datalink question

Hi folks,

 

Tonight I was playing the sample COOP 4 mission (the long ingress over the mountains - what's it called?) and had some problems with the datalink.

 

The other lad was set as ship 1, with kommander set. I was ship 2, with what I believe is wingman tx/rx set (one notch anticlockwise from kommander, right?).

 

So I lased a target, hit "vehicle" then "mem". It appeared on my ABRIS. Then I hit "vehicle", "send to all", then "mem". Shouldn't that have appeared on the kommander's datalink? It didn't.

 

When I switched to kommander/1, and he switched to wingman tx/rx ship 2, and I repeated the dlink send, it worked.

 

Was I doing something wrong trying to send as wingman?

 

Cheers

Press СБРОС (Backspace) to cage Shkval before sending target. If you fail to do so, you will simple change (reassign) the type of already saved target.

What you did there is your first vehicle/memory cycle button pushing was simply saving the target location into your own aircraft's memory for your own use sourced from the Shkval. The manual suggests indirectly that resetting the targeting system is not necessary for the item to be stored into memory. Regardless this sequence should have absolutely no bearing on data any other ship will receive. The procedure in the manual is this:

 

The following eight steps describe the process for creating data link targets that will show up on the ABRIS. See the next section for sending the targets you create.

1. Press the “ЦУ” (Uncage Shkval) button on the cyclic.

2. Use the sensor slew hat to align the HUD cursor over the target area and locate the target/location on the Shkval display.

3. Determine the target type and class, by zooming in from 7x to 23x.

4. Place the Shkval target box over the target, adjust the tracking gate size, and press the automatic target lock button on the collective.

5. Set the target type or ingress point on the Data Link Control Panel (the corresponding button will light ).

6. On the Data Link Control Panel, press the “ПРД/ПАМ” (transmit /memory) button to place the target in memory. On the ABRIS, the corresponding target symbol with assigned number will appear.

7. If necessary, repeat steps 1-6 to create additional targets.

8. When done creating targets, press the “СБРОС” (Reset) button “ПВР” on the Targeting Mode Control panel, and this will reset the Shkval LOS to default/boresight.

Your second button presses were however in error. You selected target type, then recipient, then send. This is not the correct order as it should be recipient, type, send when sending datalink memory targets. However again since you had the Shkval active and ground stabilized (ranged to a point) you were not sending a datalink memory target but a Shkval active target to which the procedure is:

 

When handing off target data to a flight member(s) without first creating a target on the ABRIS, (i.e. using Shkval tracking) leave the target type button unpressed, press intended recipient number, and then press the “ПРД/ПАМ” (Send/Memory) button on the Data Link Panel. The coordinates on the ground where the Shkval is locked will be sent to the recipient(s).

Your РЕЖИМ data master mode settings were also to blame. You must not think of the KOM setting as "I am the Kommander" but rather "I will only talk with the Kommander." Setting your master data mode switch to KOM limits you to transmitting and receiving data to and from only the #1 ID.

 

This is why your friend which was set to KOM and was #1 ID did not receive you. He was set to "I only talk/listen to the Kommander" and you were not the commander (since you were #2!) If you want everyone to be able to transmit and receive to/from everything then everyone should be on Wingman setting.

 

Also be aware that sending to 1, 2, 3, or 4 is preferred to SEND TO ALL since the specific recipient option means that you will get an error message if your recipient did not receive the message. However if you use SEND TO ALL then you will not have this feature.

thank you, I see my error.

Your РЕЖИМ data master mode settings were also to blame. You must not think of the KOM setting as "I am the Kommander" but rather "I will only talk with the Kommander." Setting your master data mode switch to KOM limits you to transmitting and receiving data to and from only the #1 ID.

 

No, I think there is a problem in English manual.

 

Page 2-66 of English manual:

The “РЕЖИМ" (data mode) dial, allows you to select one of four options regarding how you receive and pass data link information to the rest of your flight. [M + LCTRL] The options include:

 

1. "ОТКЛ" (Disable) disables data link communication with your flight.
   
2. "ПРИЕМ" (Receive) is a receive data only mode (you cannot send data) and it is a secure mode that is difficult to detect by enemy electronic emission detection systems.
   
3. "ВЕДОМ" (Wingman) mode allows you to send and receive information from other flight members including the flight lead (ID 1). Wingman icons will be displayed on the ABRIS.
   
4. "КОМ" (Commander) mode allows you to send and receive information from Jjust the flight leader. Wingman icons will be displayed on the ABRIS.
   

However, it is stated that "KOM" is mode for (of) leader on the page 2-59 of Russian manual:

Галетный переключатель РЕЖИМ включения внешнего целеуказания (ВЦУ) [M + LCTRL]:

 

1. ОТКЛ – отключение режима ВЦУ.
   
2. ПРИЕМ – режим приема команд ВЦУ.
   
