Adjusting labels?

Yes I fly with labels on, I was getting a bit tired of getting shot down by AIM-9 without any warnings. But I would like to adjust it just a bit. For example, is it possible to turn off labels under certain distance...like less than 1.5 km, the labels won't turn on?

Sometimes when you do a fly-by, I don't like to see the labels on my plane.

Try this thread: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=22321&highlight=labels+view

But seriously don't fly with labels PythonOne, you don't need warnings to see an AIM 9 just look for the smoke.. Keep and eye on your enemy at all times when WVR and you'll be fine.

Hi

you don't need warnings to see an AIM 9 just look for the smoke.. Keep and eye on your enemy at all times when WVR and you'll be fine.

Same opinion here, but anyway, one should fly like he wants so...

PythonOne, you may want to try this mod by MajorBug :

http://www.checksix-fr.com/bibliotheque/index.php?page=detail&ID=3945

(click on the floppy icon to dowload)

Quick translation of the "read-me" :

"Realistic" Labels mod (works with LOFC only)

Labels are reworked to allow you to "see" other planes at roughly the distance a real fighter pilot may pick them up :

- labels for both coalitions are black : no more "IFF" info, very visible in look-up, not really in look-down (aircrafts & labels are mixed in the ground textures)

- no labels for missiles, ships nor ground vehicles

- aircraft labels appear (a single * character) at 18km

- at 9 km, the * is replaced by the aircraft type

Note : If you play multi (host) with the label activated, please note that labels parameters are no more global => This means all client must have the mod installed, otherwise they'll have the "standard" labels.

Install with Modman.

Cheers

Az'

thanks

but could someone create a small mod, that ONLY shows labels on missiles? Nothing else like aircraft and vehiciles. That would be really nice.

This is, I think, technically possible, but IMO this is to close to some kind of "cheat".

More, doing this will prevent you from training the right way against missiles. That would be a pity, isn't it ?

Therefore, I won't do this mod.

Cheers

Az'

thanks

 

but could someone create a small mod, that ONLY shows labels on missiles? Nothing else like aircraft and vehiciles. That would be really nice.

I understand that a sim has to work for the operator or it just aint fun but labels for missiles? IRL you would never see the actual missile fired at you but hey what ever melts your butter :D.

Just one question though: why do you want to see something you're not suppose to? :P . Maybe if you explain your dilemma in more detail we might be able to help you tactically or in some other way that might avoid such a drastic retreat from realism and immersion.:noexpression:

yea I know its a drag from immersion but currently I do not have a TrackIR, but I'm saving money up for it. So I can't always look around to see the incoming missiles or IR missiles especially. I figure its best to crawl before I run so with labels, I'm getting the feel of how to dodge missiles properly. especially with the AIM-120, its smokeless so I can't even see it before I get hit. But seeing how it behaves I can learn. Whatever manuver I do, I can see the missile react. Eventually I would turn off labels when I get use to it, but please could someone create this mod? I would really appreciate it.

thanks

 

but could someone create a small mod, that ONLY shows labels on missiles? Nothing else like aircraft and vehiciles. That would be really nice.

Nothing easier than this:

Go, search your "Ubisoft\Eagle Dynamics\Lock On\Config\View" folder, open the "Labels.lua" and look for these files:

AirFormat = {}

AirFormat[100] = ""

AirFormat[10000] = ""

AirFormat[20000] = ""

AirFormat[30000] = ""

AirFormat[50000] = "'"

 

GroundFormat = {}

GroundFormat[100] = ""

GroundFormat[10000] = ""

GroundFormat[20000] = ""

 

NavyFormat = {}

NavyFormat[100] = ""

NavyFormat[20000] = ""

NavyFormat[50000] = ""

 

WeaponFormat = {}

WeaponFormat[50] = ""

WeaponFormat[10000] = "%N%n%D"

WeaponFormat[20000] = "%D"

WeaponFormat[30000] = "'"

Now with Labels on, you should see only weapon labels!

In my beginning days of Lock On, i have started with this settings, it was useful to learn how to evade missiles.

Today with TrackIR and a lot of practice, i dont need this anymore.

And one day you will find out, its a lot more Fun with labels off, totally.

I understand that a sim has to work for the operator or it just aint fun but labels for missiles? IRL you would never see the actual missile fired at you but hey what ever melts your butter :D.

