Thrustmaster Cougar

[Manny]

For you Thrustmaster Cougar owners/users, I am interested in your opinion of it. I once owned the Thrustmaster F-22 Pro and though I enjoyed it, I did find spring tension and forces a workout for my wrist. Of course this HOTAS was mostly plastic with metal bases and I read the updated feature list for the Cougar... I am impressed to say the least.

 

Chime on in....

[Yellonet]

A lot of people are saying that the stock cougar have so many problems and a strange feel to it that I'm beginning to think it's not worth its price.

[Manny]

A lot of people are saying that the stock cougar have so many problems and a strange feel to it that I'm beginning to think it's not worth its price.

 

Interesting. I was reading in the Thrustmaster Cougar thread that has gone into overtime how it requires modification right out of the box (F-22 PRO did not) and how the gimble mechanism and psring tension is still poorly constructed. Then again, I can not say the X45 is any better with lower forces but still a gimble and psring.guide mech that does not allow the smoothest of flight.

 

The mods folks were mentioning are pretty unique in scope and putting hall effect sensors in place of pots in a stick is a novel idea. Questions why Thrustmaster has not simply purchased the rights to the best mods and simply re-made the Cougar... hmmm

 

Well price wise $500+ to have a good stick is worth flying lessons and that is too much. I suppose the CH Flight SIm Yoke will remain king without the need for a center detent, low, very low spring forces, and flies great.

[Yellonet]

Uhm... a yoke isn't exactly the best for a combat flight sim.

[LawnDart]

Sounds like you both have browsed and read the other Cougar threads around. While it can be misconstrued that a Cougar is only going to be good enough if you invest a lot of money in a/several mods, this is not true! While it's common knowledge that the stock Cougar has it's shortcomings, it is HANDS DOWN the best joystick for its purpose!

 

I'd buy another one in a heartbeat!

[Guest ruggbutt]

I had a stock Cougar. My CH Fighterstick is more precise.

[TucksonSonny]

For you Thrustmaster Cougar owners/users, I am interested in your opinion of it. I once owned the Thrustmaster F-22 Pro and though I enjoyed it, I did find spring tension and forces a workout for my wrist. Of course this HOTAS was mostly plastic with metal bases and I read the updated feature list for the Cougar... I am impressed to say the least.

 

Chime on in....

 

The Cougar-Hotas is a replica of the real thing period.

 

Can plastic lightweight versions give you less workload for the user? Yes.

This is not necessary a disadvantage because maneuvering the airplane is anyway limited by G force and physical flight model of the plane.

 

Can plastic lightweight versions give you advantage in multiplayer online against an opponent with a heavy Cougar? Sure, but again not necessary.

 

Known the fact that the Cougar is an F-16 hotas replica and the fact that Russian fighter planes like the Migs and Su’s need harder workload than the F-16 anyway, I would buy a Mig29 replica hotas that is even harder to handle

(No modding for me)

.

[Yellonet]

So what you guys are saying is that the Cougar is vey much worth it, even unmodded...?

[Guest ruggbutt]

The Cougar-Hotas is a replica of the real thing period.

 

Not exactly. IIRC the real thing only travels a fraction of an inch in any direction. There are good points to the stick. It feels good. It looks good. Up until recently it's programming software hadn't been surpassed. There are also bad parts. Speedbrake switch more often than not breaks unless you "fix" it right out of the box. Flaking paint (minor IMHO). If you drag your feet across the carpet and touch the stick, the static electricity can kill the mobo inside of it. I've heard of people waiting 6 months for a replacement, when they can get one. Pots die easily. Gimbal is cheaply made and has flat spots. The wiring looks horrible inside, hotglue everywhere! Also, the Foxy software is more complicated to use than it should be. Little to no customer support, and according to ULF you'll see Guillemot/TH devs post maybe once or twice a year to answer questions. Sonny, do you own a mobile phone? Do you have a problem using it because it's "plastic". I've had mine for 5 years and dropped it many times, and it still continues to work. It's plastic. My CH stuff is just about a year old and it's still as precise as it was on day one. My Cougar was sloppy and had worn pots after that amount of time. And if I have an issue I can send it back to be fixed. Under warranty!

