F-14 Cockpit and instrument dimensions

[Trainman]

@BULLITT83 Silly question, but in your photos you have a plan to mark out the spacing of the ribs.. Where did you find that, or did you create that yourself?

[rosariovw]

I got almost all my panels done, but due to the problems with my rs485, i going to stop and start selling my parts.

 

ATM i got it all working with standard USB connections, but now i'm at 40USB cables.

 

[RustBelt]

Yea that’s a serious overload of USB. You must be running into tier limits.

[A2Moonclaw]

On 3/20/2024 at 11:41 PM, Madpie said:

Hey, what constants do you guys know in this cockpit? I was thinking the panels were the standard 146.05mm wide but they don't seem too consistent when I messed around in modelview coupled with fusion. I was looking at the sketchup files but they don't seem to agree with each other. Do we know the width of the fishbowl edge to edge or the ejection seat or the width of the rudder pedals apart? Is the heatblur model off?

I was about to draw up a rio radar panel but then got sidetracked in the front cockpit. Are these panels the classic 146.05mm wide?

Also, while I'm at it, does anyone know the argument to get rid of the rio's body?

Where do you view these models?

[Madpie]

Find modelviewer in "\DCSWorld\bin\ModelViewer2.exe"

In the top left open File > Load model > "\DCSWorld\Mods\aircraft\F14\Shapes\F14A_Cockpit.edm"

Wait for it to load, then click Camera > Set camera mode ortho. Now click Show> Free camera mode

Zoom in on the cockpit by right clicking on the bottom of the screen and dragging up (or go to tools>preferences and turn mouse wheel sensitivity all the way up)

Choose the view you want from the bar at the top (the arrow tiles, the crosshair tiles or the webcam). You can also click object view on and off if you desire (sometimes gets rid of weird clipping). Mess with the arguments to get rid of pilots or canopy to taste (there's a lot, I usually keep ones I find I want in a spreadsheet)

You can change directions with single click and drag.

Now hold W and you will see camera distance on the bottom right winding down. It sections through the cockpit as it approaches 0. Hold S to drag it back. A, D Shift and CTRL move the camera around when middle mouse button doesn't play nice. Q and E rotate it.

If you need measurements you can press the "show model grid tile". It should be a 1000mm per box. You  can change the size of the box in tools> grid options.

Take screenshots and drop them into fusion 360 or whatever you want and calibrate. You can scour the internet for dimensions of parts of the cockpit if you want to verify measurements. Usually most people go off the width of the dzus panels which are 146.05mm wide. Read this pdf for more.

https://www.mycockpit.org/tutorials/Panelbuildingfocussedondimensions.pdf

This guy gives you a good idea on how to use fusion and make a panel for it btw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XuYIC7n16Y

Edited July 5, 2024 by Madpie

[lawn_dart_actual]

On 2/23/2024 at 8:56 AM, A2Moonclaw said:

I know I’m many years late but this forum is really helping me plan on building my F14 simpit. This link does not work anymore (at least for me), do you mind sending a new one? These dimensions would be quite useful. I appreciate anything Cobra! 

Sorry it's late, but if you look back a few pages, I shared a link that still works. The Internet Archive/Wayback Machine managed to archive it, and you can download it here:

https://web.archive.org/web/20210316062834/http://media.heatblur.se/F-14_B_Cockpit_Dimensions.rar

Edited June 25, 2024 by lawn_dart_actual
typo

[ITR1102]

Anyone have the dimensions for each of the analog and tape gauges?

Also, has anyone incorporated working analog gauges into their cockpit builds?

I wondered if I can get some LCD panels of the same size and run them via Arduino and DCS Bios. Has this been done before?

[Elo]

On 6/27/2024 at 1:11 AM, ITR1102 said:

Anyone have the dimensions for each of the analog and tape gauges?

Also, has anyone incorporated working analog gauges into their cockpit builds?

I wondered if I can get some LCD panels of the same size and run them via Arduino and DCS Bios. Has this been done before?

