Eagle Dynamics F-16?

Hallo all,

I'm new here so forgive me if this is an old subject (i did do a forum search, honest)!

Is ED still making an official F-16c add-on for Lock-On?

The reason i ask is, quite a few months ago i (definately) saw a screenshot of an F-16c (Block 42) cockpit from a WIP by Eagle Dynamics. Now i can't find any reference to it at all - has the project been abandoned now that DCS-BS is out?

Or is it that ED have decided to take the WIP over to Black Shark instead (Lock-On support finished!?)?

Thanks...

The F16 should be a DCS-Module, far in the future. Next one is A10

Cheers

If they do, they'll have quite a standard to measure up to; set by Open Falcon 4.x (IMO), as far as avionics detail is concerned.

The F16 should be a DCS-Module, far in the future. Next one is A10

Cheers

Thanks Poncho, but that doesn't answer my main question:

"Is ED still making an official F-16c add-on for Lock-On?"

These are the Eagle Dynamics forums are they not? I thought perhaps we might get a little insight from someone on the development team...:lookaround:

No. Ed was never making an F-16C for Lock On. This is for DCS.

"Is ED still making an official F-16c add-on for Lock-On?"

If they do, they'll have quite a standard to measure up to; set by Open Falcon 4.x (IMO), as far as avionics detail is concerned.

If (any) developers of Falcon ever do sequel, they will have a standart to measure up by; Buy DCS and see what I'm about ;)

No. Ed was never making an F-16C for Lock On. This is for DCS.

At MAKS 2005 I heard otherwise from one of the devs present at the ED stand.

But that was still the time when Black Shark was being developed as an addon for Lockon.

So they might have been developing it for Lockon, but I'm quite sure we will only see the F-16C in DCS.

Given the level of detail already in Black Shark at the moment, I think that's a good thing, and I agree with DarkWanderer: it's the F4 devs who will have some catching up to do when the DCS F-16 is released.

Joe, he's implying that DCS is not LockOn. DCS is the continuation of LockOn. Saying that there is a F-16 Charlie module for LockOn is just miss-spoken. There HAS been work towards a Viper module for DCS, and I'm sure you've seen the screenshots. GGTharos did not directly answer the question, he just clarified the terminology. And that's his prerogative. (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

The F4 devs don't need to be a part of childish competitive taunts. They are working with a 1997, DX7, and corrupted database simulator. I hope you can understand that you are comparing apples and oranges. These guys are working for free on a dinosaur of a simulator, and you're comparing the very latest technology to their hobby? What they have achieved is no less than miraculous. Do NOT mock it. Leave the "community bias" at the forum door.

Yes, I was merely clarifying.

The answer is that the F-16C will be a DCS module, not a Lock-On add-on.

I'd like to clear up something above though - Beaker, DCS is not the continuation of Lock-On. While DCS leverages software/technology from Lock-On, I think we can agree that the level of fidelity in aircraft flight and systems as well as weapons modeling puts it on an entirely different level.

I realize that some might consider it to be a 'natural extension to Lock-On' or 'what should have been done with Lock-On in the first place' etc etc.

This is simply not true, and not the case. Very large parts of the software have been re-designed and rewritten from scratch, starting with the Flight Model (a taste of which was indeed provided in Lock On), the cockpit, the avionics, the aircraft electrical, hydraulic, fuel, radio, etc etc systems, as well as the actual weapons and weapon system modeling and of course, the Mission Editor and the Input manager.

There is an actual radio model under the hood managing frequencies and even some things that might be used in the future, but I don't really know about that.

AI FM's have been updated, and a number of other things have been done.

It's just not Lock-On :D

Thanks for the replies...

I was sure that the ED Viper (block 42) cockpit screenshot that i saw was from a WIP being made specifically for Lock-On. However this was many months ago and Black Shark was still in development, so maybe it was/is intended for DCS after all :huh:

Does this mean that future (ED) content/support for Lock-On is now at an end?

It would be nice to get some clarification on both matters ;)

Well couldn't there be a possibility then to release tools for us 3d modellers for lock on to make custom flight models and cockpits? Now as the sim is getting some age and DCS is in the development i dont se any problem with that, especially if the way everything is done differs so much from Lock On to DCS.

I think LO will stay at the edge untill DCS Most wanted fighters modules come to life.

I just hope that this wont take too long because there are others developpers who are working on next generation flight sims as well.

Well couldn't there be a possibility then to release tools for us 3d modellers for lock on to make custom flight models and cockpits? Now as the sim is getting some age and DCS is in the development i dont se any problem with that, especially if the way everything is done differs so much from Lock On to DCS.

Those tools are avialable for DCS.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=31052

Its better to go ahead with DCS than lockon as they now no longer have the same problems as they had in the past with UBI etc.:thumbup:

It's a wonderful prospect that we might be treated to a high fidelity F16 in DCS.

