Can you program your "pitbull" range for the AIM-120?

[winchesterdelta1]

If you fire a AIM-120 it will go active (Pitbull) when in 10nm right?.

But can you program the AIM-120 to go pitbull within lets say when the target aircraft is within 4nm. This would be really handy for TWS shots.

Is this possible in DCS? Is it actually possible in real life?

[104th_Maverick]

If you fire a AIM-120 it will go active (Pitbull) when in 10nm right?.

 

8nm is a bit more accurate I think mate

 

 

But can you program the AIM-120 to go pitbull within lets say when the target aircraft is within 4nm. .....Is it actually possible in real life?

 

Not as far as I know, GG will jump in here soon and confirm for you though!

[winchesterdelta1]

Thanks. I must have remembered it wrong.

[winchesterdelta1]

It should be possible to guide the AIM-120 all the way to the target with your F-15 radar right? Without it ever going active.

[Frostie]

I'm not sure if there is enough public knowledge to determine the full capabilities of the AMRAAM, the abscense of a GG post probably means there isn't as he is the guru around here.

 

It is well documented that the 120 has a 2 stage active operation, hprf and mprf, and they can be lofted or not and launched with mid course updates or boresighted - pitbill of the rail. But the idea of using it with delayed active or semi active seems a good idea but what's to say that the aircraft radar has primary control anyway and the missile is guided semi active until the aircraft radar is dropped. Or they could and probably would work in tandem. If the aircraft is at half its strength to lock the target while the 120 is at full scope of its radar trying to acquire it makes sense to use the aircraft radar. But there is so much more to it to understand such as datalink, if the 120 doesn't see the target then the radar will probably still be guiding the missile in.

[GGTharos]

There is enough public knowledge (or unclassified but not necessarily public) to know a whole bunch of the AMRAAM's capabilities. There are a lot of things that we'll never know, like ECCM methods and capabilities, other than what's apparently 'obvious' (because that's what those who apparently know better like to tell us :P ), like MPRF being next to immune to chaff, and giving jammers a pretty hard time; we know AMRAAMs use 'special flight paths' but other than some basic understanding of what this means, we don't know the exact details, especially as it related to ECCM.

 

That said, to answer the first question:

 

You can program a real AIM-120 to do whatever you want. That's not something the pilot does, it's done by the guys who update the AIM-120 software at the depot/maintenance level (someone who knows the maintenance structure correct me).

 

The pilot just gets to use the DLZ. The missile selects whether it's going active or not on its own, and how smart that range of choices is is not known. It may always go active at the greatest range for the simple reason that two radars are better than one. The missile uses both the aircraft datalink (and thus aircraft radar information) as well as its own radar to help select the correct target (if in a group) and to reject any countermeasures. This all begins at the HPRF stage, and that's why interrupting the datalink at this stage is a 'cheapshot' - you just lowered the missile's chances of succeeding, especially against multiple targets (more than 1 missile may hit the same target) or higher capability targets. Having more radars (ie the launcher + the 120) can also completely defeat low(er) capability jammers. All this requires you performing a very good A-Pole ... and pretty much most of this is irrelevant to the game.

 

In-game, the moment the missile activates its seeker for any reason whatsoever, it will ignore the datalink.

Edited March 10, 2014 by GGTharos

[TAW_Blaze]

GG

 

I'm suspicious that for some reason ingame the missile's radar is the primary source of guidance rather than the aircraft's radar. I've noticed AIM-7s acting as if the lock was lost and flew ballistic for periods of time even though I kept a steady lock on the target. Not sure about the slammer, but I definitely remember things like that happening with the sparrow.

[GGTharos]

The missile guidance in game is just very simple, not much to be suspicious about.

[TAW_Blaze]

But does that mean if a SARH does not see the target, but it's locked up in the aircraft it goes ballistic? That doesn't make any kind of sense..

[GGTharos]

Why? What's the SARH missile going to do without it's seeker seeing a target other than fly ballistic?

[TAW_Blaze]

M-link can tell him where the target is.. other than that, I had them recovering after flying ballistic after the target was out of their FoV. So I don't really get it.. if it works the way you say then it should be impossible to recover like that, yet I've had it happen multiple times.

[GGTharos]

Who says it's using M-Link?

Who says the seeker isn't executing a search pattern when it has no target?

 

As I said before, the moment the seeker is activated in this game, the data-link, IF the missile uses one, is ignored.

[TAW_Blaze]

How is the SARH guided then? If it terminates the link from the aircraft, it's ballistic.. isn't it?

[GGTharos]

... seriously? SARH missiles guide to the reflection of the launcher's radar from the target's skin.

[TAW_Blaze]

Nevermind Mustang just arrived and we figured out what's the deal.

[GGTharos]

What's the deal?

[TAW_Blaze]

My understanding of how a SARH is guided was flawed. I'll look into it more :D

[Frostie]

If you want an understanding on how SARH work read this.

http://www.ausairpower.net/TE-Radar-AAMs.html

[TAW_Blaze]

Thanks Frostie! I'll have a look at it.

[winchesterdelta1]

Thanks for the info. I was more thinking like programming the missile when in the cockpit. Same as that you can change the GPS targetting information of a JDAM when on your hard point. But i don't think my question is that dumb. But thanks for the info anyway. I can understand that it does not work that way now. But the logic behind my questions is, that if you fire a missile in TWS mode the target aircarft won't get a launch warning before the missile go's active. If you would be able to change the pitbull range in cockpit theoreticly you can even give them way less time to respond to your AIM-120 shot.

I understand 2 radars is better. But decreasing reaction time when fired a missile like that would be preferable in some kind of situations right.

[GGTharos]

There exists no such function for the AIM-120 in the cockpit, at least not in the unclass stuff that's available. The only selection for the 120 is target size, and that changes the fuze function.

[winchesterdelta1]

Thank you. Thats what i needed to know.

[TAW_Blaze]

So I fired a slammer 18000' in a 20-25 deg climb, not maneuvering at all, nowhere near any kind of terrain and the missile self detonates on my belly while doing no harm to the plane. What? I just got literally mind****ed.

Edited March 11, 2014 by <Blaze>

[Grigs]

Here is a follow-up to Winchester's questioning:

 

Does anyone know if there exists a SARH missile which could be launched without trigging a missile launch warning on your target's RWR?

 

My guess is that it does not exist. Hence the next question: what is the technical limitation which prevent this "upgrade?"

[lunaticfringe]

Compare the size of the radar in the nose of the launch aircraft, versus the one in the missile.

 

Do the math, and you'll have your answer.