SlipBall

I'm trying here to create more interest in the B-17 bomber. Maybe the cause is already lost but we can learn or read of great stories, maybe turn it (stretch goal) possibility around. Luthier want's 375,000. a real deal in the year 2013...sorry about the font size, wouldn't change for me :helpsmilie: "As a postscript to the B-17 story (and in response to various queries), here is some cost information on the B-17 Fortress. According to Peter Bowers's *Boeing Aircraft Since 1916" the cost of a B-17G when built in mass-produced quantities in 1943-44 was: Airframe $127,069 Engines $38,483 Propellers $11,900 Electronics $9,040 Ordnance $6,342 Miscellaneous equipment $45,495 --------- Total: $238,329 Sounds like small potatoes today!" " SEVERELY DAMAGED B-17 IN WWII.... Here's why the 17 may be the ruggedness aircraft ever built. Hard to see how a plane could fly is such a condition. A mid-air collision on February 1, 1943 between a B-17 and a German fighter over the Tunis dock area became the subject of one of the most famous photographs of World War II. An enemy fighter attacking a 97th Bomb Groupformation went out of control, probably with a wounded or dead pilot. The Me109 crashed into the lead aircraft of the flight, ripped a wing off the Fortress, and caused it to crash. The enemy fighter then continued its crashing descent into the rear of the fuselage of a Fortress named All American, piloted by Lt. Kendrick R. Bragg, of the 414th Bomb Squadron. When it struck, the fighter broke apart, but left some pieces in the B-17. The left horizontal stabilizer of the Fortress and left elevator were completely torn away. The two right engines were out and one on the left had a serious oil pump leak. The vertical fin and the rudder had been damaged, the fuselage had been cut almost completely through – connected only at two small parts of the frame and the radios, electrical and oxygen systems were damaged. There was also a hole in the top that was over 16 feet long and 4 feet wide at it’s widest and the split in the fuselage went all the way to the topgunner’s turret. Although the tail actually bounced and swayed in the wind and twisted when the plane turned and all the control cables were severed, except one single elevator cable still worked, and the aircraft still flew-miraculously! The tail gunner was trapped because there was no floor connecting the tail to the rest of the plane. The waist and tail gunners used parts of the German fighter and their own parachute harnesses in an attempt to keep the tail from ripping off and the two sides of the fuselage from splitting apart. While the crew was trying to keep the bomber from coming apart, the pilot continued on his bomb run and released his bombs over the target. When the Bombay doors were opened, the wind turbulence was so great that it blew one of the waist gunners into the broken tail section. It took several minutes and four crew members to pass him ropes from parachutes and haul himback into the forward part of the plane. When they tried to do the same for the tail gunner, the tail began flapping so hard that it began to break off. The weight of the gunner was adding some stability to the tail section, so he went back to his position. The turn back toward England had to be very slow to keep the tail from twisting off. They actually covered almost 70 miles to make the turn home. The bomber was so badly damaged that it was losing altitude and speed and was soon alone in the sky. For a brief time, two more Me109 German fighters attacked the All American. Despite the extensive damage, all of the machine gunners were able to respond to these attacks and soon drove off the fighters. The two waist gunners stood up with the headssticking out through the hole in the top of the fuselage to aim and fire their machine guns. The tail gunner had to shoot in short bursts because the recoil was actually causing the plane to turn. Allied P51 fighters intercepted the All American as it crossed over the Channel and took one of the pictures shown below. They also radioed to the base describing the empennage was “waving like a fish tail” and that the plane would not make it and to send out boats to rescue the crew when they bailed out. The fighters stayed with the Fortress taking hand signals from the Lt. Bragg and relaying them to the base. Lt. Bragg signaled that 5 parachutes and the spare had been "used" so five of the crew could not bailout. He made the decision that if they could not bail out safely, then he would stay with the plane and land it. Two and a half hours after being hit, the aircraft made its final turn to line up with the runway while it was still over 40 miles away. It descended into an emergency landing and a normal roll-out on its landing gear. When the ambulance pulled alongside, it was waved off because not a single member of the crew had been injured. No one could believe that the aircraft could still fly in such a condition. The Fortress sat placidly until the crew all existed through the door in the fuselage and the tail gunner had climbed down a ladder, at which time the entire rear section of the aircraft collapsed onto the ground. The rugged old bird had done its job.

Smurfy, put this as a direct question to Luthier in the thread you think he may read...I'm not sure that he will see this thread

Maybe someone should post it as a question to Luthier in the other thread

I think that its a great idea too

If we fail to get the B-17 flyable we will still have it in game which is nice, but will depend on how good are the AI.

Yea me too...I won't participate in the alpha I don't think, even though I could since its in my package. I want this to succeed just like all of us, so I am willing to do the pledge that I can afford.

I was in the 200. pledge but up-graded that this morning. The 200. previous pledge referred to, is the original old 150.

Yea people should think twice about wanting to be in the alpha...I have zero interest in that

On the pledge page...aprox. 09-14

Very cool Luthier! and a great presentation... If the first stretch goal is not met, can you still envision the possibility of the map expansion to the north, and a flyable B-17 some time in the future?

Nice! :pilotfly:

David, I too did the 200. pledge, Luthier said in this update, that what you were promised you will get.

I doubt it, once it was opened it became a contract with those that donated

I would like to see them come up with a competent AI co-pilot. He would have his own pre-flight checklist to do. Take half the load off the pilot, if a human is not available to take the co-pilot seat...

I don't think we should explore there business model, its their show as far as financing, and I'm sure they have a plan

Ilya needs to be a guest on Jay Leno :smilewink:

B-17 would be awesome!

A flyable B-17 would bring in a whole lot of donors for sure

The simple fact is CLod needed/needs a strong rig to be able to enjoy it. I can understand the sour feelings felt by some, but they really need to understand what a great sim it is. Upgrade, install the mod, and then enjoy the best WW2 air sim available.

An excellent idea!

They have a bunch of products in the oven to be released soon yr-yr 1/2.

Oleg should pop in here and take a few questions :smartass:

I understand your feelings but I don't think that Luthier can make a change like that...he was denied while trying to make an edit. I bet the manuals would be popular on e-bay if the game becomes a popular reality

I don't think a horse can be changed mid-stream :P..besides, other people may be happy with the rewards they donated for

Excellent :)