 

Just one question though: why do you want to see something you're not suppose to? :P . Maybe if you explain your dilemma in more detail we might be able to help you tactically or in some other way that might avoid such a drastic retreat from realism and immersion.:noexpression:

I used to use labels on missiles but I've sat there and observed the missiles in Tacview so much that I find that it isn't necessary anymore.

However, here are two things in defense of labels:

1. The amount of missile evasion tactics out there that say "obtain a tally on the missile and do x...". I'll argue the validity of these (as well as the fact that I think they're talking more about SAMs, even though Robert Shaw's book has tactics like this in reference to A/A missiles), still the tactics are valid and DO work IF you can get a decent tally on the missile. They work a little -too- well though, since you can tell very easily that you've shaken the missile.

2. Labels on planes. I don't use these but either I'm legally blind or aircraft are much harder to see in LOMAC than reality. This is an old argument, the ability of a monitor to correctly display what the human eye would see, but LOMAC has a very "on/off" way of displaying things, and distant aircraft are no different. Sometimes I think that the view distances for aircraft are skewed the same way the G LOC model is -- more towards an average person than a trained fighter pilot. This doesn't really come into play when you know where to look, but when you have to quickly scan the sky for a bandit you know is a couple nm away. Hell if I can consistently find them... :mad:

Those pesky Mig-29's seem to be the most difficult to see even when they are almost on top of you.

I have also noticed something when dogfighting a Su-27 with guns. I can see the Su-27 very easily from afar. However when they turn into you (watching them head on) they completely disappear once again. It's like a UFO performing a magic trick in front of you. Now I know that head on they will be more difficult to see because of the smaller profile but not at the short distances that this has happened (less than 2-3 nm).

Nothing easier than this:

 

Go, search your "Ubisoft\Eagle Dynamics\Lock On\Config\View" folder, open the "Labels.lua" and look for these files:

 

copy this and replace your current files with this. (Dont forget Backup!!)

 

Now with Labels on, you should see only weapon labels!

 

 

 

In my beginning days of Lock On, i have started with this settings, it was useful to learn how to evade missiles.

Today with TrackIR and a lot of practice, i dont need this anymore.

And one day you will find out, its a lot more Fun with labels off, totally.

Awesome! Thank you rep inbound.

Here's another shot in the dark, is it possible to turn off labels for allied missiles but keep the enemies' missile labels on?

or if that's not possible, turn off labels for bombs only, but missiles stay?

Those pesky Mig-29's seem to be the most difficult to see even when they are almost on top of you.

 

I have also noticed something when dogfighting a Su-27 with guns. I can see the Su-27 very easily from afar. However when they turn into you (watching them head on) they completely disappear once again. It's like a UFO performing a magic trick in front of you. Now I know that head on they will be more difficult to see because of the smaller profile but not at the short distances that this has happened (less than 2-3 nm).

I'm glad someone can see them. Even at that close of a range, if they're head on, its no guarantee for me, even at 2 to 3 nm, no joke. :cry: I'm more likely to see smoke from a missile launch than the actual bandit.

This is leaning in unrealistically far in with TrackIR, 1680 x 1050 res, no AA, no texture filtering, settings all the way up, clear day, no weather staring right at the box or circle around the target...:huh:

Funny thing is, it was much easier to see bandits on my 19" CRT at a lower resolution. Makes sense, I guess.

One feature that I really liked from F4AF was what was called "smart scaling". It attempted to enlarge things to make them more visible based on a threshold of 8 nm, I think. At 8 nm, a plane in a flight sim might be nothing but a pixel, but if the plane should be visible at 8 nm in reality, Falcon enlarged it just enough to actually show up as a discernible object. It was just a dot or two, really, but you could very effectively glance around and see -something-, enough to get a tally on it. This seems far more realistic based on accounts I've read about pilots seeing bandits from several nautical miles.

I'm glad someone can see them. Even at that close of a range, if they're head on, its no guarantee for me, even at 2 to 3 nm, no joke. :cry: I'm more likely to see smoke from a missile launch than the actual bandit.

 

This is leaning in unrealistically far in with TrackIR, 1680 x 1050 res, no AA, no texture filtering, settings all the way up, clear day, no weather staring right at the box or circle around the target...:huh:

 

Funny thing is, it was much easier to see bandits on my 19" CRT at a lower resolution. Makes sense, I guess.

