Sharpe_95 Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Hi all, Forgive my lack of understanding here but I have noticed that when flying the F15 in FC3 the IFF vs A10's shows 'unknown' - is this the way it is supposed to work? I assume that as the A10 has no radar it therefore has no AESA and thus can't IFF squawk. Is that about right or is something missing? -Sharpe
Eddie Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Last I checked IFF in FC3 was simply a case of square radar contact symbols for hostile and circular symbols for friendly, FC3 (and DCS as a whole) doesn't support unknown contacts via IFF. An aircraft having RADAR has nothing to do with it having the ability to respond to IFF interrogations. And AESA is just a type of RADAR, again not specifically to do with IFF. It sounds like you may be confusing IFF with NCTR.
GGTharos Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 He's talking about the NCTR. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Pyroflash Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 (edited) I assume that as the A10 has no radar it therefore has no AESA and thus can't IFF squawk. Is that about right or is something missing? -Sharpe The IFF transponder is a completely separate system from the RADAR. In the case of the F-15C, it is sensor fused with the RADAR, however, it is not always accurate(i.e. there have been cases where an F-15C has locked up an unidentified target, and it turned out to be a friendly). In the case of a multimode AESA RADAR, a RADAR subarray can indeed act as IFF interrogator, however that is not such a system as we have, or are ever likely to have in game from any of ED's products. Possibly this could be introduced with some 3rd party guesstimate platforms like the AN/APG-77 and CAPTOR. However, the AN/APG-63(V)1 we are likely to get with the MSIP Eagle does not do this. However, yes, the above two are correct in saying that this is a different system entirely from NCTR, which is what you are talking about. NCTR has been around in the Eagle since ~86' Edited March 25, 2013 by Pyroflash If you aim for the sky, you will never hit the ground.
RIPTIDE Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Hi all, Forgive my lack of understanding here but I have noticed that when flying the F15 in FC3 the IFF vs A10's shows 'unknown' - is this the way it is supposed to work? This is a bug. All other aircraft types are ID'd at close enough range in the F-15C MPCD, but not the A-10C. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
seikdel Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Isn't IFF typically a separate transceiver, at least in US military aircraft? My understanding is this: The IFF transceiver in the F-15 interrogates (i.e. asks) the IFF transceiver in the A-10. The A-10, if it's turned on and configured properly, responds back to the F-15 with some sort of code that indicates it's friendly. The F-15 then knows it's a friendly target. Am I correct or am I off base? Also, is aircraft type ever transmitted over IFF? Does the A-10 ever squawk that it's an A-10, or just that it's friendly? While I'm at it, "squawk" refers to IFF, correct? The NCTR is just a nifty radar trick that looks at the return from a target and then compares it to other known returns to figure out what type of aircraft the target is, right? Isn't it largely based off the doppler return from the turbine blades? One final question: I've heard comments about DCS "not having a proper radar simulation", and how it probably won't, at least for a long time. Why is that? What about radar is so difficult or computationally-intense to simulate?
RIPTIDE Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Isn't IFF typically a separate transceiver, at least in US military aircraft? My understanding is this: The IFF transceiver in the F-15 interrogates (i.e. asks) the IFF transceiver in the A-10. The A-10, if it's turned on and configured properly, responds back to the F-15 with some sort of code that indicates it's friendly. The F-15 then knows it's a friendly target. Am I correct or am I off base? Also, is aircraft type ever transmitted over IFF? Does the A-10 ever squawk that it's an A-10, or just that it's friendly? While I'm at it, "squawk" refers to IFF, correct? The NCTR is just a nifty radar trick that looks at the return from a target and then compares it to other known returns to figure out what type of aircraft the target is, right? Isn't it largely based off the doppler return from the turbine blades? One final question: I've heard comments about DCS "not having a proper radar simulation", and how it probably won't, at least for a long time. Why is that? What about radar is so difficult or computationally-intense to simulate? The IFF works in FC3. What doesn't work for the F-15C ONLY, is the NCTR for the A-10C. All other target aircraft it works. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 [/url] From wikipedia Mode 5 – provides a cryptographically secured version of Mode S and ADS-B GPS position. (military only)[2] Mode 5 is divided into two levels. Both are crypto-secure with Enhanced encryption, Spread Spectrum Modulation, and Time of Day Authentication. Level 1 is similar to Mode 4 information but enhanced with an Aircraft Unique PIN. Level 2 is the same as Mode 5 level one but includes additional information such as Aircraft Position and Other Attributes.[citation needed] Am I correct or am I off base? Also, is aircraft type ever transmitted over IFF? Does the A-10 ever squawk that it's an A-10, or just that it's friendly? While I'm at it, "squawk" refers to IFF, correct? The NCTR has a lot more to it than just 'a nifty radar trick' ... it doesn't necessarily only look at the radar return, and it doesn't necessarily only look at the JEM data - aside from this it may also fuse data from the TEWS or other sources. It lets you ID an aircraft when you otherwise would be unable to. The NCTR is just a nifty radar trick that looks at the return from a target and then compares it to other known returns to figure out what type of aircraft the target is, right? Isn't it largely based off the doppler return from the turbine blades? The only answer to give to that is 'study radar for a few weeks' and then you might understand - assuming you also understand networked game programming. There's no flight sim out there that has a very realistic radar simulation, but for what we use it for, it's good enough and has many features. One final question: I've heard comments about DCS "not having a proper radar simulation", and how it probably won't, at least for a long time. Why is that? What about radar is so difficult or computationally-intense to simulate? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Sharpe_95 Posted March 25, 2013 Author Posted March 25, 2013 Thanks all, yes I did mean NCTR (doh). Good to know it's a bug about the A10. But I have also learnt something new with regards to circles and rectangles :) - is that 'infallible' in DCSW? Many thanks everyone -Sharpe
RIPTIDE Posted March 25, 2013 Posted March 25, 2013 Thanks all, yes I did mean NCTR (doh). Good to know it's a bug about the A10. But I have also learnt something new with regards to circles and rectangles :) - is that 'infallible' in DCSW? Many thanks everyone -Sharpe Aside from ECM considerations, I have never seen it incorrect. Even large A2G missile ordnance used to IFF. :D But that's a while since I saw it last... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
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