New MIGs are coolers

[GGTharos]

No, you underestimate the Hornet's. You don't turn with a Hornet, you go around it :) Or above it or whatever else it is that it can't do ;)

 

You underestimate mig's turning capabilities.

[ФрогФут]

Any numbers?:)

[GGTharos]

I've seen a 50DPS ITR line somewhere, but that was the SH. I expect the legacy hornets to be similar. And of course there's the alpha handling ... the weak point is sustained turn rates at high speed (not so good because of low TWR) and acceleration. In general the Hornet likes to make the fight slow, and if you don't slow down with him you will be ok.

 

This is for guns fights and probably relatively correct for missiles like AIM-9M. If you slow down with a hornet, you are just fighting his fight.

[ФрогФут]

And of course there's the alpha handling ...

9.12 is not so bad if we are talking about Aim-9m/r-73 dogfight with its ability to go on 40 degrees alpha.:)

[GGTharos]

No, but according to pilots you're more worried about flying a MiG on the edge than you are doing so with a Hornet. On average this contest should probably be dominated by the Hornet. Like I said, the MiG has other strengths it can take advantage of, and yes, R-73 is another one :)

 

9.12 is not so bad if we are talking about Aim-9m/r-73 dogfight with its ability to go on 40 degrees alpha.:)

[ФрогФут]

No, but according to pilots you're more worried about flying a MiG on the edge than you are doing so with a Hornet.

Maybe, but until we have any actual numbers for F/A-18C we are talking about, everything is just chat.:)

[GGTharos]

This goes a little beyond numbers. It has to do with having FBW or not, and 'carefree' handling.

 

Maybe, but until we have any actual numbers for F/A-18C we are talking about, everything is just chat.:)

[ФрогФут]

It has to do with having FBW or not, and 'carefree' handling.

We can always move to MiG-29K/M.:)) In other cases everything will lead to pilot experience, cause F/A-18 is probably easier to master, than 9.12. The one i spoke to told about getting 29 on high alpha is easier, than 27 and he mentioned no problems on staying there.

[sobek]

The one i spoke to told about getting 29 on high alpha is easier, than 27 and he mentioned no problems on staying there.

 

The question is whether it is still so easy when somebody is giving you a run for your money. :)

[ФрогФут]

Well the talk was about dogfight.:)

[59th_Buncsi]

Well in the 29 series the 9.12 has the most maneuverability. The German MiGs has reduced engine to have more life-time. Against F-16Cs they still won without loss in close air combat, but not against the swiss hornets. (Both exercises were in the middle of 90s).

[mvsgas]

Well in the 29 series the 9.12 has the most maneuverability. The German MiGs has reduced engine to have more life-time. Against F-16Cs they still won without loss in close air combat, but not against the swiss hornets. (Both exercises were in the middle of 90s).

When you say F-16C, which ones are you referring to? Block 25, 30, 32, 40 42, 50, 52?

Also in the mid 90 MIG-29 had a high off boresight missile, US designed aircraft didn't

[59th_Buncsi]

What is sure: 32 and 40. But the others are also not excluded.

[Shinigami]

Well my uncle says that the mig-29 that he fly are able to support a caravan so I'm guesting is not big problem for the mig-29 newer version to get a hi turn ratio against a hornet.

 

 

Having in count that the mig always has better maneuverability than the F.

 

Shinigami Out...

[GGTharos]

Well my uncle says that the mig-29 that he fly are able to support a caravan

 

What does that mean? O.o

 

so I'm guesting is not big problem for the mig-29 newer version to get a hi turn ratio against a hornet.

 

Wanna bet?

 

Having in count that the mig always has better maneuverability than the F.

 

Not against a Hornet. The MiG-29 is an energy fighter against a Hornet :)

[Shinigami]

What does that mean? O.o

 

Well he says that whit all the slats and flaps (another wing over the wing in his word:D) out he could fly rly slow to provide cover to a caravan like a Su-25T wild do.

 

 

 

Wanna bet?

 

 

switching of the alpha limiter???

 

 

 

Not against a Hornet. The MiG-29 is an energy fighter against a Hornet :)

 

 

Well he have no numbers but let me ask him on that.

Edited April 7, 2011 by Shinigami

[GGTharos]

Has he ever flown against a Hornet?

 

Not that it matters - if you know where to look, you'll find numbers for both.

 

Well he have no numbers but let me ask him on that.

[Shinigami]

Has he ever flown against a Hornet?

 

Not that it matters - if you know where to look, you'll find numbers for both.

 

 

Sorry the post went wrong and not all the response were there read it again.

 

Truly hope his not cause then we would be at the start of WWIII:D but perhaps he have some Intel I'm just guessing.

[GGTharos]

Well, sometimes there are exercises, though I can't see Cuban MiGs doiung exercises with USN Hornets... ;)

 

Sorry the post went wrong and not all the response were there read it again.

 

Truly hope his not cause then we would be at the start of WWIII:D but perhaps he have some Intel I'm just guessing.

[Shinigami]

Also I found the inf on the new helmet project is joint venture with a freench Sextant Displays they are testing it in the mig-35.

 

Is more or less similar to the JHMCS.

[Shinigami]

Well, sometimes there are exercises, though I can't see Cuban MiGs doiung exercises with USN Hornets... ;)

 

of course not we would wing all the mock up and that wouldn't be fair with the Yumas:D

Edited April 7, 2011 by Shinigami

[59th_Buncsi]

Not against a Hornet. The MiG-29 is an energy fighter against a Hornet :)

 

Thats not right. In 2000 here was an exercise between the 29 and F-18. The 18 has 2 powerful engine same as the MiG, but if you pull the stick its speed reduce very fast, like you crash into the wall with a car. (Dont forget: What you read in the plane's manual, thats not always right :))

[Shinigami]

Thats not right. In 2000 here was an exercise between the 29 and F-18. The 18 has 2 powerful engine same as the MiG, but if you pull the stick its speed reduce very fast, like you crash into the wall with a car. (Dont forget: What you read in the plane's manual, thats not always right :))

 

You have further info in that mater:helpsmilie: so I can add that info to my uncle one for a powerful left blow to the GGTharos flimsy Fart-18:D

 

No, joke apart, info never is much and I would like to see it

 

Shinigami Out....:megalol:

[GGTharos]

What you read in the plane's manual is pretty much always right; what you might THINK you're reading in the manual might not be.

 

As I said, the MiG-29 is an energy fighter compared to the F-18. It's TWR is greater than the F-18's. Frankly if you ever saw F-18 motors you'd laugh. You can take one of those and shove it right inside a MiG-29's engine, that's how small they are by comparison. :)

 

Basically this means: The F-18 can easily 'win' one turn, depending on your definition of 'win'. But after this, if the MiG-29 pilot did not slow down as well, he can just fly around the Hornet's turn circle (or just take it to the vertical) and win the fight if the F-18 doesn't take advantage of its advantage right away.

 

These two are classic energy v angles fighter :)

 

Thats not right. In 2000 here was an exercise between the 29 and F-18. The 18 has 2 powerful engine same as the MiG, but if you pull the stick its speed reduce very fast, like you crash into the wall with a car. (Dont forget: What you read in the plane's manual, thats not always right :))

[GGTharos]

You can try looking for F-18 NFM-200.

 

No, joke apart, info never is much and I would like to see it

 

Shinigami Out....:megalol: