Looking for comprehensive dumb bombing guides

[Eddie]

Well since we're at it anyway... 'why'?

 

1. Negative G hurts, it really hurts, where a pilot can take 9 positive G, 2-3 negative G is the limit. Negative G also significantly reduces a pilot's ability to withstand positive G.

 

2. Aircraft themselves don't like negative G, it gives fuel transfer issues, as you'll see if you spend to long pushing negative G in the A-10C. As well as engine oil pressure issues, and ordnance is difficult to get safely separated from the aircraft under negative G.

 

3. Negative G is slow. You move the aircraft much more slowly pushing 2 negative G than you do rolling and pulling 4-5 positive G. This makes you and easier target.

[JayPee]

Looking for comprehensive dumb bombing guides

 

Interesting, never took that into consideration.

 

I once blew myself up in mid-air while dropping bombs. Must be item no. 2

Edited December 6, 2013 by JayPee

[Supersheep]

One question already: How did you trim your aircraft in the videos, especially High Angle deliveries where airspeed increases significantly?

 

My take: Since after setting the DRC onto target the relevant reference becomes flight path and G load (and no longer the DRC), it should be about neutral so that the G load is easier to maintain. This in turn implies trimming some clicks forward when starting the dive...?

[Eddie]

Forget trim, just fly the aeroplane.

[Xavven]

It's something most (all) simmer who haven't gotten heavily into real world TTPs do. And it's one of those things where I've never really understood why the concept of always using positive G to move the aeroplane comes so hard to some.

 

Well I've only played DCS sims, but I can say that the A-10C tutorial doesn't tell you how to properly enter a dive like a real pilot would. It's just completely absent from any of the material that comes with the game. How is anyone supposed to know this stuff? The tutorial says, "enter a dive" and so my first reaction is, "okay, a dive -- that means down," and I proceed to do a negative G pushover, not knowing any better, and of course not being able to feel how uncomfortable it is since I'm in reality sitting stationary in my house. I'm just grateful to have a few military aviators hanging around the forums to fill those knowledge gaps.

 

I'm sure there are at least 1,000 more things I'm doing completely wrong in this sim (not being a real pilot and all) and about 990 of them I wouldn't even know that I was doing it wrong to begin with. But, learning new stuff is like 60% of the fun I get out of this, or I wouldn't be reading the forums at all.

[JayPee]

Well I've only played DCS sims, but I can say that the A-10C tutorial doesn't tell you how to properly enter a dive like a real pilot would. It's just completely absent from any of the material that comes with the game. How is anyone supposed to know this stuff? The tutorial says, "enter a dive" and so my first reaction is, "okay, a dive -- that means down," and I proceed to do a negative G pushover, not knowing any better, and of course not being able to feel how uncomfortable it is since I'm in reality sitting stationary in my house. I'm just grateful to have a few military aviators hanging around the forums to fill those knowledge gaps.

 

I'm sure there are at least 1,000 more things I'm doing completely wrong in this sim (not being a real pilot and all) and about 990 of them I wouldn't even know that I was doing it wrong to begin with. But, learning new stuff is like 60% of the fun I get out of this, or I wouldn't be reading the forums at all.

This.

 

Kudos to those who are giving proper insight.

 

I appreciate the insight here. Now, I'm going to find time to study and practice and might (will) then come back with questions.

 

Same here. Going to see if I can pull off those proper roll-ins with 82s. Probably going to install the 476 practice targets as well, BMPs tend to shoot back you know.

Edited December 7, 2013 by JayPee

[Supersheep]

I appreciate the insight here. Now, I'm going to find time to study and practice and might (will) then come back with questions.

[Eddie]

Well I've only played DCS sims, but I can say that the A-10C tutorial doesn't tell you how to properly enter a dive like a real pilot would. It's just completely absent from any of the material that comes with the game. How is anyone supposed to know this stuff? The tutorial says, "enter a dive" and so my first reaction is, "okay, a dive -- that means down," and I proceed to do a negative G pushover, not knowing any better, and of course not being able to feel how uncomfortable it is since I'm in reality sitting stationary in my house. I'm just grateful to have a few military aviators hanging around the forums to fill those knowledge gaps.

 

I'm sure there are at least 1,000 more things I'm doing completely wrong in this sim (not being a real pilot and all) and about 990 of them I wouldn't even know that I was doing it wrong to begin with. But, learning new stuff is like 60% of the fun I get out of this, or I wouldn't be reading the forums at all.

 

Indeed. One of my biggest criticisms of DCS is the absence of any information & instruction on how to actually fly and fight the aircraft that are featured. DCS, and its manuals and tutorials are great at telling you which button to click when, but not great when it comes to telling people why they are clicking them, or how it all applies to air combat.

 

Back in the days of Falcon, half of the manaul was dedicated to tactics, formations, BFM, etc. DCS doesn't have any of that at all. So it's not entirely surprising that people simply don't know even the basics.

[Supersheep]

Practiced this for an hour earlier today. Much to learn, I still have.

At least I understand the idea now (I think).

[JayPee]

Yeah... Youtube is one thing, doing it yourself is quite another! I always end up way too low, way too fast. Either I have to abort or crash next to the target.

[Supersheep]

I usually don't get my initial position just right and then end up too steep so I better not try to continue. If I get it right, I am pretty impressed by the result, but that might only be my standard anyways.

 

 

@All

Can I use the OSET page to input tenths of miles? No, I'm afraid...

[JayPee]

So for now a general rule of thumb to start practicing would be: aim to have the target at 1.2 NM at your 3/9. A moment before you have it on your 3/9 you bank hard left/right 80 degrees+intended dive angle and pull 3 G. When you're about to have the PBIL on your target you roll out and wait for the pipper to crawl up on the target.

 

Right?

[JayPee]

10/2 because making a 90 degree turn takes up some space and time as well and you would eventually end up on the imaginary 3/9 line to target?

[Supersheep]

From the post #103 of that thread, I made a PDF that is formatted and more easily readable - all the content is from BlueRidgeDX, though. Makes a handy reference to look at while training.

 

See attached.

How To Z Diagrams.pdf

[JayPee]

Rep incoming!

[Supersheep]

Not for copy/pasting some text, direct that to Eddie and Noodle.

They are the ones made of knowledge (and patience!)...

[JayPee]

Yes but I got to spread to love among others before I can boost their reps again ;)

[Supersheep]

:music_whistling:

 

 

 

 

Side note:

Dx always makes me think of calculus. Ridge -> Dx -> slope. Blue -> "Does not compute"

[Snoopy]

I like that BlueRidgeDx guy, LOL. ;)

 

LOL

[Supersheep]

If I was to attack moving targets, I could throw all my pre-planned lineup points out of the window. Would I have done so many static deliveries that I know what the line up has to look like for the chosen delivery, move myself into that position, proceed the attack with the usual DSMS profile as if it was static and "somehow" add some lead/offset? Not that I'm able to do that yet, but I wonder..

[Eddie]

If I was to attack moving targets, I could throw all my pre-planned lineup points out of the window. Would I have done so many static deliveries that I know what the line up has to look like for the chosen delivery, move myself into that position, proceed the attack with the usual DSMS profile as if it was static and "somehow" add some lead/offset? Not that I'm able to do that yet, but I wonder..

 

You shouldn't need pre-planned lineup points at all (waypoints etc). So yes, you should be able to do it all based on canopy references.

 

It's much easier than it sounds.

[Jona33]

Thanks very much guys, getting somewhere with this between that guide supersheep posted and the battle book. It definitely feels more satisfying to do it properly (ish :P)

[Supersheep]

Yeah things are starting to make (some) sense here.

Can similar Battle Book figures be derived for BDU-33s? I did assume they behave comparable to Mk 82s, but ran into some problems using the Mk 82 profiles. My idea was to have less weight on the aircraft to not bog down the Hog (lol) and/or carry more before going back to base.

 

Hey Jona, long time no see :)

[Eddie]

For canopy references, have a look at this image (note they are rough "rule of thumb" guides and will take some practice to get it right).

 

[Eddie]

Can similar Battle Book figures be derived for BDU-33s?

 

They certainly can. I'll put a few sleds together in the next few days, if nobody else gets there first of course.