A Different Warthog vs. Cougar Question

[MacFevre]

OK, I have a different Warthog vs. Cougar question. I picked up a used TM Warthog Throttles on an eBay auction about a year ago. I was also able to pick up a TM Cougar stick. Neither is the greatest, the throttles I've taken apart a couple of times to get the right throttle working, and have taken the control stick apart a few times for inop buttons. The stick though has quite a bit of play at the center, of course as it's a Cougar.

 

Recently, I picked up new Cougar gimbals, actually the entire innards of the base, including pots.

 

So now my question. I've been having trouble finding what would be the best grease to use if I were to replace everything in the base. I thought about saying screw it, and just order a new Warthog stick. Or even a complete new set. I could even think about taking that same amount of money and using it to find one of the Cougar mods. (They make those anymore?)

 

So for those who know or have used both, what would be preferred for driving an A-10? An original Cougar, with a decent grease (whatever that may be?) A Cougar with a mod? (And which one?) or a new Warthog.

 

Like I said, already have the throttles that, at the moment, are working okay. So just concerning the stick, what would you do?

 

Thanks.

[Home Fries]

Not sure if Cubpilot is still doing the Hall Sensor upgrade (his website is still up, but supposedly he hasn't been filling orders), but if he is this is definitely the way to go.

 

If not, a good potentiometer cleaner will take care of the spiking that occurs with the pots. Can't speak for the grease, though.

 

So do you have the Cougar stick and throttle along with a Warthog throttle? That's a great combination that gives you the best of both worlds.

[MacFevre]

A Different Warthog vs. Cougar Question

 

Yes, I currently have the Cougar stick with Warthog throttles. That was my main, albeit somewhat muddled, question. Should I keep my current combination, or get a Warthog stick. And if for whatever reason(?) I keep the Cougar stick, should I go "new" stock, or mod it.

 

So what are the advantages for the Cougar? The only thing I see wrong with it currently is the metal on metal wear. (And pots that can eventually wear out.)

[Home Fries]

There are only two advantages to an unmodded Cougar:

 

1. Use of the cougar throttle for use of rotaries. Especially true if you fly Falcon BMS or are holding out for DCS: F-16C.
   
2. The ability to program a rudder and/or add it to a single controller for older games that recognize only one controller (e.g. EF2000).
   

Since the Cougar TQS plugs directly into the Cougar FLCS, you need the stick to use the throttle. The other bit about the rudders is useful for programming (I have a differential braking routine I use with my rudders and the S4 button), even if you don't play older games, but if you have a separate set of rudders with toe brakes this is also a moot point.

 

 

The other factor to consider is whether you plan to program in TARGET, use somebody else's profile, or just use the directx commands. If you plan on using someone else's profile you're probably better off getting the Warthog since most publicly available profiles won't mix and match hardware. Besides, the Warthog has Hall sensors and a Z axis on the CMS that the Cougar doesn't have.

 

 

There's also the hardcore approach: keep the Cougar FLCS, find yourself a TQS (you can program all 3 in TARGET), then when the Cougar pots wear out get a force sensing mod and mount the cougar to the right (like the F-16/F-22) for the Fly-by-Wire jets and a warthog (center mounted) for everything else. This way you have all bases covered. :smilewink:

[Ssnake51]

Not sure if Cubpilot is still doing the Hall Sensor upgrade (his website is still up, but supposedly he hasn't been filling orders), but if he is this is definitely the way to go.

 

 

Not sure what has happened to Cubpilot, but no one has been able to contact him for some time.

 

Ian is considering another production run of the Uber2NXT mod for the Cougar. Apparently he has located another source for the Hall Sensors. Info on that can be found at:

 

http://www.frugalsrefugees.com/showthread.php?54-Nxt-Mod

[Cali]

There are only two advantages to an unmodded Cougar:

 

1. Use of the cougar throttle for use of rotaries. Especially true if you fly Falcon BMS or are holding out for DCS: F-16C.
   