 

If I have my info correct the guy who did Foxy is now doing the software for CH. The new CH 4.0 is insane! I got rid of half of my scripting after this came out, I can't imagine how nice it must be for new people who just switch over. Couple that with the fact that you see CH employees, Bob Church and all kinds of members of the community answering questions by users every single day. There are some things you just can't buy, like customer service for a Cougar. From what I've seen it's part of the package deal when you buy CH.

[Manny]

So what you guys are saying is that the Cougar is vey much worth it, even unmodded...?

 

Yellonet, I can not say either way for the Cougar since I do not have enough information regarding it. What I can say is from the outset, I am impressed from the previous product I owned, the F-22 Pro, but I am not impressed otherwise.

 

I still can not get past the fact most users have modified their Cougar out of the box, speak negatively of Thrustmaster design and construction, and turn the HOTAS into something different, and in some cases totally different, than the manufacturer sells.

 

This does not speak highly of Thrustmaster in my opinion. I can deal with high spring forces and the type of gimbal mechanism they use but if the quality of the product is deemed that low in the first place warranting a modification, that does not escape a certain reality regarding Thrustmasters product.

 

I mean granted some of the mods are outright clever such as fixing the stick in place and translating force applied to movemnt or changing the pots to Hall effect sensors ... thatkinda stuff, apart from the HOTAS itself is unique and speaks less about the construction and design. The stuff speaking more to the construction and design are mods to the gimbals, tracksa, rods, plates, etc. It appears too F-22 like and I am having second thought on purchase.

 

The highest appeal is metal construction. The lowest appeal are all the mods. Well CH Pro PEdals have had the worst construction and design in my opinion as an owner and I have modified that as much as the F-22 Pro I had to repair at times. The toe brakes still dont work on my pedals as I am too lazy to resolder wires again and again and simply removed them entirely. I have had no problems with the CH Flight SIm Yoke and have used it in combat sims like IL2. Because of the non-centering and light forces, the stick is dead accurate with slight mods to the sensitivities in-game.

 

I am a bit frustrated because other than tyhe yoke, I have not found low-force, smooth controller yet. I thought of the X52 but Goya seems to indicate I should stick with my X45... hmmmm decisions decisions :icon_roll

[DonULFonso]

FYI, it's Bob Church, the 'father' of TM's F-22 Pro who introduced some raw but true programability to the TMs, not James Hallows, the author of the editor called Foxy AKA Fox Two, who once had worked for TM but now has been working for CH since the original TM kicked the bucket.

 

FYI, Guillemot just bought the name of TM, hoping to dine off on its once great reputation, and have ruined it from day one that the HOTAS Cougar hit the shelves, what with a complete lack of any support that would deserve that name, and of any communication with their customers.

 

Add to that their inability (not that they ever wanted to) of fixing the inumerable design-flaws that have been all too well known since day one as well and which the HOTAS Cougar has become (in)famous for: paint that's wearing off ('for immersion' to quote Cougar World staff, said James Hallows - then my two pieces must be faulty 'cause the paint didn't come off, or what?), a misaligned speedbrake-switch that'll break sooner or later if you don't fix it yourself, an ill-designed circuitry that's crippling the throttle's rotaries and leaves them with more deadzone than electrical range, dying pots due to a poor quality, and an increasing center-play due to the 'tolerances' that the lowest bidder provides, etc.pp..