I don't think anyone is taking the Mickey out of the F4 derivative free dev teams; I do think that the vibrant community of Falcon 4 hackers & modifiers have done a stellar job over the years, and there is no doubt that their efforts have raised the bar of consumer expectation (as far as combat flight simming is concerned).

They have my ever-lasting heart felt gratitude anyway!

Cheers!

There was some people creating a MLU model for Lock On that look really good. I do not know what happen with that project. I will love to see when ever and if ever ED actually creates and releases a F-16 (which ever block) After playing with the KA-50 I am really looking forward to see other modules. I'm also very curious to see which version of the F-16. It could be a early block 50 which would be so different from a current one and so on.

Those tools are avialable for DCS.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=31052

 

Its better to go ahead with DCS than lockon as they now no longer have the same problems as they had in the past with UBI etc.:thumbup:

Sweet, but will these tools be able to use to make cockpits etc for flaming cliffs also? Why cant we just get the information in how to do it for flaming cliffs now that DCS is out!. Many of us virtual airshow guys would really appreciate tools for making custom flight models and cockpits, as i dont think it will be a very quick transfer for us to the DCS simulator.

Sweet, but will these tools be able to use to make cockpits etc for flaming cliffs also? Why cant we just get the information in how to do it for flaming cliffs now that DCS is out!. Many of us virtual airshow guys would really appreciate tools for making custom flight models and cockpits, as i dont think it will be a very quick transfer for us to the DCS simulator.

Unfortunately, no. Cockpit, avionics and so on are hardcoded in the LO. It is possible to do changes in DCS, as it uses Lua to script many of the functions, but for LO - this will require rebuilding (in the meaning of recompiling) the whole project. And they will never publish source codes - at least not before first fixed-wing craft modules. No Joy.

Because LockOn is a property of UBIsoft.

"No joy" ©

DCS retains quite a pack of Lock On code; however, it has nothing to do with UBI. Something's not so easy here.

Actually Laivynas is exactly correct, and not only that, but it is property of ED and they have no reason to hand out their hard work, period.

What's the matter?

but it is property of ED and they have no reason to hand out their hard work, period.

Where did I argue that?

Your implied question about relationship to Ubisoft.

Ubisoft owns the Lock On brand - that means that ED cannot release the Lock-On source code even if they want to. Basically the rights to the code that builds lock-on belong to Ubi, even though ED has the right to use the code elsewhere.

Confusing, no?

Actually, given the depth & breadth of available information, I wonder why hackers, modders and developers with a fire in their bellies don't go and try to create something in the (totally OPEN GPL-ed) Flight gear project? Heck, I'd even pay a monthly donation to express my support for it.

It's human nature I guess, each little sub-group wanting to do there own thing. Nevertheless, wouldn't it be great if there was a concerted effort there and we ended up with something open, improvable, extendable and analyzeable ... ah but one can dream! In the mean-time, the closest I'll get to experienceing the fruits of that type of collaboration in a combat flight sim capacity is through the Open Falcon product!

Cheers,

Confusing, no?

Oh, yeah. I've never heard of licenses more complex than a store check.

May I ask you to remove your ego from my toe?.. Too heavy, you know...

The result is what we have - there will be no official support of custom content for LO. However, it was spoken somewhere that custom cockpits are possible via standart .cmd model argument input, and someone even has done one. Ones who wish may try to ask for and argument list. On they own risk, indeed.

Actually, given the depth & breadth of available information, I wonder why hackers, modders and developers with a fire in their bellies don't go and try to create something in the (totally OPEN GPL-ed) Flight gear project? Heck, I'd even pay a monthly donation to express my support for it.

It's human nature I guess, each little sub-group wanting to do there own thing. Nevertheless, wouldn't it be great if there was a concerted effort there and we ended up with something open, improvable, extendable and analyzeable ... ah but one can dream! In the mean-time, the closest I'll get to experienceing the fruits of that type of collaboration in a combat flight sim capacity is through the Open Falcon product!

 

Cheers,

Well I wonder myself with respect to DCS would some of the groups such as FF or OF teams or the companies that did addons for FS series go ahead and make a high quality addon for DCS. It doesn't really work too well for things like LO as there are too many limitations but for DCS its a real possibility for aircraft such as Hornets, F-16 etc.:thumbup: The big thing preventing that though is the ownership of the addon if its payware how will ED handle that and I think thats probably why alot of companies are not too keen to make them for DCS at the moment.:doh:

BTW there already is an open flightsim project called 7G in the works but it'll be quite a while before it reaches the level of DCS. Open projects aren't necessarily a good idea as in my experience people can exploit such code and cheat.