2. The ability to program a rudder and/or add it to a single controller for older games that recognize only one controller (e.g. EF2000).
   

Since the Cougar TQS plugs directly into the Cougar FLCS, you need the stick to use the throttle. The other bit about the rudders is useful for programming (I have a differential braking routine I use with my rudders and the S4 button), even if you don't play older games, but if you have a separate set of rudders with toe brakes this is also a moot point.

 

 

That's not true, you can use the throttle without the stick now. Realsimulator made a device that allows the throttle to work on it's own, check the link for details.

http://www.realsimulator.com/html/tusba.html

[MacFevre]

So basically no to the Cougar without a mod? I don't really see anything addressing the question of Is there any advantage at all to having a modded or even a newly built Cougar over the Warthog? I don't have the Cougar throttle. I don't have the TM rudder pedals. Concerning the stick, is there any reason at all to keep a Copugar stick vs. selling it and purchasing the Warthog stick. I could mod it or I could make it just like brand new, but is it worth it?

[Ssnake51]

MacFevre,

As you indicated, an unmodded Warthog stick is better than an unmodded Cougar stick.

A Cougar with the Uber2NXT mod is ergonomically much superior to the unmodded Warthog, IMHO. There is no bump in the middle and none of the 'stiction' many complain about on the Warthog. But you can most likely get the Warthog stick for a good deal less money than you'd pay for the mod.

[MacFevre]

Thank you Ssnake. That was more on the lines of what I was looking for. If I was trying to save money, I certainly wouldn't be trying to build a cockpit! It's insane the amount of money that can be sucked up. It's almost like having a real plane, or even a boat.

 

So in summary, if money is no object, having a modded Cougar is better than a Warthog. (Don't know what "stiction" is.) Otherwise, stick with the unmodded Cougar until a Warthog either comes up for sale by itself, or pay the extra $100USD or so and get a whole new set.

 

So, know anyone with either a used mod for the Cougar for sale, (or a modded one?) or a Warthog without the throttles? :smilewink:

[Ssnake51]

So, know anyone with either a used mod for the Cougar for sale, (or a modded one?) or a Warthog without the throttles? :smilewink:

 

That is the one negative I forgot to mention regarding the Uber2NXT mod: they are damn difficult to obtain right now. :cry:

 

Ian, the fellow who made that mod, stopped production a while back. However, it looks like he is going to do another production run shortly. If you look at post #5 above you will see a link to a discussion regarding the new batch.

[leafer]

This place has the exact same hall sensors Cub was selling: http://www.admtech.com.au/midori-precisions-rotary-sensors

 

I'd love to give credit to the person who posted the link above here a while ago but I have no idea who that is.

[Ssnake51]

This place has the exact same hall sensors Cub was selling: http://www.admtech.com.au/midori-precisions-rotary-sensors

 

I'd love to give credit to the person who posted the link above here a while ago but I have no idea who that is.

 

Problem is that it wouldn't be worth upgrading the Cougar stick with just the hall sensors. Too many problems with the stock gimbals. One might as well go ahead and spend the money on a new Warthog stick.

[PureEvil]

Too many problems with the stock gimbals. One might as well go ahead and spend the money on a new Warthog stick.

 

warthog is not without it's own problems, just look at all those threads, issues with the throttle, rings on the stick, etc. i think it's excellent idea to just change gimbal system on cougar and get over it. it's cheaper too.

[Home Fries]

That's not true, you can use the throttle without the stick now. Realsimulator made a device that allows the throttle to work on it's own, check the link for details.

http://www.realsimulator.com/html/tusba.html

That's pretty sweet. Will the TQS still be recognized in TARGET?

[Ssnake51]

That's pretty sweet. Will the TQS still be recognized in TARGET?

 

Unfortunately, no. You can't use TARGET to program it.

 

This page provides more info:

 

http://www.realsimulator.com/html/tusba.html