SA-10 vs PATRIOT

[johnv2pt0]

Hey guys, I'm having trouble balancing missions with red vs blue weapon systems.

 

 

The SA-10 system shoots down EVERYTHING. It takes a large effort to bring one down...that's not the problem.

 

The Patriot system shoots down NOTHING. One KH-58U gets through and kills it without problem.

 

What do you guys do to balance this disparity out? Thanks ~

[karambiatos]

the patriot can intercept the kh-58 when on excellent.

you need to remember that the patriot radar must see its missile after it launches, otherwise the missile will just explode.

 

 

anyway, i always put rolands around the patriot site, since the SAM AI is pretty bad, i kind of balance it out, by putting a bunch of units, that can intercept incoming missiles.

Edited November 13, 2014 by karambiatos

[Davis0079]

I build sam nets with Grimes IADS script, if my needed map area is large enough, break the major sections off into groups (IADS advanced option) with the long range missiles being the IADS group leader of the medium range stuff. Then line unscripted mobile short range missiles and AA guns around the sam sites.

 

Red or blue normally don't have a air defense problem on my map. lol.

 

The only limit I have with my builds is when I fly the F-15 I can sit at their max range and instigate missile launches then burn their energy and defeat the missile, one after another, after another. Until they are out of missiles then fly right by the launchers. I try to normally give most sam sites four or so launchers.

 

And I like using Sa-3 site around airfields for the simple fact that they look the coolest, the launchers that is.

 

This is all single player action played directly out of the mission editor. Basically the only way I'v been playing DCS lately. So I'm sure how I position my units would be unbalanced in a multiplayer setting.

 

In this manor of use, the patriot doesn't seem to have a low kill count. I also think I remember the patriot being the same as the hawk, as where you must face multiples of the same unit type in different directions because they cannot see/launch in a 360 FOV. I could be wrong about that last part though. Its been a while since I put much effort into it.

 

Group sizes can play a major factor when trying to populate large areas for singleplayer. My Sa-10, patriot and hawk systems are all 10 units. Normally having a fuel and cargo truck, 4 launchers, normally 3 different track and search radars, and some type of Command Post truck. My Sa-11s and other mobile missile are normally 7 to 5 units with trucks and fuel. Sa-3s can be 5 units with mostly all launchers. And short range Radar/IR/Laser units I make as small as possible, 1 unit if possible, but it normally takes 3 to 5. AA guns are always 1 unit per group and never in a sam or missile group. and I never mix my missile groups up. And I like only 1 complete radar system(search+track system) per group because in DCS most groups only attack one thing at a time. 1 big group with 40 units does not work as good as 4 groups of 10. Whether clustered together or spread out over a big area, many smaller groups instead of a few big ones make for a much more deadly sam network.

 

sorry about not really sticking to the Sa-10 vs Patriot theme. I'm sorta off subject

Edited November 14, 2014 by Davis0079

[Wrecking Crew]

That's pretty interesting karambiatos about the excellent setting.

 

 

I will layer the Blue ADA with Patriot and HAWK, and a little IR as well. The Patriot is a far away group (~30 km) with that flat panel phased array radar and I'll point its radar and launchers toward the threat. For the HAWK (10-20 km) I will use one search (rotating) radar and one each (rotating) tracking radar per 2-3 launchers, x 2. The HAWK launchers I will point outward towards the anticipated threats, even to cover 360°. Sprinkle in some Chaparrals and Avengers and Vulcans.

 

Up to you if you want to separate these ^^ into three groups, or one... I'd be interested to hear what others think about the grouping.

 

 

With Red ADA I'll sometimes start the group with unit #1 as the early warning radar.

 

For MANPADS groups I'll set the Commo guy as #1 with 2-3 launcher guys.

 

WC

[johnv2pt0]

Thanks. I didn't know about the excellent setting making a difference. Good info all around.

 

I'm making a mission that I want only 1 long range sam site per side as part of the objectives (multiplayer), so I'm stuck with Patriot and SA-10, based on placement and ranges. I think I can make it work though.

 

Cheers

[Aginor]

SAMs in a simulation are a pretty difficult topic. None of them is really realistic after all. But I think ED is doing a great job to make them work halfway balanced.