Inconsistent mapping of commands to cockpit controls

[saybahluvah]

My first post! YAY!

 

Let me start off by saying thank you to the BelSimTek team for making such an awesome module. It has already given me hours and hours of enjoyment.

 

I am planning a control panel for F-86 and have noticed many inconsistencies in how commands are mapped to the cockpit controls, as well as missing command mappings, both of which get in the way of the panel's verisimilitude.

 

For instance, the Compass Light toggle switch on the right forward console has one command "Compass Light" mapped to it. This one command toggles the compass light on or off. The Pitot Heat toggle on the left forward console, however, has 2 commands mapped to it ("Pitot Heater On" and "Pitot Heater Off"). There are other examples of this where a 2-state toggle sometimes has 1 command and sometimes has 2.

 

Some 3-way toggles only have 2 commands mapped to them while some have 3. For instance, the Battery/Off/Starter toggle has 2 commands, "Starter" which engages down/Starter until released, and "Battery" which toggles between up/Battery and center/Off. 3-way toggles that have 3 positions that the toggle can rest in like the Landing/Taxi Lights have 3 commands, one for each position of the toggle. 3-way toggles in which one position is "on" only while the corresponding control is held down (a "momentary on" position) consistently have 2 commands, and 3-way toggles that do not have a "momentary on" position consistently have 3 commands. I personally would prefer all 3-ways to have 3 commands because it make mapping commands to physical toggle switches on a panel much easier.

 

I can work with any scheme of command mapping, but I think command mappings should be consistent across the different forms of cockpit controls.

 

I propose the following scheme:

 

Push-buttons (e.g. - Stop Starter) and 2-way toggles where one position is a "momentary on" (e.g. Air Start) should have 1 command. A 2-way toggle where one position is only active while it is held in place is just a glorified button with a different user interface, and so should map the same as genuine push-buttons which disengage when you release them.

 

2-way toggles with 2 "sticky" positions (e.g. - Pitot Heater, Exterior Lights Bright/Dim) should have 2 commands, one for each position.

 

3-way toggles should have 3 commands, one for each position of the toggle, even if one of the up/down positions is a "momentary on". This means that the Battery/Off/Starter toggle that we all use when we start-up the plane should have an "Off" command added. Similarly, the "Generator/Off/Reset" toggle should have an additional command for the center position.

 

Those are my personal preferences, but again, any scheme will work as log as it is consistently applied throughout the cockpit.

 

Thanks for reading the long post!

[SeaQuark]

In general the control mappings are pretty limited, and make life difficult for anyone who wants to use real USB buttons and switches. I'm very much hoping this is temporary and will be fixed soon.

 

The "clockwise" and "counterclockwise" approach to rotaries is particularly troublesome. A 4-position switch should have 4 discrete position keys, plus a single toggle key for those limited to a keyboard. With just "clockwise" and "counterclockwise" it's impossible to actually map this rotary to a real USB counterpart on a joystick or switchbox.

 

Also, there are not enough Axis controls available. Radar range & tone volumes would be perfect to control with a USB knob or lever, but currently must be operated by only "UP" and "DOWN" buttons.

[derelor]

My first post! YAY!

 

Let me start off by saying thank you to the BelSimTek team for making such an awesome module. It has already given me hours and hours of enjoyment.

 

I am planning a control panel for F-86 and have noticed many inconsistencies in how commands are mapped to the cockpit controls, as well as missing command mappings, both of which get in the way of the panel's verisimilitude.

 

For instance, the Compass Light toggle switch on the right forward console has one command "Compass Light" mapped to it. This one command toggles the compass light on or off. The Pitot Heat toggle on the left forward console, however, has 2 commands mapped to it ("Pitot Heater On" and "Pitot Heater Off"). There are other examples of this where a 2-state toggle sometimes has 1 command and sometimes has 2.

 

Some 3-way toggles only have 2 commands mapped to them while some have 3. For instance, the Battery/Off/Starter toggle has 2 commands, "Starter" which engages down/Starter until released, and "Battery" which toggles between up/Battery and center/Off. 3-way toggles that have 3 positions that the toggle can rest in like the Landing/Taxi Lights have 3 commands, one for each position of the toggle. 3-way toggles in which one position is "on" only while the corresponding control is held down (a "momentary on" position) consistently have 2 commands, and 3-way toggles that do not have a "momentary on" position consistently have 3 commands. I personally would prefer all 3-ways to have 3 commands because it make mapping commands to physical toggle switches on a panel much easier.

 

I can work with any scheme of command mapping, but I think command mappings should be consistent across the different forms of cockpit controls.

 

I propose the following scheme:

 

Push-buttons (e.g. - Stop Starter) and 2-way toggles where one position is a "momentary on" (e.g. Air Start) should have 1 command. A 2-way toggle where one position is only active while it is held in place is just a glorified button with a different user interface, and so should map the same as genuine push-buttons which disengage when you release them.

 

2-way toggles with 2 "sticky" positions (e.g. - Pitot Heater, Exterior Lights Bright/Dim) should have 2 commands, one for each position.

 

3-way toggles should have 3 commands, one for each position of the toggle, even if one of the up/down positions is a "momentary on". This means that the Battery/Off/Starter toggle that we all use when we start-up the plane should have an "Off" command added. Similarly, the "Generator/Off/Reset" toggle should have an additional command for the center position.

 

Those are my personal preferences, but again, any scheme will work as log as it is consistently applied throughout the cockpit.

 

Thanks for reading the long post!

Welcome to the ED forums!

 

Some switches cannot be mapped to keyboard/joystick yet, because input commands are missing (e.g. complete left panel). This is of course known (e.g. ticket #28106) and being worked on. Remember the F-86F is still in beta.

 

You are also correct about the inconsistencies. The scheme of command mapping should not only be consistent across the different forms of cockpit controls, but consistent across all modules.

 

It is known that several users and especially cockpit builders want all individual switch positions mappable by default. I think this will be done in the future, even if this will produce an enormous amount of input commands (see for example the 9 commands for the 7-position Drop Tank Selector Switch in the attachment).

 

In the meantime you can take a look at Madcat's thread with lua edits:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=125245

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2144626&postcount=20

[SeaQuark]

Welcome to the ED forums!

It is known that several users and especially cockpit builders want all individual switch positions mappable by default. I think this will be done in the future, even if this will produce an enormous amount of input commands (see for example the 9 commands for the 7-position Drop Tank Selector Switch in the attachment).

 

Thanks, good to know this is in consideration! The more options the better, I say, even if it does mean the control menus get rather crowded.

[cichlidfan]

The root of the problem is not any one module. It is the lack of a standard set forth by ED and adhered to by everyone.

[Slap_Chop]

More AXIS commands would be great for the F86. My x55 has a few rotaries

sitting idle with this module.