 

One feature that I really liked from F4AF was what was called "smart scaling". It attempted to enlarge things to make them more visible based on a threshold of 8 nm, I think. At 8 nm, a plane in a flight sim might be nothing but a pixel, but if the plane should be visible at 8 nm in reality, Falcon enlarged it just enough to actually show up as a discernible object. It was just a dot or two, really, but you could very effectively glance around and see -something-, enough to get a tally on it. This seems far more realistic based on accounts I've read about pilots seeing bandits from several nautical miles.

hmmm, I wonder if it is your higher resolution. I am using a 19" LCD (1440x900) and the "bigger" planes Su-27, Su-33 are not too difficult to see (usually a dark pixel) except for the before mentioned head on pass.

Speaking of 1440 by 900...

I just ran LOMAC at that resolution and played bait so I could coax in an AI bandit for some screenshots of what I'm talking about.

Can you spot the Su-27 bandit in the first screenshot?

Here's a closer look. I'm leaning in reaaaaaaal far with TrackIR for this one:

I'm sure you can probably see the bandit in the second one. Now imagine trying to see it in the first as you frantically look for it popping countermeasures like mad.

The bandit got me at a range of 3.4 nm per Tacview, so I'd consider this "within visual range". If bandits are framed against a clear blue sky...I -might- see them. However, by the time I need to see them, ^ this is the vantage point I'm usually looking for them from. When are you ever looking at them planform up in the sky? My bandits are usually heading right towards me to kill me! :D

Monitors and video cards are not crap anymore. They're getting to the point where they can display things in such high resolution that a bandit like this would probably be invisible with high levels of AA or filtering. Refresh rates are also not so great on some of these LCD monitors. I get a fair bit of tearing that, while not bad in most regular PC games, can be a killer in flight sims. I'm thinking that the next gen of flight sims is probably going to address this. They need to be more high-end hardware friendly. :)

You know...just wanted to add...if ANYONE has a solution to the problem of not being able to see things as far on a high res LCD as I could on my old CRT, I'd appreciate some tips. This applies to ground units too, unfortunately. :(

RT I feel your frustration. It is a lot more difficult to see in a still picture though. Once I identify them on my radar, I pick a reference landmark on the ground to mark their direction in my head so that I can glance quickly at them and this way they are easier to spot if you have a general idea where they are.

BTW, at this moment of the screenshot was he flying head on towards you? Looks like it. BTW I remember seeing some tips somewhere on how to tweak the video card to make them more easily visible but unfortunately I don't remember where.

RT I feel your frustration. It is a lot more difficult to see in a still picture though. Once I identify them on my radar, I pick a reference landmark on the ground to mark their direction in my head so that I can glance quickly at them and this way they are easier to spot if you have a general idea where they are.

 

BTW, at this moment of the screenshot was he flying head on towards you? Looks like it. BTW I remember seeing some tips somewhere on how to tweak the video card to make them more easily visible but unfortunately I don't remember where.

In order to use your method, I have to be able to actually glance at them and see them. I rarely see them to begin with. Glancing where the target box doesn't always work so well. On my old CRT monitor I did just what you said because I could see the little speck off in the distance.

That screenshot is the product of me baiting a Flanker into close range, flying just enough out of beam so that he can keep a lock on me, waiting to be killed (hoping that it isn't insta-death), and then pausing it and looking for him. Truthfully, I didn't even find him until I leaned in close and slowly panned the view around. Unfortunately this is also another limitation of the AI. If I was playing my clone, someone in equal skill, he might not see me either. The AI has no such limitations. They know where you are, lock, and fire instantly.

EDIT: one other thing too...I used to play with basic haze and no canopy scratches. I'm thinking that had something to do with it too. Sucks to think that the eye candy can kill the playability.

I found this thread here:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=21454&highlight=visibility

I have heard the complaints about the MiG-29 before, but I saw this:

What about the issue the way a/c go invisible at about 2-4miles as the level of detail changes from a black dot to a render aircraft (LOD). This distance is critical in dogfighting and to loose visibility at this point is just a pain.

 

Anyway this distance can be changed to say 1mile ... at which point the rendered image would be visible

This is probably my problem, coupled with the high res. I wonder how you change it to render the plane closer. Sounds kinda multiplayer-unfriendly to me. Not that I do multiplayer, but I don't like to change things to be artificially easier either.

