waypoint and combat AI to resolve.

 

My understanding is:

 

"FAC" - generic FAC that will order attacks on anything it detects.

 

"FAC - Attack Group" - directs attacks against the particular group using the selected weapon. FAC unit will have magical knowledge of the location of the group.

 

"FAC - Engage Group" - directs attacks against the particular group, but only if it can detect that group.

[coolts]

I will read that doc next on my list. My JTAC's usually work, but this is the only time i have "triggered" one. I will add an overhead drone to see wether that sparks him into life.

 

**EDIT"" From the "AI Task" Doc

 

Perform TASK

 

10. FAC - Attack Group.

Control of attacking the enemy group by friendly attack aircraft(s).

Group type – all.

Group tasks – AFAC (in case of aircraft group).

Group will acts as FAC and when player arrived into region and established communication with FAC FAC will order him to attack assigned enemy group and will provide terminal attack control. FAC will not order player attack other enemy groups.

FAC always knows about the target group and knows where it located.

Group for attack can be selected same way In ―Attack Group‖ task.

You can also select weapon that FAC will order player to use in attack.

 

Start Enroute Task

 

6. FAC.

Forward air controller.

Group type – all.

Group tasks – AFAC (for aircrafts).

The group will act as FAC. The group will select most important or dangerous targets in battlefield and assign it to player's flight for attack and will provide terminal attack control. There are no limitations on targets those FAC will order player's flight to attack.

 

 

7. FAC - Engage Group.

The same “FAC - Attack Group” task, but in this task FAC don't know about the target group and where it located. FAC must detect this group during mission.

Task priority can be set in ―PRIORITY‖ spin box. Greater value – higher priority.

Edited November 14, 2010 by coolts

[coolts]

I have abandoned triggered actions for now and gone back to bog standard actions which seem to work. possibly a WIP issue but setting triggers to "activate AI", etc seem a bit much for the JTAC logic ATM.

[tflash]

Anyway keep us posted on your progress since your scenario seems interesting.

[Grimes]

I can't believe I didn't notice the triggered actions tab... I was wondering why I couldn't get anything to show up for "AI Task". Now I gotta redo a bunch of tests to figure out if I can accomplish something.

[coolts]

I couldnt get it to work Grimes. I had a JTAC which was to be triggered, so my understanding is that you add its functions to the "triggered actions" tab then call them from a trigger. There are two extra triggers you need to implement first, the usual "activate group", but also the new "group AI in". you then activate the stored tasks using "AI task" calls.

 

My JTAC activated but did bugger all.

 

posiibly a beta issue as when i use the exact same commands using actions in the group tab it all works fine. I hope they update the "AI Task" docs with beta3

Edited November 15, 2010 by coolts

[Grimes]

Hmmm. Honestly there is no need to trigger a FAC's callsign and frequency. Just attach that to the first waypoint and you are good to go.

 

Honestly I've had the best luck using a predator as a FAC. Set it to a hold pattern and it will almost always find targets for you. Land units are abit more tricky.