 

You can 'mod' your HOTAS Cougar's hardware faults if you don't mind to spend twice as much money as you've already paid for your stock stick, but there's no 'mod' available to grant you 64-bit support which isn't even planned, let alone scheduled yet ('Guillemot has more important things to do' to quote CW staff, go figure!) or a bug-free soft- and firmware in general - the last time it took Guillemot two full years (no joke, unfortunately) to fix the buggy 2.x-series' drivers, so I wouldn't hold my breath, either.

[Andrew_McP]

So what you guys are saying is that the Cougar is vey much worth it, even unmodded...?

 

The Cougar world is split fairly evenly between those who love it and those who wasted money on it. If you want to find out which camp you're in for certain, buy one, because all the advice in the world won't tell you what *your* opinion will be. The entry price is steep, but you get to bitch or fanboi as much as you want afterwards. :-)

 

Andrew McP... who wasted 250ukp (about $430) on his Cougar.

[TucksonSonny]

Not exactly. IIRC the real thing only travels a fraction of an inch in any direction. There are good points to the stick. It feels good. It looks good. Up until recently it's programming software hadn't been surpassed. There are also bad parts. Speedbrake switch more often than not breaks unless you "fix" it right out of the box. Flaking paint (minor IMHO). If you drag your feet across the carpet and touch the stick, the static electricity can kill the mobo inside of it. I've heard of people waiting 6 months for a replacement, when they can get one. Pots die easily. Gimbal is cheaply made and has flat spots. The wiring looks horrible inside, hotglue everywhere! Also, the Foxy software is more complicated to use than it should be. Little to no customer support, and according to ULF you'll see Guillemot/TH devs post maybe once or twice a year to answer questions. Sonny, do you own a mobile phone? Do you have a problem using it because it's "plastic". I've had mine for 5 years and dropped it many times, and it still continues to work. It's plastic. My CH stuff is just about a year old and it's still as precise as it was on day one. My Cougar was sloppy and had worn pots after that amount of time. And if I have an issue I can send it back to be fixed. Under warranty!

 

If I have my info correct the guy who did Foxy is now doing the software for CH. The new CH 4.0 is insane! I got rid of half of my scripting after this came out, I can't imagine how nice it must be for new people who just switch over. Couple that with the fact that you see CH employees, Bob Church and all kinds of members of the community answering questions by users every single day. There are some things you just can't buy, like customer service for a Cougar. From what I've seen it's part of the package deal when you buy CH.

 

After reading your post I have to say that I was lucky until now (I own it 5 months now and after many hours of flying in lomac/FC and FS2004 and yes F4 FF/CobraOne tooJ (sporadic)).

I was putting the cougar system on my balance 5 minutes ago and I got 3.7 kg for the stick and 3.0 kg for the other part and this without the cables.

Thus the weight is 6.7 kg which is about the weight of a modern racing bike.

Anyway, I don’t think that it is a good idea to drop it even once.

[Guest ruggbutt]

Anyway, I don’t think that it is a good idea to drop it even once.

Especially on your bare foot! :rolleyes:

[Manny]

The Cougar world is split fairly evenly between those who love it and those who wasted money on it. If you want to find out which camp you're in for certain, buy one, because all the advice in the world won't tell you what *your* opinion will be. The entry price is steep, but you get to bitch or fanboi as much as you want afterwards. :-)

 

Andrew McP... who wasted 250ukp (about $430) on his Cougar.

 

Well, in light of the information shared in this thread and what I have read over at Frugal's, I am certain to remain clear of the Thrustmaster brand for some time to come.

 

It is unfortuante to read you spent money in your opinion was wasted on a product you had hoped would satisfy you. I am a former owner of an F-22 Pro so I am well aware of the many problems the high-end Thrustmaster product has experienced.

 

I suppose CH will remain eminent in my mind for flight controllers since Saitek has gone off the deep end with its' futuristic whatever it is they made. I am interested in a stick, throttle, and rudder pair seen as "1" controller in Window$. It may come from a combination of many CH products.

[Guest ruggbutt]

I have 4, and if they come out w/the split throttle I'll have 5.