moving units and lag

[xcom]

I'd like to start a thread about the major lag issues that arise when there are many moving units in a multiplayer mission.

 

We've done several tests with large scale stress tests of around 40 players on a weekly basis and on 2 different servers .

 

The tests were done with missions of between 300 to 600 units, all stationary.

What we tested is what happens when we start moving several groups (3 and 7 groups) while having around 30-40 players connected, we've notices that if we move more than around 20-50 units, we start getting lag effects of planes jumping all over the place (can also be seen in the map).

 

This issue reproduces 100% of the time, it also happens with predetermined routes and not only by using the CA.

 

We would like to know if this issue -

1. has been reported?

2. Is being handled in any way or only be fixed in the EDGE release or the dedicated server release?

3. Has any known workaround?

 

We have a large scale collaboration with a few communities therefore we can run several stress tests and would really like to assist if needed.

 

Thanks for all your hard word ED!

Xcom

[RagnarDa]

Is the lag only when the units are given the order to move (and the route calculations are made) or is it all the while the units are moving? Does the lag ease up once they have started rolling? Does it help to have more units in the same group?

[xcom]

All the while the units are moving.

 

We tested groups of 3 and groups of 7, there didn't seem to be a significant change by the group size, the significance seemed to be the amount of units all together.

 

Lag does not ease up, but there are spikes, meaning it will be fine for a while and then start lagging again, I'm not sure if it is due to the course calculation or not, haven't identified it to that extant.

 

I'll try to upload a few trk examples.

[RagnarDa]

Too bad, otherwise we could have worked around it...

[Paganus]

What are the server and internet connection specifications?

 

There are, and always have been, limits to units and AI the software can push. The hardware you run on is something you should also factor into the equation.

 

For example, our server can only handle about 600 static objects before they start vanishing. That's with any number of players from 1 to 10.

 

From our testing, we think fewer large groups is better than many small ones. In other words 5 groups with 10 units is less taxing on the server than 50 groups of 1 unit.

 

On our server we tend to start getting more disconnects above 12 clients. We know some servers out there are hosting 30+ clients.

 

There are many variables to consider.

[xcom]

We have a very strong server.

 

I7 3770 @ 3.4ghz

32GB RAM

1Gbps Full Duplex

 

We have been running on weekly basis ,as I was saying before, large scale missions with around 40 participants and 600 units.

While there were small amounts of moving units, there was no lag and we could probably go up to 50 or 60 participants, the issue starts when units are moving.

 

Paganus, if you are having disconnection issues I would think you should check your server connection, we do not encounter such issues.

 

I hope we can get some ED guys or testers to report this issue and see if there is something to be done.

Not long ago 1.2.6, we couldn't even hold 20 players, I hope this issue could be felt with as well.

 

Edit - this has also been tested on another server and we see similar results.

Edited May 12, 2014 by xcom

[TaliG]

I dnt think this is going to end until a new AI ''force'' moving MP algorithm is implemented.

Thus I do not consider this as a bug.

In my opinion it is an old ai moving algorithm, not sufficient for today's mass multiplayer gaming demands.

I hope ED will take care of this 10 year old ai engine and not just tinger it only because their CA module.

 

Be safe, fly DCS ;)

[xcom]

Well it certainly isn't working by design :)

 

I really don't care if they flag this as a bug or not, just wish it is recognized as an issue for one thing, and also have a timeframe for a fix or even some kind of workaround.

[FlightControl]

Hello,

 

Limit the amount of units to a minimal set, and you can limit the lag issue.

 

I know this is challenging, but this is the only workaround for the moment.

 

I have missions here working smoothly from server to client with about 400 units. One experience i have is, when the amount of air units (especially helicopters) increases, the amount of lag increases more quickly than when just ground units are on the floor.

 

I'll post a test mission that i've made to the forum soon where you can measure the lag on your side, because i've experienced that lag has nothing to do with ping rates. The lag seems to occur when the network thread in the DCS world engine cannot cope with the amount of moving units anymore, so the time interval it takes so send all that info out to keep the DCS world engines in sync, increases. (not that i've underlined the moving word.) Some units get skipped after a critical time interval, and that causes the lag.

 

When you design your missions, ensure that you can focus on one part of the battle zone.

 

Sven

[xcom]

Hello,

 

Limit the amount of units to a minimal set, and you can limit the lag issue.

 

I know this is challenging, but this is the only workaround for the moment.

 

I have missions here working smoothly from server to client with about 400 units. One experience i have is, when the amount of air units (especially helicopters) increases, the amount of lag increases more quickly than when just ground units are on the floor.

 

I'll post a test mission that i've made to the forum soon where you can measure the lag on your side, because i've experienced that lag has nothing to do with ping rates. The lag seems to occur when the network thread in the DCS world engine cannot cope with the amount of moving units anymore, so the time interval it takes so send all that info out to keep the DCS world engines in sync, increases. (not that i've underlined the moving word.) Some units get skipped after a critical time interval, and that causes the lag.

 

When you design your missions, ensure that you can focus on one part of the battle zone.

 

Sven

 

 

Thanks for your input, it seems you are experiencing the same issues I've reported which strengthens my point which the issue relates to the amount of units + the amount of moving units + amount of players.

 

About the workaround, when I asked for a workaround I meant something else than what I've already wrote about, which is exactly as you suggested - limiting the amount of moving units, we have already saw that working, I was wondering if there was any other workaround available.

 

Just to clarify, this thread's purpose is first to report this issue to ED so they will have a good focus on where the network issues are being experienced.

[FubarBundy]

Same issue here... Intermittent lag when gound units are moving in numbers. AI aircraft will do the same. I'm also finding that the lag is worse with respawned units and the lag gets worse over the time the misson is running.

just wanting to confirm the issue. Its a shame because it makes a truly dynamic battlefield for large numbers of players almost impossible :(