Are you using the right technique to spot the aircraft?

It's much much easier to spot an aircraft when you progressively scan the sky. Don't look for an aircraft, look for movement. Movement is what will give it away. You will notice this unless you are truly in a head on situation, but surely you've got him on radar or something before then?

When you're picking up the RWR signals you have the rough direction. So point your aircraft slightly nose off and start scanning. Trying to spot tiny little black specks is hard. You will be more sucessful in spotting a bandit by scanning the sky and letting your eyes pick up movment.

Scan in a WWWWWWWWWW shape... up down up down up down and all the while moving across.

Sure as hell worked for WW2 pilots :)

I'm playing on a 17" CRT running at 1280. So I don't know any bigger and cannot comment if it is actually a monitor issue rather than a technique issue.

Hmm...I'll have to try that. I'm not really using any technique. If I think I have time, I'm slowly scanning in the direction the RWR is telling me he is. I usually don't want to have my nose anywhere near him though...that would mean I'm flying head long into a missile. I'm usually trying to notch/beam, trying to get a tally so I can swing back around and fire another missile.

I'll look for movement, but I don't usually see much, even if I just fly directly at them while locked. Its there, but its so small that I probably have trouble noticing it.

I think I found a solution. Its legitimate and I feel stupid for not thinking of it. I turned the LoD setting down from what Modman considered "High" down to what it considered "Low". From 1.5 to 0.7. Maybe its a placebo, but I think its working so far...

Aircraft and vehicle visibility has always been an issue in LO: here's my original post I made years ago : http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?q=Y&a=tpc&s=400102&f=38610606&m=439103961&p=1 and things were made a lot better but they still need to be improved to match what the human eye can see IRL and I'm not talking about the LOD issues with the Mig29, F18 etc.. I understand why some feel labels are more realistic when set to a certain distance at which you would be able to acquire the target with your naked eye and I agree with them even though I don't use labels. But relying on seeing a missile to evade it is pretty unrealistic and unreliable especially after the missiles engine has finished burning.. then you're really living in hope that you'll see it and have the time to react.

Anyway I would suggest adjusting your tactics rather than labeling missiles but the sim has to be fun or you've basically just bought a coaster :).

Just noticed that my demon script still works in my sig from the above link :) .

Aircraft and vehicle visibility has always been an issue in LO: here's my original post I made years ago : http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?q=Y&a=tpc&s=400102&f=38610606&m=439103961&p=1 and things were made a lot better but they still need to be improved to match what the human eye can see IRL and I'm not talking about the LOD issues with the Mig29, F18 etc.. I understand why some feel labels are more realistic when set to a certain distance at which you would be able to acquire the target with your naked eye and I agree with them even though I don't use labels. But relying on seeing a missile to evade it is pretty unrealistic and unreliable especially after the missiles engine has finished burning.. then you're really living in hope that you'll see it and have the time to react.

 

Anyway I would suggest adjusting your tactics rather than labeling missiles but the sim has to be fun or you've basically just bought a coaster :).

 

Just noticed that my demon script still works in my sig from the above link :) .

Hehe...yeah, I read that thread yesterday. Interesting to see people here weighing in on visibility that long ago.

So far, I think I've fixed my problem. I played a bit more and having the LOD that low makes the planes more visible. They stay as a dot and not switch to the detailed model as fast.

I think I found a solution. Its legitimate and I feel stupid for not thinking of it. I turned the LoD setting down from what Modman considered "High" down to what it considered "Low". From 1.5 to 0.7. Maybe its a placebo, but I think its working so far...

Cool, I'll give that a try later tonight.

Nothing easier than this:

 

Go, search your "Ubisoft\Eagle Dynamics\Lock On\Config\View" folder, open the "Labels.lua" and look for these files:

 

copy this and replace your current files with this. (Dont forget Backup!!)

 

Now with Labels on, you should see only weapon labels!

 

 

 

In my beginning days of Lock On, i have started with this settings, it was useful to learn how to evade missiles.

Today with TrackIR and a lot of practice, i dont need this anymore.

And one day you will find out, its a lot more Fun with labels off, totally.

Instead of deleting the values which you may need in the future if you want it back, you could simple just change the true to false at the top for air, naval, and ground units. I believe this would work too

AirOn = false

GroundOn = false

NavyOn = false

WeaponOn = true