3. ВЕДОМ – режим прием-передача команд ВЦУ. Режим ведомого.
   
4. КОМ – режим прием-передача команд ВЦУ. Режим ко-мандира группы.
   

Additionally, page 7-6 of English manual says:

5. Set data link “РЕЖИМ" (Master Mode) knob on the Off Board Targeting Data Link panel to the “КОМ” (Commander – send and receive data. Leader mark on the ABRIS) position. If you are not the flight lead, set knob on the Off Board Targeting Data Link panel to the “ВЕДОМ” (Wingman – send and receive data. Wingman mark on the ABRIS) position.

Also, the one who has set that knob to "KOM" is displayed with very fat mark on ABRIS of other flight members. It makes sense, because commander has to be easily distinguished from other flight members.

 

I am flying the multiplayer from the beginning of Russian DVD release by assuming that KOM is mode for Commander and can assure that in this mode I can receive/send target information from/to pilots whose have set ВЕДОМ (WINGMAN) as their mode.

Edited February 9, 2009 by ZaltysZ

I would not be surprised if the manual is in error. They certainly disagree with each other so someone's wrong. 2-65 and 7-6 of the English manual cleary say different things as well. Maybe they switched the actual names of the switch positions in the English cockpit?

 

I suspected that somehow the ABRIS marks were different other than the number inside as well but didn't have a clear memory.

 

Is it correct to say that ID#1 is "Leader" or no? I don't know if anyone can be leader or if it's assumed to be #1.

What I have observed is that commander and wingman mode is almost the same. The only difference is that you have bold mark in other pilots ABRIS when you are in commander mode. Any ID can be in Commander mode. Even all 4. However, there is no point for doing that.

Edited February 9, 2009 by ZaltysZ

When handing off target data to a flight member(s) without first creating a target on the ABRIS, (i.e. using Shkval tracking) leave the target type button unpressed, press intended recipient number, and then press the “ПРД/ПАМ” (Send/Memory) button on the Data Link Panel. The coordinates on the ground where the Shkval is locked will be sent to the recipient(s).

 

So this would still send the recipient an icon on his Abris that would look the same as one sent from memory?

Do you have to stay locked on the target for him? If not, I'm wondering what happens if you do this multible times, and do you still tell your wingman to engage datalink targets the same way as stored ones?

I would not be surprised if the manual is in error. They certainly disagree with each other so someone's wrong. 2-65 and 7-6 of the English manual cleary say different things as well. Maybe they switched the actual names of the switch positions in the English cockpit?

 

I suspected that somehow the ABRIS marks were different other than the number inside as well but didn't have a clear memory.

 

Is it correct to say that ID#1 is "Leader" or no? I don't know if anyone can be leader or if it's assumed to be #1.

 

I believe the manual says that the leader should always use number 1. I think this is more of a operational procedure instead of a requirement for the hardware to properly work pg 2-66 and 7-2

So this would still send the recipient an icon on his Abris that would look the same as one sent from memory?

Do you have to stay locked on the target for him? If not, I'm wondering what happens if you do this multiple times, and do you still tell your wingman to engage datalink targets the same way as stored ones?

 

No it wouldn't. If you send a target from source-Shkval then it has nothing to do with the target stored in your ownship datalink memory. In fact you can send as many datalink targets as you like without ever saving any to ownship memory.

 

The manual says not even to specify target type when sending a source-Shkval target. Personally I think it's possible and even advisable to type these sends. I assume the procedure would be to get a valid source-Shkval target, select recipient, select type, send. I'd have to test this.

 

To send a source-Shkval target you only need to have a valid Shkval target. What does a valid target mean? A valid target is any laser-ranged point on the ground identified by the Shkval. This can be a tracked/locked target or simply a piece of dirt under the crosshairs. The rule of thumb is, if you have a range on the TV, you have a valid Shkval target.

 

You are not required to do anything once you send the datalink target to your wingman. Think of it as a letter in the postal system. You make it, you send it, you're done. It doesn't magically update or require anything else from the sender after it has left.

 

If you send multiple targets it is like you sent multiple letters. They will arrive in the order you send them. For human recipients the player will need to manual receive the information by storing the data using MEMORY button. I do not know how many targets in a row can be stored in queue to be received by a human pilot. An AI will only care about the last non-ingress point and last ingress point sent.

 

The recipient can't tell/ doesn't care what source the sender used for his datalink, whether it was source-Shkval, source-Memory, or source-NAVTGT. The received datalink target is the same no matter what the source.

Thanks for that info Frederf, that's good to know. It can save much time in the heat of battle. Plus keep the Abris from getting all cluttered.

I will have to start using this method and maybe just store the Sams and AAA.

The HMS and the Shkval are nice for making very quick AI orders for ingress points since usually "kinda over there" is good enough for those. I think one of the developer notes demonstrates this pretty well.