@ITR1102 For the gauges, you can get the dimensions of some of them from MIL-Spec documents, the altimeter (https://everyspec.com/MIL-PRF/MIL-PRF-080000-99999/download.php?spec=MIL-PRF-83419E.041672.pdf) or clock (http://everyspec.com/MIL-SPECS/MIL-SPECS-MIL-C/MIL-C-38207A_33161/) for example. Theres probably more to find on that website, but i just use those dimensions to then take screenshots in ModelViewer2, using the "set camera mode ortho" option and extrapolate from there

I currently have the VVI, Barometric and Radar altimeter working as analouge gauges, with the BDHI and Airspeed+Mach indicator on the bench. I personally am using screens only for VDI, HSI, RWR and engine instruments (since im building a B Model).

Ive seen "hybrid" analouge/digital gauges like this being used ( @AlphaDecay on the DCS-Skunkworks Discord)

as well as full digital ones like TheWarthogProject. While displaying simple numbers on OLEDs is possible with arduinos, making completely digital instruments on LCDs would require something like Helios, as far as i know. And with that, you quickly run into the issue of NVIDIA GPUs only being able to connect 4 displays.

With the A-10 you have a large, somewhat rectangular main instrument panel that allows for a single large screen, in the Tomcat however the instrument panels are split and a more triangular shape that doesnt really allow for that.

[Madpie]

Seat pan asymmetry 

Hey I thought I'd start with modelling up the ejection seat to CNC parts of it. I always figured it would be symmetrical but it seems the pan is off centre in the heatblur scans (im assuming for the hydraulic lever). The headrest and rear portion of the seat sit symmetrically on the midplane. So the left leg portion of the seatpan is quite a bit narrower than the right leg portion. Is it like this irl or not, has anyone run into this issue yet or did you make your seats symmetrically?

I can't really tell from these pictures.

[ITR1102]

Seat pan asymmetry 
Hey I thought I'd start with modelling up the ejection seat to CNC parts of it. I always figured it would be symmetrical but it seems the pan is off centre in the heatblur scans (im assuming for the hydraulic lever). The headrest and rear portion of the seat sit symmetrically on the midplane. So the left leg portion of the seatpan is quite a bit narrower than the right leg portion. Is it like this irl or not, has anyone run into this issue yet or did you make your seats symmetrically?
I can't really tell from these pictures.

If you need any photos or easy measurements without disassembly, let me know. I just got a nice seat from a local auction.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Madpie]

OMG. Yeeeeeeeeees pleeeease. Holy <profanity>

[Madpie]

Firstly, feel free to photo dump!

If possible can you measure the 5 from the top sketch and the 3 from the rear? I can't believe you got a seat, its going to help me clear this up so easily. I hope it didn't hurt the wallet too much!

edit. For the back, can you do it to the outside of the metal sides?

Edited July 13, 2024 by Madpie

[ITR1102]

The left and right seat and padding look and feel symmetrical to me. I’ve taken a few measurements for you but I only have a US standard tape measure and a small digital caliper. I’ll add some extra photos too.

[Madpie]

Many thanks, it seems the heatblur ones might have had to compromise in some parts. You're so lucky to get one! Now it's cleared up, I'll make a symmetrical one but I think I'll have to throw out a few parts I've modelled. Fortunately you came along before I started the CNC!

Just so I can get the width right, are you able to measure where these red lines/dots are for me from one side to the other without the cushions? I'f I get the width between the metal flanks I'll be pretty happy to start modelling again. Also are you able to measure the width of the bottom and top of the parachute container? I got pretty far with the curves last time and breaking it up into cuttable portions but if I start again I might as well get it right. Excuse my MS paint below

Also last question. The metal flanks are parallel right?

[ITR1102]

Hope this helps!

[Madpie]

Thanks mate. I moved the blue stuff to align with your measurements. 
Now I'm wondering if there really was that much space between the outside of the ejection seat and the panels. I might have to buy danny coremans book to find out...

 

edit: learning a lot about lofting as I go along

Edited July 21, 2024 by Madpie

[RustBelt]

Your picture feels miss-paralaxed or something. If you want to match it with pictures be sure the render is not in Ortho view. And be mindful of lens distortion in photographs.

[Madpie]

Does anyone know the angle of throw of the throttle? @Yogi8 is that models arms to scale?

[Elo]

@Madpie In HBs Model, it looks to be about 53,7°

Keep in mind that the Throttle in our DCS F-14 doesnt exactly mimic the real one, as can be seen in this video at around 5:35

Looks like irl the MIL detent would be a bit more center then in DCS. The one in DCS/MV2 is probably serviceable though.
There are some people here with access to original Throttle Quadrants, like punk and Cheesecake, perhaps they could help you further

[RustBelt]

You can now adjust the detent position in the special options. 
 

They have it set to roughly match commercial HOTAS detents. But once you go custom, you can tell it where yours works.

 

although that video looks more like mil to 75% with 25% available for afterburner range.

Edited August 16, 2024 by RustBelt

[Madpie]

It would be nice if it was just 53 degrees. I've been making a hall sensor setup for the P-47 throttle with 2 magnets per axis but its coming up against some physical limitations beyond the 66 degrees I need for that particular plane. I was hoping to use it for the Tomcat but I'm concerned it might be close to almost 90 irl in which case I'd have to make a new design (lickily theres a lot more width for the 4 axis than the 80mm on the p-47.. I'd rather make it have a realistic throw rather than heatblurs one

[Elo]

 Pretty sure its not 90°, and since HBs 3D model is based on scans on real aircraft id bet the 53,7° is pretty close. I was mostly referring to the detent positions regarding innaccuracies. Looking at cockpit pictures in D. Core mans "Uncovering the Grumman F-14 A/B/D Tomcat" and comparing those with the HB Model it seems good enough

[AusMumbles]

G'day everyone!

Hope you are all keeping well.

I've finally had some time to get back into Tomcat development. 

I'm working on the right instrument panel housing at the moment.

I picked up an ALR-67 from flight sim pro. It's really nicely made by the Gents who put it together.

https://flightsim.pro/ols/products/rwr-azimuth-indicator-alr-67-us-navy

I managed to find a 5x5 inch screen for the VDI, but still coming up short on a 6.5x5 inch screen for the HSD. 

I've swapped out my old rudder pedals for some TPRs as well. 

If someone has one handy, can they please chuck up the dimensions of the canopy jettison handle.

Cheers,

Mumbles

[ITR1102]

16 hours ago, AusMumbles said:

G'day everyone!

Hope you are all keeping well.

I've finally had some time to get back into Tomcat development. 

I'm working on the right instrument panel housing at the moment.

I picked up an ALR-67 from flight sim pro. It's really nicely made by the Gents who put it together.

https://flightsim.pro/ols/products/rwr-azimuth-indicator-alr-67-us-navy

I managed to find a 5x5 inch screen for the VDI, but still coming up short on a 6.5x5 inch screen for the HSD. 

I've swapped out my old rudder pedals for some TPRs as well. 

If someone has one handy, can they please chuck up the dimensions of the canopy jettison handle.

Cheers,

Mumbles

 

Thanks for the link to the RWR! I hadn't seen that before. I haven't begun looking for proper screens for the VDI or HSD yet but what I have done is use older iPads as monitors using SpaceDesk (free app), just for the VDI and HSD. I was just hoping that when I got to the point of making the instrument panel housings that the iPads I have would fit.

Can you share a link to the 5x5 screen you found for the VDI?

 

I found these a while back. I'm not using them but thought I'd share for anyone not wanting to start from scratch. https://www.printables.com/@DX6_393740/models

[AusMumbles]

Heya Peeps,

Got a bit more done today on the right instrument panel housing and frame. 

It's starting to actually look kinda cool. (I know the sticks wrong, yet to order a VKB stick).